Light vs Dark - SBVA

[Philippa]

Just to play devil's advocate, if you beat all arguments then that ends it too.

[Mecha]

someone should host another one of these, the drama is great.

[Avalanche]

Just sent my rumble line up, let's see who wins now in bizarro world.

There IS something wrong with a  2 Moros blades stacked in each other, however.

What I saw, they weren't stacked, rather placed right next to each other...

I dunno how 09 interpreted "stapled together" as "stacked inside each other", but yeah, all I did was make the bar thicker, I didn't think it would be this big a deal

Sorry man, my bad. I thought by stapled you mean't stacked, plus it looked only one bar thick to me, guess I have bad eyes or something.

"So making a flipper as powerful as one would be IRL is OP now" Yes, this is RA2 not real life, and besides, if we're going on that argument, what the hell kind of IRL flipper uses 3 pistons simultaneously? The problem here is that Paladin, while being cool looking enough to class as IRL, is on the verge of becoming tryhard. If this sort of 3 burst flipper was done by somebody less skilled (i'll ignore flipster because the fact is his swing arc on the flippers are very short, so it's not too powerful in practice), people would flip their sh**. And when Baconus built a 3 piston hammer bot, Badger did.

First of all, it's called "IRL" for a reason, so it does make some sense for it to be somewhat powerful. Next, I personally see nothing wrong if the bot is a bit tryhard when it looks dope. Obviously if someone is entering some butt ugly flipper that looked it came out of Battlebots that had 4 long bursts, then maybe. Also by saying you will "ignore Flipster" you are basically just cherry picking now to fit your argument dude.

"Also, I'm fairly sure armour plates have the exact if not better stats that skirts so it's probably for the best he used skirts." That wasn't what I was referring to. I was referring to Demon complaining about Badger using skirt/metal hinges with small wedges on, but I said that I had no issue with that. Context, 09, context.

My bad then, small wedges really aren't skirts though.

"Oh, and there's nothing un-IRL about slow and powerful flipper, mate." No. No there isn't. Precisely what is your point here? Sounds to me like you're running out of ideas for your copypasta, showing that your argument is not well founded. At all. Because i haven't mentioned this even once: My problem is with the 3 bursts, which is just dancing on the lines between IRL,Tryhard IRL and DSL-S imo. If a worse builder built a 3 burst flipper, people would be all over him.

My point is there really isn't any problem with the bot, as you said with the first line. On top of that, trying to use "3 bursts" as a reason just bad, since all different sizes of bursts have a different amount of power. For example, 3 Medium VDMA's used on his bot have a combine powered of 540 (180 each) while a bot using 2 Large bursts has a total power of 600 (300 each). So yeah, him using 3 smaller bursts is actually to your advantage, as there is less power and 3 burst motors need more batteries than just 2.

"Sounds like people just got E X P O S E D for trying to get ez wins with a HS" Oh please. The irony of this is shocking: is the name Solaris ringing any bloody bells?  You've literally got no point here, because your own team has won this tournament through usage of a 3 burst flipper with large arcs to maximize power, as well as using a Tombclone HS, in a arena where flippers were meant to have a hard time to flip robots out. It's almost as if nobody was expecting flippers, so Badger (and TGM, but he limited his swing arc like a proper lad) decided to get "ez wins with a" overly powerful flipper.

Not sure how it's ironic that my team got wins with a HS, the whole point of the statement was it's dumb for people to get upset at a flipper because they entered wedgeless HS and got flipped OOTA because of that. As for the "arena where flippers were mean't to have a hard time to flip robots out" part, Paladin wasn't flipping stuff acrossed the arena in the first 10 seconds and OOTA unlike my GTMC bot for example. Hell, it didn't even manage to flip you OOTA in a min, instead your bot got caught in the rails. Not sure why someone should be punished because they went for the unexpected and took advantage that nobody bother to build a counter. Finally, first you said the Swing Arc wasn't that big of a deal compared to the skirts, but now it seems to be your main arguing point against it.

Wow. Impressive mathematics. This would seal your argument: Had you not missed the fact that the large beaters are not meant to deal damage, and are used to hold on the spike strips. They are literally right at the back of the jaw: they 'd barely scratch somebody's wedge if lucky. And also I was only referring to the spike strips in my argument, so this makes all of your calculations inherently unbalanced.

No, Jamied said they were used as extenders. The reason he used them, presumably, was that in the case that many of the spike strips were lost, he could try and ram with the beaters instead. but they aren't at the front of the bot: they are right at the back of the jaw where it's much more likely CS will end up stopping the robot with the part of the strips at the back, and where they won't get a flail boost.

