Author Topic: Robots Types (Read 12070 times)

System32 · « **Reply #40 on:** February 27, 2010, 04:41:25 PM »

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biological_classification#Taxonomic_ranks

I posted a wikipedia link. Your argument is Invalid.

I agree in the extent of this Sub-sub-type style, but in irony I do think we also need to set boundaries. Wheel size, batteries and weapon types aren't going to justify a new bot type, but the design in total, the way it draws the unsuspecting victim into it's claws, the way it removes the wheels from the morors and slides the opponent into the red like a stream flowing downhill, the beauty of the violence and energy... That is what defines a bot. Not what it uses to drive, how it kills.

A HS can have Catching plows, and it is still a HS. When the motors are chained with more motors, it becomes a chained HS. You see?

SKBT · « **Reply #41 on:** February 27, 2010, 05:04:49 PM »

Correct me if I am wrong.

Why don't you all follow real robot classifications.

Wedge
Lifter
Popup could be lifter
Flipper
Flipper
Spinner
Sheck Spinner
Vertical
Horizantal
FBS
Thwack
SNS

SNS seems more like a fighting tactic than a robot type. Just me though. I have always called them thwacks. Never heard of SnS untill I came here.

System32 · « **Reply #42 on:** February 27, 2010, 05:10:57 PM »

SnS are bots with 2 or more static arms of weapons. Thwackers have only one arm of weapons.

Then you get the trinity variations (Who have piston extenders for more reach and damage)
and Melty brain versions (That usualy have one wheel and a lot of weapons.)

there are no such thing as HSSnS because they are hybrids like HS/FS Rammer/HS and Hammer/Rammer bots.

Sage · « **Reply #43 on:** February 27, 2010, 05:51:12 PM »

People just have a need to know what to call a robot. I don't know what you're getting at here. You want it to be like this?

"YO I made an HS with 24 spikes!"

"Yea, well mine has 36 spikes!"

"But mine is a chained HS"

"What the

is a chained HS? an HS is an HS no matter what! And so mine is better cause it has more spikes!"

^Obviously it's just an example, but really. We are not, as S32 pointed out, changing bot types by looking at which type of wheels someone has. We need sub-categories so that when someone does a tourney prediction or something of that sort, they can say: "It's the only angled VS in the tournament!" instead of "It's the only bot like itself in the tourney. Well, there are more VS in this tourney, but since we don't have subcategories I can't tell you what it is."

It's not overly complicated. Most sub-categories apply to a lot of bots. But just like the world needed to do for biology, we need to integrate a regulated taxonomic rank into this forum. KISS (Keep It Simple Stupid) doesn't apply here.

Clickbeetle · « **Reply #44 on:** February 27, 2010, 06:16:29 PM »

Quote from: System32 on February 27, 2010, 04:41:25 PM

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biological_classification#Taxonomic_ranks

Beat me to it!

I think bot classifications are actually a lot like biological classification. For most people (this is R0B0 here), saying something is "a bee" or "a click beetle" is enough. There are a lot of different types of bees and click beetles, but you don't need to care about all the little differences.

But for scientists (this is Naryar and Sage here) everything has to be broken down as far as possible. If you see a bee you want to know what species it is. For some reason, humans have an innate need to categorize everything they encounter. It's useful if you need to know if said bee is an invasive exotic species, or if it can sting you, or if you need to know if a different bee is a new species, but usually the species differences are trivial.

On that note, I wonder what it would look like if we made an evolutionary tree of bot designs.

Some bots obviously evolved from others, like flippers->popops->true popups. But others are more confusing. Did jugglers come from HS's, or from popups? And what would the ancestor of all bots be?

40757 · « **Reply #45 on:** February 27, 2010, 07:14:12 PM »

Quote from: Clickbeetle

Some bots obviously evolved from others, like flippers->popops->true popups. But others are more confusing. Did jugglers come from HS's, or from popups? And what would the ancestor of all bots be?

Funny you mention that because I was considering making one.

R0B0SH4RK · « **Reply #46 on:** February 28, 2010, 01:59:05 AM »

I'll continue this debate when I can piece together a coherent argument. Right now, I'm a jittery nervous mess about the Canada vs. USA game tomorrow.

System32 · « **Reply #47 on:** February 28, 2010, 04:57:46 AM »

@Click: Tried the tree before. Shot down brutally and violently by Inf. He hates me...

Naryar · « **Reply #48 on:** March 03, 2010, 07:43:51 AM »

Quote from: Clickbeetle on February 27, 2010, 06:16:29 PM

And what would the ancestor of all bots be?

A chassis.

Anyways, I'll try and come up with a tree.

Reier · « **Reply #49 on:** March 03, 2010, 04:04:31 PM »

Goooooooooood grief this is a bunch of crud. You guys are making this waaaay to clomplex.
But if it was me it'd be:

HS
VS
(Drum?)
FS
Rammer
Pusher (Slower rammer)
Hammer
SnS/thwackbots/FBS are in same category called "SnS".
Popup ("True" and the "normal" kind)
Flipper
Juggler
Poker
Crawler (Robot with weapons instead of wheels)

Hybrids contain one or more of the above, IE SnS/HS or Pusher/VS. Chained robots are just in the category like before, IE Chained VSs are just called VSs. "Chained" is an adjective, not a title IMO.

