gametechmods

Robot Arena => Discussion => Topic started by: Scrap Daddy on July 01, 2011, 11:17:24 AM

Title: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Scrap Daddy on July 01, 2011, 11:17:24 AM
About three years ago, I was messing around with a Backyard Ripper rebuild when all of a sudden I was able to stack things wherever I wanted.

finally a weird glitch I might have discovered. While messing around with a Backyard Ripper upgrade I was able to do this. For about 20 seconds I was able to put anything in anything.
(https://gametechmods.com/uploads/images/57903aaa.png)
I did that months before I ever posted it since I wanted to see what a few other members thought about it. None of them responded back to me so I ended up forgetting about it.


Apparently, Pyscolone discovered the same things as I did, but was never able to get it to happen 100% of the time

not really much to say until I find a surefire way for it to work 100% of the time.
Well, I did. After about an hour of fooling around with the glitch, I got it to work whenever I wanted it to. That resulted in some crazy never before seen stacking.
(https://gametechmods.com/uploads/images/67127stacking4.png)
The best thing about it? 100% done in the botlab and technically "legal".


Before anyone says anything like "this is just the zero glitch" or "this was discovered a while ago", no. Thyrus rediscovered the Zero Glitch a while back and posted about it here:


https://gametechmods.com/forums/index.php/topic,4070.msg158239.html#msg158239 (https://gametechmods.com/forums/index.php/topic,4070.msg158239.html#msg158239)


and here's a few quotes proving the Zero glitch isn't really legal in the first place since it uses a custom component.



It is the Zero Glitch and as such has already been included in the rules with that name or under the category of text file editing.

it\'s just stacking?


and yes, the zero glitch was very good. but it isn\'t STOCK. it needs additional parts from outside the game (it\'s what i called text raping, he discovered it, i just perfected it, and made it smaller) i used to use it when testing concepts, to check if they work, it\'s not so good for much else.
The Zero glitch involves editing a snapper motor and making a custom component, whereas this glitch is done completely in game.


From there, I taught Sage how to execute the glitch and we began brainstorming how we could use it to its full extent. After an hour of experimentation, we found out that there were a few quirks that made the amount of stacking limited. After about another hour, we threw those quirks out the window and were now able to stack nearly any component into anything.


FOR EXAMPLE:
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Sage on July 01, 2011, 11:18:13 AM
PRESENTING GOD MODE

(https://gametechmods.com/forums/../uploads/images/81209screenshot_41.jpg)
(https://gametechmods.com/forums/../uploads/images/59954screenshot_42.jpg)
(https://gametechmods.com/forums/../uploads/images/96710screenshot_43.jpg)


DSA, 2 Blacks, HPZ drive, 36 Irons, 3 Maces.

6HPZ motors, 2 Blacks, and a control board all stacked in one spot. Took like 30 minutes to wire it >.>
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Scrap Daddy on July 01, 2011, 11:18:25 AM
As you can see, the glitch is ridiculously overpowered and Sage and I have decided we won't be releasing it to the public. If we were to release it, we might as well make BFE and AAM legal as well and call it the end of stock. The glitch is done completely in the botlab and doesn't use any custom components in which lies the problem. Technically, it is legal for any Stock tournament and just as fair as regular stacking, but extremely cheap and hopefully will never be released.

After 8 years of RA2 being released we are still finding new glitches. Amazing, right?

-Scrap & Sage
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Vertigo on July 01, 2011, 11:23:05 AM
wow
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Sparkey98 on July 01, 2011, 11:24:21 AM
Well scrap and sage, you just invented RA3. congratulations.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: cephalopod on July 01, 2011, 11:25:59 AM
Wow indeed.