I'm sorry man, but this is now just cherry picking. It doesn't matter if Jamied intended them to just hold the spike strips, they are still weapons and will do damage after the same spike strips you called fragile fell off. Double Layer weapon setups like that have been commonplace since you and me joined and have proved very effective many times over as after your first set of weapons fell off, you had another full set at full HP to clean up the other dudes damaged weapons. I'm not sure why you are trying to argue weapon setups against someone who has more experience anyways. BTW for future bot building help, flails don't boost concussion at all, so a concussion weapon like a beater wouldn't get any boost from the flail.

I'm not even going to congratulate you for the victory, to be honest. You won through the luck of the draw: our team had no flippers, you did. You just scraped by with a close decision over MITP, and if JP or Executioner hadn't lost, we could have taken this tournament.

Dude, you could've just said GG everybody but now it really does look like you are just upset at the result of the tourney and basically giving Badger ammo.
Also remember who said the tourney was basically luck in the first place..........

You see, the problem is there is not that much "strategy" involved, and this mainly comes down to luck 

But yeah, this thing could have easily gone the other way. I will say though IMO it was a big risk to send out 3 of your heaviest hitters into R1, and luckily Challenge managed to get a win over Jungle Fever which really helped my team in the long run, as Jungle Fever was probably going to be the hardest to flip and as you said yourself, the best bet you had against Paladin.

Well, somebody thinks they're a big shot, don't they? You mean your TEAM won a tournament. Don't let this TEAM victory go to your head. It's a team victory because Paladin and Challenge took out the robots that could have annihilated you (Executioner, JP) before you got involved. I'll see you in the challenge board once I finish up with TheRoboteer. (Though Solaris was an excellent first entrant, I must add. But talking sh** this early in your time on GTM? Yeah, i'm going to enjoy beating you.)

I mean, his comment was kinda uncalled for, but if anything, Paladin and his bot Solaris really carried the team as a I screwed up and sent out Hitler R1 instead of Axe questions. Nothing wrong with the new dude giving out somes bantz after his first tourney win anyways.

And you missed the point yet again: I was saying that those robots were bad by your impossibly high standards: Killshot's alright with some neat wheelguards, and a cool, sleek finish, but could do with more colour. Challenge is actually quite good with the way the weapon supports were made. AQL isn't absolute cancer, but it's not the best. Solaris is really cool but needs skin work done.

And you missed the point when I literally said " The "How about you consider" was just supposed to be an edited Copypasta tier of your post and not mean't to be taken that seriously" 

Yeah you shouldn't host an IRL tournament if you don't know what IRL means.

Everybody knows your are upset you lost/at me/at Badger, but taking it out on the host now is literally the dumbest thing you could possible do dude, which finally leds me to.

*reply to Badgers flame bait*

Alright dude, you, me,and basically everybody else knows you are on your LAST chance on theses forums, you have been banned twice for reasons similar to this (For example, your first ban from which was just replying to Badger's flamebait). By now you should know better than to reply to that kinda of stuff. On top of that, there is your posts towards Neon and Gulden. If you really want to stay on these forums and not get banned, I highly suggest you just stop what you have been doing in this thread, The mods don't care if you want to just "prove them wrong" or w/e, what they care about is if you are actually going to behave for once.

This is my last reply to this drama, as I think I have made myself pretty clear in this post what I mean't.

I have a response that beats all arguments here, but for the sake of ending the argument and avoiding a ban, i'll shut up. But don't take this as any confirmation of you "winning" the argument, take this as me being held back.

nigga you just need to take this L we lost, get over it

My issues go beyond that at this point.

Just to play devil's advocate, if you beat all arguments then that ends it too.

i think i'd get banned before 09 concedes my point in all honesty. I'd rather I didn't get banned, thanks. 

[Philippa]

Don't worry, you probably won't be around for a whole lot longer anyway.

Would this tournament work with 3/4 teams at all?

[Badger]

Just sent my rumble line up, let's see who wins now in bizarro world.

There IS something wrong with a  2 Moros blades stacked in each other, however.

What I saw, they weren't stacked, rather placed right next to each other...

I dunno how 09 interpreted "stapled together" as "stacked inside each other", but yeah, all I did was make the bar thicker, I didn't think it would be this big a deal

Sorry man, my bad. I thought by stapled you mean't stacked, plus it looked only one bar thick to me, guess I have bad eyes or something.