Sage · « **Reply #50 on:** March 03, 2010, 04:35:08 PM »

Juggler?

Reier · « **Reply #51 on:** March 03, 2010, 04:36:56 PM »

Oh yeah, Juggler/TS is in there too.

40757 · « **Reply #52 on:** March 03, 2010, 05:13:02 PM »

Uhh... how's this?

Overview
Weaponry
Bot Type
Subgroup
Misc.

Robot
Rotating Weaponry
Vertical Spinner
Wedge 'N Grind
Full Body Vertical Spinner
Drum
Full Body Drum
Flailing Vertical Spinner
[All under Vertical Spinner]
Big 'N High
Full Body Vertical Spinner
Drum
Full Body Drum
Flailing Vertical Spinner
[All under Vertical Spinner]
Horizontal Spinner
Complex Horizontal Spinner
Tiny Trinity
Flyer [See Other]
Full Body Spinner
Sit 'n Spin
Flailing Horizontal Spinner
[All Under Horizontal Spinner]
Top Spinner
Juggler
Bottom Spinner
Trapper
Face Spinner
Angled Spinner
Burst
Hammer
Full Body Hammer
Side Hammer
Flailing Hammer
[All under Hammer]
Popup
True Popup
Side Popup
Inverted Popup
Flipper
Rupter
Full Body Flipper
Fire
Poker
Stilts
Gut Ripper [May Contain Other Types]
Popup
Wedged Horizontal Spinner
Vertical Spinner
Face Spinner
Other
Crawler
Bumble Ball
Rammer
Poker
Pusher
Wammer
Walker
Shuffler
Trapper
Dust Pan
Flyer
Hybrids
Hybrids
[Vary Greatly]

Reier · « **Reply #53 on:** March 03, 2010, 05:16:09 PM »

Can you say "long"?

40757 · « **Reply #54 on:** March 03, 2010, 05:17:15 PM »

I included anything I could think of to make it as specific as possible (except for that MBsns or whatever the

that is because there's honestly nothing different about those).

R0B0SH4RK · « **Reply #55 on:** March 03, 2010, 05:33:39 PM »

I'm guessing that this is as good a time as any to jump back in to this debate.

Anyways, I never said that I did not agree with categorizing. Should there be taxonomic ranking for bot types? Of course there should be. I never said that distinctions were not there in certain sub-categories. You know as well as I do, Sage, that I could not look you in the eye and tell you that a chained HS is the same as a HS. They're not. But, what you guys are doing is looking for distinctions that simply are not there. And since biology seems to be a popular analogy here, allow me to take a stab at it.

For simplicity's sake, let's say that Stock robots are elephants, and there are two main bot types: HS (Asian elephants) and Gut-Rippers (African elephants). Let's focus on the African elephant branch. Here, we have certain sub-categories - let's call popups Bush Elephants and jugglers Forest Elephants. Right now, everybody is happy. I'm happy, because all different types of elephants grouped according to their species and sub-species, and you guys are happy because you have your nice taxonomic rank.

This next part is where we are right now. A scientist (let's call him Dr. Ray Ran) suggests that there is a third sub-species of African elephant (let's say this is a "true" popup). It is exactly the same as the Bush Elephant, except for where it lives (North Africa vs. South Africa). This hypothesis has not been accepted by the scientific community, as it has been determined that the Northern Elephant is not different enough to be considered a seperate species (this part is not an analogy - as far as I can remember, biologists have had this debate).

My point is this: you can make taxonomic rankings, but even the science you have cited to support your claims has had this same discussion and come to my conclusion. There are certain distinctions that just are not there, or are not prominent or important enough to deserve a seperate family (eg: SnS and MBSnS). Just stick to the major differences (Chained and Regular HS are different enough. So are HS and "slow" HS). Focusing on everything minor is just a waste of your time and energy.

Sage · « **Reply #56 on:** March 03, 2010, 05:57:01 PM »

Well, i was just trying to distinguis between an FBS and a SNS. Now that I see the general consensus for FBS is a bot where the chassis moves, but the bot stays still, why is it call FBS.py?

kill343gs · « **Reply #57 on:** March 03, 2010, 08:20:15 PM »

I remember the good old days when a popup was just a popup and a juggler was just a juggler, not a "true popup" or a "false popup (the popup is a lie!)" or even a "top spinner"... A rammer was a bot that rammed and a piston rammer was a bot that rammed with a piston...

Basically, you guys can have your fun with your superscientific list, but let's not yell at people that mistake a true popup for a regular popup anymore... (I still don't know the difference, and I don't really care to know)

Jack Daniels · « **Reply #58 on:** March 03, 2010, 08:42:50 PM »

We could simplify the whole thing and just call them all robots.

R0B0SH4RK · « **Reply #59 on:** March 03, 2010, 10:24:21 PM »

Quote from: Sage on March 03, 2010, 05:57:01 PM

Well, i was just trying to distinguis between an FBS and a SNS. Now that I see the general consensus for FBS is a bot where the chassis moves, but the bot stays still, why is it call FBS.py?

To be honest, I have no idea. It should be SnS.py if you ask me...