Well done guys, and also well done on the choice to not release it, I may not like Stock but that'd be the final nail in the coffin for it.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Vertigo on July 01, 2011, 11:26:11 AM
Well scrap and sage, you just invented RA3. congratulations.
No they didn't, as you can see, it is plainly RA2

Anyway, I totally agree about not releasing this, providing you don't use this glitch yourselves :P
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: MassimoV on July 01, 2011, 11:27:04 AM
That's ridiculous!!
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Urjak on July 01, 2011, 11:27:40 AM
From what I understand, this is the zero glitch (or the glitch that allows for stacking to be done without limit), its just that no one ever discovered how to activate it reliably. The zero glitch was known of long before that custom snapper glitch.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: RpJk on July 01, 2011, 11:28:47 AM
How do you do it?
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Vertigo on July 01, 2011, 11:29:39 AM
How do you do it?
*facepalm*

They aren't going to tell you :P
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: cephalopod on July 01, 2011, 11:30:38 AM
It says up there it's not the Zero glitch, as that needs a custom component, this one doesn't.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: kill343gs on July 01, 2011, 11:31:05 AM
you guys just broke everything
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: RpJk on July 01, 2011, 11:31:16 AM
Well thats all I can do. Will you ever say how to do it?
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Squirrel_Monkey on July 01, 2011, 11:31:43 AM
But how can we tell if Sage or Scrap do it?
(Not saying they will but we must surely take precautions)
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Sage on July 01, 2011, 11:33:50 AM
From what I understand, this is the zero glitch (or the glitch that allows for stacking to be done without limit), its just that no one ever discovered how to activate it reliably.

Zero Glitch and ZeroG glitch are different. This is the ZeroG glitch, named by pyscolone, but because he didn't discover how to do it, we reserve the right to name it.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Urjak on July 01, 2011, 11:39:36 AM
Zero Glitch and ZeroG glitch are different.


The difference is what exactly?
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Sparkey98 on July 01, 2011, 11:43:40 AM
If we can just figure out how to mod the game so it always does this.........Combine it with Restocked and a new UI..........





We just might have an Ra3!



Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: cephalopod on July 01, 2011, 11:46:30 AM
It says up there it's not the Zero glitch, as that needs a custom component, this one doesn't.
Nah, that's the Zero-G glitch.


'and here's a few quotes proving the Zero glitch isn't really legal in the first place since it uses a custom component.'


I so confused D: XD
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Urjak on July 01, 2011, 11:46:41 AM
We just might have an Ra3!


What, a game where people can stack anything anytime? Doesn't sound all that fun to me (especially if you plan to call it RA3, as that name carries some series expectations of physics and AI improvement, as well as far superior component design).
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Sparkey98 on July 01, 2011, 11:47:15 AM
We just might have an Ra3!


What, a game where people can stack anything anytime? Doesn't sound all that fun to me (especially if you plan to call it RA3, as that name carries some series expectations of physics and AI improvement, as well as far superior component design).

It would just be a mod.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: FOTEPX on July 01, 2011, 11:47:39 AM
We just might have an Ra3!


What, a game where people can stack anything anytime? Doesn't sound all that fun to me (especially if you plan to call it RA3, as that name carries some series expectations of physics and AI improvement, as well as far superior component design).

^QFT^
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Resetti's Replicas on July 01, 2011, 11:56:10 AM
Holy heck Sage, that thing's a beaut, I am a sucker for geometry.  Good luck entering stock tourneys in the future though, I can just see a whole bunch of people going "HAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAXX!" 
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Vertigo on July 01, 2011, 12:00:51 PM
Holy heck Sage, that thing's a beaut, I am a sucker for geometry.  Good luck entering stock tourneys in the future though, I can just see a whole bunch of people going "HAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAXX!" 
I'm pretty sure that Sage is decent enough to not enter it
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: NFX on July 01, 2011, 12:07:11 PM
Totally called it. :gawe:

Good decision not to release it, though. It would pretty much be the end of Stock building if everyone could stack anything into anything and there was no need to learn Snapper Loading, Axle Loading, extender setups or anything like that. But well done on making it work. =]
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: RpJk on July 01, 2011, 12:19:16 PM
Totally called it. :gawe:

Good decision not to release it, though. It would pretty much be the end of Stock building if everyone could stack anything into anything and there was no need to learn Snapper Loading, Axle Loading, extender setups or anything like that. But well done on making it work. =]
Well Said now that I think about it.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Sage on July 01, 2011, 01:09:39 PM
It doesn't matter what it was before, it's called Hax mode. Just like the eFFe glitch was named after he found out HOW to do it, Scrap decided to name it because he found out HOW to do it. Hax mode fits it better and there's too much confusion using ZeroG.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Somebody on July 01, 2011, 01:17:37 PM
Thats amazing...
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Thyrus on July 01, 2011, 01:18:24 PM
now that there`s a glitch making stock more unrealistic we need to find one to make DSL even more realistic!  :evilsmile:

edit: yay! scrap rememberd me messing up a stock component :D
 
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Scrap Daddy on July 01, 2011, 01:50:28 PM
You guys are confusing the two glitches. Back when Zero_Absolute showed off the zero glitch he kept how the glitch done secret and thats  when Pyscolone had this happen. He called it the zero gravity glitch and the two names have been confused.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Vertigo on July 01, 2011, 01:58:57 PM
Problem is, people will now ponder forever regarding how you did it :P
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: 123savethewhales on July 01, 2011, 04:10:48 PM
Yes now I can BFE everything in and claim I use this glitch.

Oh wait I don't actually play stock.....

So with this glitch, what's preventing you from exo-stacking your batteries?  Technically you will only need a 1x1 chassis with batteries collision sticking out.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Jack Daniels on July 01, 2011, 04:23:18 PM
Good choice not releasing it to the public.  Neat find!

The big question to me is... Is the glitch allowed in tournaments by default because technically others may discover it later?

If it is done in game and pretty much legal... Does that mean that Sage and Scrap can legally use it for tournament bots even if they are the only ones that know?

I, personally, am totally cool with that.  It is only a matter of time before someone else discovers it and lets the cat out of the bag.  Stocks collapse might follow, or maybe... just maybe... there will be more stock tourneys that simply have the "realistic rule" inserted.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Scorpion on July 01, 2011, 04:26:26 PM
Good choice not releasing it to the public.  Neat find!

The big question to me is... Is the glitch allowed in tournaments by default because technically others may discover it later?

If it is done in game and pretty much legal... Does that mean that Sage and Scrap can legally use it for tournament bots even if they are the only ones that know?