"So making a flipper as powerful as one would be IRL is OP now" Yes, this is RA2 not real life, and besides, if we're going on that argument, what the hell kind of IRL flipper uses 3 pistons simultaneously? The problem here is that Paladin, while being cool looking enough to class as IRL, is on the verge of becoming tryhard. If this sort of 3 burst flipper was done by somebody less skilled (i'll ignore flipster because the fact is his swing arc on the flippers are very short, so it's not too powerful in practice), people would flip their sh**. And when Baconus built a 3 piston hammer bot, Badger did.

First of all, it's called "IRL" for a reason, so it does make some sense for it to be somewhat powerful. Next, I personally see nothing wrong if the bot is a bit tryhard when it looks dope. Obviously if someone is entering some butt ugly flipper that looked it came out of Battlebots that had 4 long bursts, then maybe. Also by saying you will "ignore Flipster" you are basically just cherry picking now to fit your argument dude.

"Also, I'm fairly sure armour plates have the exact if not better stats that skirts so it's probably for the best he used skirts." That wasn't what I was referring to. I was referring to Demon complaining about Badger using skirt/metal hinges with small wedges on, but I said that I had no issue with that. Context, 09, context.

My bad then, small wedges really aren't skirts though.

"Oh, and there's nothing un-IRL about slow and powerful flipper, mate." No. No there isn't. Precisely what is your point here? Sounds to me like you're running out of ideas for your copypasta, showing that your argument is not well founded. At all. Because i haven't mentioned this even once: My problem is with the 3 bursts, which is just dancing on the lines between IRL,Tryhard IRL and DSL-S imo. If a worse builder built a 3 burst flipper, people would be all over him.

My point is there really isn't any problem with the bot, as you said with the first line. On top of that, trying to use "3 bursts" as a reason just bad, since all different sizes of bursts have a different amount of power. For example, 3 Medium VDMA's used on his bot have a combine powered of 540 (180 each) while a bot using 2 Large bursts has a total power of 600 (300 each). So yeah, him using 3 smaller bursts is actually to your advantage, as there is less power and 3 burst motors need more batteries than just 2.

"Sounds like people just got E X P O S E D for trying to get ez wins with a HS" Oh please. The irony of this is shocking: is the name Solaris ringing any bloody bells?  You've literally got no point here, because your own team has won this tournament through usage of a 3 burst flipper with large arcs to maximize power, as well as using a Tombclone HS, in a arena where flippers were meant to have a hard time to flip robots out. It's almost as if nobody was expecting flippers, so Badger (and TGM, but he limited his swing arc like a proper lad) decided to get "ez wins with a" overly powerful flipper.

Not sure how it's ironic that my team got wins with a HS, the whole point of the statement was it's dumb for people to get upset at a flipper because they entered wedgeless HS and got flipped OOTA because of that. As for the "arena where flippers were mean't to have a hard time to flip robots out" part, Paladin wasn't flipping stuff acrossed the arena in the first 10 seconds and OOTA unlike my GTMC bot for example. Hell, it didn't even manage to flip you OOTA in a min, instead your bot got caught in the rails. Not sure why someone should be punished because they went for the unexpected and took advantage that nobody bother to build a counter. Finally, first you said the Swing Arc wasn't that big of a deal compared to the skirts, but now it seems to be your main arguing point against it.

Wow. Impressive mathematics. This would seal your argument: Had you not missed the fact that the large beaters are not meant to deal damage, and are used to hold on the spike strips. They are literally right at the back of the jaw: they 'd barely scratch somebody's wedge if lucky. And also I was only referring to the spike strips in my argument, so this makes all of your calculations inherently unbalanced.

No, Jamied said they were used as extenders. The reason he used them, presumably, was that in the case that many of the spike strips were lost, he could try and ram with the beaters instead. but they aren't at the front of the bot: they are right at the back of the jaw where it's much more likely CS will end up stopping the robot with the part of the strips at the back, and where they won't get a flail boost.

I'm sorry man, but this is now just cherry picking. It doesn't matter if Jamied intended them to just hold the spike strips, they are still weapons and will do damage after the same spike strips you called fragile fell off. Double Layer weapon setups like that have been commonplace since you and me joined and have proved very effective many times over as after your first set of weapons fell off, you had another full set at full HP to clean up the other dudes damaged weapons. I'm not sure why you are trying to argue weapon setups against someone who has more experience anyways. BTW for future bot building help, flails don't boost concussion at all, so a concussion weapon like a beater wouldn't get any boost from the flail.

I'm not even going to congratulate you for the victory, to be honest. You won through the luck of the draw: our team had no flippers, you did. You just scraped by with a close decision over MITP, and if JP or Executioner hadn't lost, we could have taken this tournament.