I, personally, am totally cool with that.  It is only a matter of time before someone else discovers it and lets the cat out of the bag.  Stocks collapse might follow, or maybe... just maybe... there will be more stock tourneys that simply have the "realistic rule" inserted.
I agree with this, but I think if whomever  figures it out next tells everybody, or if sage or scrap daddy do a 360 and decide to tell everybody, it'll probably just end up becoming another thing that tourney hosts will say is banned from their tourneys.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: NFX on July 01, 2011, 04:29:27 PM
I think it should be. But that won't really stop people from experimenting with it. It'd just be classed in the same way as unrealism in DSL, would it now?
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: russian roulette on July 01, 2011, 04:49:49 PM
I am on the fence about this, them creating such a useful glitch and not releasing it seems a bit fuzzy. I must say though if this is real, then I happily applaud you. But if this is fake or a joke, then I'll laugh my a** off.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Somebody on July 01, 2011, 05:11:37 PM
It could be regulated to an extent if its ever released, like "no superstacking" where a situation like Sage's bot that he shows would be illegal because it is clearly Hax Mode.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Vertigo on July 01, 2011, 05:14:34 PM
It could be regulated to an extent if its ever released, like "no superstacking" where a situation like Sage's bot that he shows would be illegal because it is clearly Hax Mode.
Yeah, it must go alongside BFE, AAM and ZeroG in tournaments
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Sage on July 01, 2011, 05:17:54 PM
Exostacking is one of the limitations of this glitch... you can't really do that.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Enigm@ on July 01, 2011, 05:33:02 PM
It could be regulated to an extent if its ever released, like "no superstacking" where a situation like Sage's bot that he shows would be illegal because it is clearly Hax Mode.
Then that would defeat the purpose of it. :P
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Urjak on July 01, 2011, 05:38:50 PM
The only thing I kind of don't like about its secrecy is that it would sure be fun to experiment with and build some wacky bots with.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Sage on July 01, 2011, 05:41:16 PM
Yes, it's a ton of fun to mess around with :D
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Scorpion on July 01, 2011, 05:43:57 PM
Yes, it's a ton of fun to mess around with :D
You're a meany...
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Vertigo on July 01, 2011, 05:45:00 PM
Yes, it's a ton of fun to mess around with :D
So cruel :P
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: russian roulette on July 01, 2011, 05:46:56 PM
Yes, it's a ton of fun to mess around with :D
This is definitively fake.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Enigm@ on July 01, 2011, 05:48:15 PM
Yes, it's a ton of fun to mess around with :D
This is definitively fake.
Detective RR, on the case.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Somebody on July 01, 2011, 05:54:36 PM
True it would be a ton of fun...
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Vertigo on July 01, 2011, 06:06:12 PM
Yes, it's a ton of fun to mess around with :D
This is definitively fake.
No it isn't, there have been many others find this glitch, just not figure out how to use it over and over again
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: russian roulette on July 01, 2011, 06:09:26 PM
Yes, it's a ton of fun to mess around with :D
This is definitively fake.
No it isn't, there have been many others find this glitch, just not figure out how to use it over and over again
Sorry, I am just very skeptical with how they worded it saying "No out of game Modifications needed" and how they are almost teasing everyone else out of it.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: J on July 01, 2011, 06:15:40 PM
.....Does this mean we can expect a bunch of "god mode" bots from Sage and Scrap now?
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: NFX on July 01, 2011, 06:23:47 PM
I think their main concern is that it would cause the death of Stock Building by allowing stuff like this. One way around this would be to treat it like the Realistic Rule in DSL. You CAN build undealistic designs in DSL, stuff like Stacking and eFFe glitching, but it's banned in tournaments and competitive building and things. In the same sense, you COULD build using superstacking in Stock, but it would probably be banned in tournaments. Because most people work on legal tournament building concepts, I don't think they'd focus on the superstacking glitch too much, given that they wouldn't actually be able to utilise it very much. I think it's up to Scrap and Sage, though, it's really their call on whether to disclose their secrets or not.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Vertigo on July 01, 2011, 06:31:34 PM
I personally believe that if they do not showcase bots in "GOD MODE" themselves, and do not promote it, in a couple of months this will all be forgotten about and stock will stay unscratched. Releasing this could work, but could potentially bring down stock for good. I see this as too big a risk to take.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Virus Bomb on July 01, 2011, 06:34:24 PM

.
I think their main concern is that it would cause the death of Stock Building by allowing stuff like this. One way around this would be to treat it like the Realistic Rule in DSL. You CAN build undealistic designs in DSL, stuff like Stacking and eFFe glitching, but it's banned in tournaments and competitive building and things. In the same sense, you COULD build using superstacking in Stock, but it would probably be banned in tournaments. Because most people work on legal tournament building concepts, I don't think they'd focus on the superstacking glitch too much, given that they wouldn't actually be able to utilise it very much. I think it's up to Scrap and Sage, though, it's really their call on whether to disclose their secrets or not.

another reason would be that people who can't stack or use glitches to save their lives can make lets say a regular 36HS with the glitch, and no one would notice because the bot could be built without it. definitely want to know how to do it tho
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Vertigo on July 01, 2011, 06:38:34 PM

.
I think their main concern is that it would cause the death of Stock Building by allowing stuff like this. One way around this would be to treat it like the Realistic Rule in DSL. You CAN build undealistic designs in DSL, stuff like Stacking and eFFe glitching, but it's banned in tournaments and competitive building and things. In the same sense, you COULD build using superstacking in Stock, but it would probably be banned in tournaments. Because most people work on legal tournament building concepts, I don't think they'd focus on the superstacking glitch too much, given that they wouldn't actually be able to utilise it very much. I think it's up to Scrap and Sage, though, it's really their call on whether to disclose their secrets or not.

another reason would be that people who can't stack or use glitches to save their lives can make lets say a regular 36HS with the glitch, and no one would notice because the bot could be built without it. definitely want to know how to do it tho
Problem is, we cannot have it both ways

Either everyone knows, possibly ending with disastrous effects, or we never find out :P
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Scrap Daddy on July 01, 2011, 06:56:53 PM
we will probably end up showing Click and Trovaner but I can't see us ever fully revealing how to do it.

I also don't intend to enter any bots in tournaments using this glitch.



and yes Russian Roulette, this is a hoax 3 years in the making.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Preytor_4 on July 01, 2011, 07:00:25 PM
we will probably end up showing Click and Trovaner but I can't see us ever fully revealing how to do it.

I can picture Pwn posting with a forever alone pic.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Jack Daniels on July 01, 2011, 07:01:02 PM
The Trov glitch came and went... But it was resurface pretty recently and now quite a few bots are using it.   Just sayin'  i don't think people will forget this one.

On a side note... if this glitch gets Inf and Psy back into the game full tilt.  i am all for it.   :D
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: russian roulette on July 01, 2011, 07:37:13 PM
and yes Russian Roulette, this is a hoax 3 years in the making.
I loled, I can see potential talking to click about this to create awesome Replicas fro DSL 3
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Sparkey98 on July 01, 2011, 09:02:09 PM


urrr durrr I know everything
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Urjak on July 01, 2011, 09:36:55 PM
we will probably end up showing Click and Trovaner but I can't see us ever fully revealing how to do it.


To what end? How are Click and Trovaner any more deserving of it than any other experimenter? It is completely up to you guys who you tell, I'm just saying creating an upper elite who know of it seems a tad bit unfair (I personally don't care, but I'm not sure everybody shares my indifference).
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: JoeBlo on July 01, 2011, 10:16:14 PM
1) Mad props to you two for working it out (you guys have always been ahead in stock building)

2) You didnt share any of your development with me (thus you do not get an invite to my pool party)

3) I think stock just died.. here are some more numbers points why


Dont get me wrong I think its great work but you would either have to release it (open a huge can of worms)

Make internal component stacking illegal (MOAR WORMS)
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: 123savethewhales on July 01, 2011, 11:01:10 PM
we will probably end up showing Click and Trovaner but I can't see us ever fully revealing how to do it.


To what end? How are Click and Trovaner any more deserving of it than any other experimenter? It is completely up to you guys who you tell, I'm just saying creating an upper elite who know of it seems a tad bit unfair (I personally don't care, but I'm not sure everybody shares my indifference).
OMG you SOOO not old enough to be 1337.

But hey, they discover it.  They has the rights to choose what they do with their knowledge.  This includes who they tell and who they not tell.

And I am not indifferent.  I won't even try to pretend like I am indifferent.  I want to know, even if it won't even help me one bit because I don't play stock and I can already BFE everything in as is.

1) Mad props to you two for working it out (you guys have always been ahead in stock building)

2) You didnt share any of your development with me (thus you do not get an invite to my pool party)

3) I think stock just died.. here are some more numbers points why


Dont get me wrong I think its great work but you would either have to release it (open a huge can of worms)

Make internal component stacking illegal (MOAR WORMS)
Well we can just ban this specific glitch.  Which states that this glitch cannot be legally used as the reason to justify the location of a component.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Urjak on July 01, 2011, 11:14:52 PM
OMG you SOOO not old enough to be 1337.


I have read and reread this line, and still can't figure out what its actual meaning is...
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: 123savethewhales on July 01, 2011, 11:46:14 PM
OMG you SOOO not old enough to be 1337.