Dude, you could've just said GG everybody but now it really does look like you are just upset at the result of the tourney and basically giving Badger ammo.
Also remember who said the tourney was basically luck in the first place..........

You see, the problem is there is not that much "strategy" involved, and this mainly comes down to luck 

But yeah, this thing could have easily gone the other way. I will say though IMO it was a big risk to send out 3 of your heaviest hitters into R1, and luckily Challenge managed to get a win over Jungle Fever which really helped my team in the long run, as Jungle Fever was probably going to be the hardest to flip and as you said yourself, the best bet you had against Paladin.

Well, somebody thinks they're a big shot, don't they? You mean your TEAM won a tournament. Don't let this TEAM victory go to your head. It's a team victory because Paladin and Challenge took out the robots that could have annihilated you (Executioner, JP) before you got involved. I'll see you in the challenge board once I finish up with TheRoboteer. (Though Solaris was an excellent first entrant, I must add. But talking sh** this early in your time on GTM? Yeah, i'm going to enjoy beating you.)

I mean, his comment was kinda uncalled for, but if anything, Paladin and his bot Solaris really carried the team as a I screwed up and sent out Hitler R1 instead of Axe questions. Nothing wrong with the new dude giving out somes bantz after his first tourney win anyways.

And you missed the point yet again: I was saying that those robots were bad by your impossibly high standards: Killshot's alright with some neat wheelguards, and a cool, sleek finish, but could do with more colour. Challenge is actually quite good with the way the weapon supports were made. AQL isn't absolute cancer, but it's not the best. Solaris is really cool but needs skin work done.

And you missed the point when I literally said " The "How about you consider" was just supposed to be an edited Copypasta tier of your post and not mean't to be taken that seriously" 

Yeah you shouldn't host an IRL tournament if you don't know what IRL means.

Everybody knows your are upset you lost/at me/at Badger, but taking it out on the host now is literally the dumbest thing you could possible do dude, which finally leds me to.

*reply to Badgers flame bait*

Alright dude, you, me,and basically everybody else knows you are on your LAST chance on theses forums, you have been banned twice for reasons similar to this (For example, your first ban from which was just replying to Badger's flamebait). By now you should know better than to reply to that kinda of stuff. On top of that, there is your posts towards Neon and Gulden. If you really want to stay on these forums and not get banned, I highly suggest you just stop what you have been doing in this thread, The mods don't care if you want to just "prove them wrong" or w/e, what they care about is if you are actually going to behave for once.

This is my last reply to this drama, as I think I have made myself pretty clear in this post what I mean't.

I have a response that beats all arguments here, but for the sake of ending the argument and avoiding a ban, i'll shut up. But don't take this as any confirmation of you "winning" the argument, take this as me being held back.

You should give us that response since you haven't said anything remotely convincing yet 

Anyway thanks for the tournament Gulden; neat mechanic and very fast uploads. Hopefully we get light vs dark pt. 2 at some point!

[090901]

Anyway thanks for the tournament Gulden; neat mechanic and very fast uploads. Hopefully we get light vs dark pt. 2 at some point!

Idea for Light vs Dark 2. Have two people be voted captains, and then they "draft" the bots that will make up the team, I think that would make it a lot more interesting.

[Gulden]

Would this tournament work with 3/4 teams at all?

I think so if you do rumbles.
You could also do 2 1v1 battles with 1 team battling each time.

Anyway thanks for the tournament Gulden; neat mechanic and very fast uploads. Hopefully we get light vs dark pt. 2 at some point!

Thanks. I was thinking if I supplied too many uploads at once I might overwhelm someone.  Glad to see it was good for ye.
As for pt 2.  I'm contemplating whether to do it immediately after this or after a different tournament.

My current next idea is DSL-S Beetleweights.

Idea for Light vs Dark 2. Have two people be voted captains, and then they "draft" the bots that will make up the team, I think that would make it a lot more interesting.

Captains before sign-ups, then everyone builds the captain's dream team...
My question is how will we keep the teams secret.
Cus honestly...

Baconus_Yum: Executioner:2

Avalanche: Fighter Mk II.:8

Time to put the past behind us and work together.

Agreed, as long as your robot isn't absolute fecal matter. Though I honestly do hope you've inproved.

This was a great moment.


P.S. Still waiting on Demon so we can do the team rumble.

[Dreamcast]

someone should host another one of these, the drama is great.

Remember that you can rip off this tournament.

[jdg37]

Anyway thanks for the tournament Gulden; neat mechanic and very fast uploads. Hopefully we get light vs dark pt. 2 at some point!