I have read and reread this line, and still can't figure out what its actual meaning is...
It's a "I sound like a n00b" joke that is not suppose to make sense.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Sage on July 02, 2011, 12:18:50 AM
@JoeBlo- If we use this glitch, you can tell. It's not like theres another way to stack a HPZ into a black without a burst/servo. Also, as long as we don't release it, BFE is still obvious. Stock hasn't died!

Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Urjak on July 02, 2011, 12:33:30 AM
@JoeBlo- If we use this glitch, you can tell. It's not like theres another way to stack a HPZ into a black without a burst/servo.


Then... why don't you release it?

It seems like what you just said undermines any reason for not releasing it. In all honesty, its usefulness seems rather limited if required to be used covertly.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Sage on July 02, 2011, 12:38:04 AM
No.. if we release it BFE will become untraceable. Also, maybe we're just selfish :D
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Urjak on July 02, 2011, 12:39:42 AM
No.. if we release it BFE will become untraceable.


That makes no sense. Just outlaw both BFE and Hax Mode, then BFE will not be any more or less traceable. The only way BFE would become untraceable is if you wanted people to use BFE and not Hax Mode, or maybe vice versa, a situation not likely to come up often in a tournament.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Sage on July 02, 2011, 12:41:41 AM
True, but if we can't use it why release it in the first place.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Urjak on July 02, 2011, 12:42:25 AM
True, but if we can't use it why release it in the first place.


Because to many people it would be incredibly fun to make some cool non-tournament bots with it.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: 123savethewhales on July 02, 2011, 12:45:43 AM
Cuz I am more curious about the working of the game mechanics than what I can build in stocks?  Cuz, like, I don't play stock?  Ever?
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Enigm@ on July 02, 2011, 12:46:21 AM
Off Topic:
Since when is everyone online at 1:00? o,O
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Urjak on July 02, 2011, 12:47:33 AM
Cuz, like, I don't play stock?


Assuming the glitch is unique to stock...
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: 123savethewhales on July 02, 2011, 12:50:26 AM
Cuz, like, I don't play stock?
Assuming the glitch is unique to stock...
Stacking is illegal in DSL to begin with.  So what difference would that make?

Unless it also allow no collision externally, but even then nobody is going to allow this as a justification in DSL anyway.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Urjak on July 02, 2011, 12:55:21 AM
Stacking is illegal in DSL to begin with.  So what difference would that make?
Unless it also allow no collision externally, but even then nobody is going to allow this as a justification in DSL anyway.


In case someone wanted to make a for-fun DSL bot that didn't follow the realistic rule.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Enigm@ on July 02, 2011, 12:57:14 AM
Stacking is illegal in DSL to begin with.  So what difference would that make?
Unless it also allow no collision externally, but even then nobody is going to allow this as a justification in DSL anyway.


In case someone wanted to make a for-fun DSL bot that didn't follow the realistic rule.
^ I do this.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: 123savethewhales on July 02, 2011, 12:58:06 AM
Stacking is illegal in DSL to begin with.  So what difference would that make?
Unless it also allow no collision externally, but even then nobody is going to allow this as a justification in DSL anyway.
In case someone wanted to make a for-fun DSL bot that didn't follow the realistic rule.
BFE is faster, and it can even break rule of 7 and connect at funky angles.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: JoeBlo on July 02, 2011, 01:15:11 AM
@JoeBlo- If we use this glitch, you can tell. It's not like theres another way to stack a HPZ into a black without a burst/servo.

Now if someone manages to stack something nobody saw before they would get accused of using the glitch.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: 123savethewhales on July 02, 2011, 01:35:57 AM
@JoeBlo- If we use this glitch, you can tell. It's not like theres another way to stack a HPZ into a black without a burst/servo.

Now if someone manages to stack something nobody saw before they would get accused of using the glitch.
That is already true with BFE or AAF, so nothing new really.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Sage on July 02, 2011, 01:37:44 AM
I could use technically this glitch for August BOTM! Too bad no one would vote for me xD
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Meganerdbomb on July 02, 2011, 01:59:14 AM
Screw that. Just release it. The only reason I don't build stock anymore is I hate spending an hour just trying to stack two black batteries.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: ACAMS on July 02, 2011, 02:00:12 AM
I could use technically this glitch for August BOTM! Too bad no one would vote for me xD


No, because I would call it AAM/BFE and kick your butt for not showing me the little trick!
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Vertigo on July 02, 2011, 03:07:24 AM
Grr, just spent a while experimenting, and the closest I got was smartzone leverage, that's pretty cool tho'
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Sage on July 02, 2011, 03:08:39 AM
I could use technically this glitch for August BOTM! Too bad no one would vote for me xD


No, because I would call it AAM/BFE and kick your butt for not showing me the little trick!

But it's not either!
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Vertigo on July 02, 2011, 03:11:11 AM
I could use technically this glitch for August BOTM! Too bad no one would vote for me xD


No, because I would call it AAM/BFE and kick your butt for not showing me the little trick!

But it's not either!
So what?

It's even more cheep any annoying than BFE & AAM because we don't know how to do it!
Even still, I agree with not releasing the trick
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Scorpion on July 02, 2011, 03:52:15 AM
I agree, DON'T release it guys, it would be the death of stock.
Interesting or new stacks would be branded as hax too easily, and everybody would lose interest, I mean imagine how much easier it would be to build if nothing collided with anything else in stock! Making a top bot would be too easy for anybody to care.
In the end Stock would probably have to become "realistic" in order to remain somewhat popular, although, even then, why not just play DSL instead at that point...

If you don't release this glitch, stock will continue as it is popularity wise fro a bit longer, atleast untill somebody else figures out how to do it...
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: JoeBlo on July 02, 2011, 03:59:48 AM
But it's not either!

that is exactly the problem

From a rule standpoint your just using the same results as BFE but its claimed to be a glitch..

There isnt proof about it being legit

If it is legit then you cannot outlaw it without outlawing baseplate Stacking all together..

Unless you want everyone to upload a video filming them making the robot..
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: RpJk on July 02, 2011, 04:16:30 AM
Don't release it otherwise stock popularity would decline within probably about a year. And to be honest it would effect everyone by a good bit and the robot building will become so easy even for beginners. Then probably a good amount of people would leave such as me and this forum would become DSL only forum for about two years and then it would be dead forever. RA2 will become a fully pledged `thing of the past`so release it and RA2 will be in its grave in about two years.
So if this forum wants to live for another 5 years then don't say anything about that glitch.

Too over dramatic?
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Scorpion on July 02, 2011, 04:18:55 AM
Too over dramatic?
Yes, although some parts aren't far off.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: 123savethewhales on July 02, 2011, 04:19:32 AM
And, why can't we outlaw it exactly?  Why can't people just get together and say, hey we don't like this BS, let's not do it or allow it in tournaments.

Sure if you trying to be all technical you are not going to find all the logical rules that distinguish this from other forms of stacking.  But hey nobody has been able to write an algorithm that can distinguish a cat from a dog either, that doesn't stop us from telling them apart.  This is when the human intuition comes into play.  Just assume something that looks improbable fake/cheating until proven otherwise.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Squirrel_Monkey on July 02, 2011, 04:33:24 AM

I agree with 123 and JB, we cannot distinguish between BFE and Hax mode, in fact we cannot really tell the difference between a lucky stack and minor use of this glitch. There is no way to draw the line. We must simply use common sense.
The Trov glitch came and went... But it was resurface pretty recently and now quite a few bots are using it.
That would be me  :approve:
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Pwnator on July 02, 2011, 04:37:59 AM
That would be me  :approve:

Actually, that would be Sage. :P
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Squirrel_Monkey on July 02, 2011, 04:40:09 AM
That would be me  :approve:

Actually, that would be Sage. :P
You should see the number of bots I've made using the Trov glitch.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: JoeBlo on July 02, 2011, 04:42:57 AM
And, why can't we outlaw it exactly?

I will put money on it that we cant reach a unanimous decision :P

But lets put it to a poll and see..
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: NFX on July 02, 2011, 04:49:56 AM
We could put it to a poll and see what we could do.