Idea for Light vs Dark 2. Have two people be voted captains, and then they "draft" the bots that will make up the team, I think that would make it a lot more interesting.

I tried to suggest it. Give it the Ultimate Fighter team combat structure. Team A gets first draft, team B makes first matchup. Winning team controls matchups.

[NeonCalypso]

Solaris vs Fighter MK II, Let's get over it Avalanche.

[Gulden]

Got a rumble right here

And Paladin doesn't give a f*ck about anyone, holy bajeez!  Did I mention friendly fire was ON!

Team Dark got completely wiped out!

If only Paladin didn't lag my game so much, then this tournament would've been so much easier.

Next will be the all bot rumble.
I must praise my lord and savior RNJesus, so I will tribute this rumble to him.
Also because there's a single winner in the All bot rumble.  Not teams.

[Avalanche]

So the 3 burst flipper defeats the enemy team because they all didn't have wedges.
What a ****ing surprise. Greatest robot of all time, clearly. /s

Not sure why Badger's too proud of himself for making this travesty.

[Shield]

So the 3 burst flipper defeats the enemy team because they all didn't have wedges.
What a ****ing surprise. Greatest robot of all time, clearly. /s

Not sure why Badger's too proud of himself for making this travesty.

can you like maybe stop

everyone's having fun with this. if you want a real competitive tourney, Kurt's Master of Disaster is still open for signups iirc

[Avalanche]

So the 3 burst flipper defeats the enemy team because they all didn't have wedges.
What a ****ing surprise. Greatest robot of all time, clearly. /s

Not sure why Badger's too proud of himself for making this travesty.

can you like maybe stop

everyone's having fun with this. if you want a real competitive tourney, Kurt's Master of Disaster is still open for signups iirc

oh I was having fun, then this tryhard 3 flipper BS came along. And no, I don't want a competitive tourney, I'd like an actual IRL one like this was supposed to be.

[Badger]

So the 3 burst flipper defeats the enemy team because they all didn't have wedges.
What a ****ing surprise. Greatest robot of all time, clearly. /s

Not sure why Badger's too proud of himself for making this travesty.

:>

Don't worry about kix's 3 burst flipper, or the fact that it got outwedged by a static wedge.

Maybe if you understood that I only used 3 bursts in order to get the proper width for the flipping plate, and that the number of bursts is literally 100% irrelevant anyway, you wouldn't be so salty.

[Mr. AS]

for the sake of ending the argument and avoiding a ban, i'll shut up

So the 3 burst flipper defeats the enemy team because they all didn't have wedges.
What a ****ing surprise. Greatest robot of all time, clearly. /s

Not sure why Badger's too proud of himself for making this travesty.

Things that make you go

Hmmmmmm...

[Avalanche]

So the 3 burst flipper defeats the enemy team because they all didn't have wedges.
What a ****ing surprise. Greatest robot of all time, clearly. /s

Not sure why Badger's too proud of himself for making this travesty.

:>

Don't worry about kix's 3 burst flipper (which had a small burst arc that meant that it was not as overpowered as paladin), or the fact that it got outwedged by a static wedge (because it flipped and lifted itself up, not proving anything about wedges? And besides, MITP got thrown out soon after anyways, so your "outwedging" point is invalid).

Maybe if you understood that I only used 3 bursts in order to get the proper width for the flipping plate (extenders exist, use them) , and that the number of bursts is literally 100% irrelevant anyway (No. No it isn't. You don't see real robots with 3 simultaneous pistons. It's not IRL, and it's tryhard. Kix just gets a pass because he made his robot weak in other ways, such as having a short swing arc and being very easy to damage.), you wouldn't be so salty.

for the sake of ending the argument and avoiding a ban, i'll shut up

So the 3 burst flipper defeats the enemy team because they all didn't have wedges.
What a ****ing surprise. Greatest robot of all time, clearly. /s

Not sure why Badger's too proud of himself for making this travesty.

Things that make you go

Hmmmmmm...

He's deliberately giving me sh** via PM, so at this point I don't care. I'm not going to have this sh** happen again and again: I raised a perfectly good point, and in return he and 09 decided to talk sh**.

[09090901]

k yall may wanna quell the sh**talking now

srs tho let's try to keep flames down. Throwing a lil shade at each other is in the nature of the tournament and is fine, but let's try not to bait each other just to get a rise out of certain users.

again

Anymore and this thread's getting a lock for a cleanup with warnings.

[Badger]

I raised a perfectly good point

[Mecha]

can you two stop now it isn't even funny anymore