I still don't see why it shouldn't be released and regulated, in the same way as the Realistic rule in DSL is. If we treat the Superstacking glitch the same way as we treat BFE and AAM, then people will still build in the same way as they have been, with Snapper Loading, eFFeing, things like that. It won't kill off Stock, unless people actually TRY to kill it off.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: ty4er on July 02, 2011, 05:10:35 AM
Gets rid of creativity pretty much.
And it means that noobs can create bots that are equal to vets and such :o

But i don't do much stock so idk
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Scorpion on July 02, 2011, 05:16:04 AM
We could put it to a poll and see what we could do.

I still don't see why it shouldn't be released and regulated, in the same way as the Realistic rule in DSL is. If we treat the Superstacking glitch the same way as we treat BFE and AAM, then people will still build in the same way as they have been, with Snapper Loading, eFFeing, things like that. It won't kill off Stock, unless people actually TRY to kill it off.
That's the thing though, there is no way to tell what is hax glitched and what has just been normally stacked!
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: russian roulette on July 02, 2011, 05:16:43 AM
Don't release it otherwise stock popularity would decline within probably about a year. And to be honest it would effect everyone by a good bit and the robot building will become so easy even for beginners. Then probably a good amount of people would leave such as me and this forum would become DSL only forum for about two years and then it would be dead forever. RA2 will become a fully pledged `thing of the past`so release it and RA2 will be in its grave in about two years.
So if this forum wants to live for another 5 years then don't say anything about that glitch.

Too over dramatic?
Honestly, I think that this would HELP stock. If you'd look at BBEANS 5, if Click pitted a n00b robot against a 36 Mace HS or Siesm 16 (and many others) then the battle would last only one of two seconds. Whats the fun in that? Imagine stock where matches actually end with WBP and a bunch of debates and harder predictions like DSL, Stock tournaments would become insanely popular and they would also become alot harder to win (thus, one small little thing can cost you a victory). Also if everyone is just going to make 36 Mace HS's you can just allow only the first person who turned one in or just ban the glitch all together.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: cephalopod on July 02, 2011, 05:33:21 AM
Am I the only one thinking about this in ways other than 36HS? Flippers could have a few more bursts (and therefore power), as with popups. Those kinds of things could be seen winning more.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Squirrel_Monkey on July 02, 2011, 05:34:02 AM
And Caster armour would just be MENTAL.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: ty4er on July 02, 2011, 05:54:39 AM
Gets rid of creativity pretty much.
And it means anyone can build anything without trying really...
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: G.K. on July 02, 2011, 06:27:43 AM
I agree with Joe here - we cannot prove it is legit, so we cannot outlaw it without outlawing all stacking. For all we in our ignorant minds know, we could be using it every time we stack something. I am probably wrong, but there is no proof for us so you cannot outlaw it on its own.

My support would go for what NFX said, releasing it and being open about it, and then regulating it as with the realistic rule in DSL. Both things are subjective and will be applied differently from tournament host to tournament host. This is one of the only fair options and also the best, IMHO.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: 123savethewhales on July 02, 2011, 06:45:48 AM
Why don't we just

"Ban things that LOOKS like hax mode to the average builder"

instead of

"Ban hax mode".

After all, in practice it is exactly the same with BFE and AAF, you can only ban the things that APPEARS like BFE to the average builders.

So will that "discourage new ways of stacking"?  Maybe.  Or it might have little to no impact at all because even before this you have to REALLY stack to look like hax.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: cephalopod on July 02, 2011, 06:57:46 AM
I agree with these guys, I think. It does make more sense. And it'll mean I'm finally able to stack even 2 supervolts, maybe even bringing my interest into Stock a little bit, as some people are put off due to not being able to stack, including me.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Squirrel_Monkey on July 02, 2011, 07:00:36 AM
WHat do we kno is possible at the moment?
We could just list what we currently know as possible for future reference.
E.g 3 Black batteries, a few baseplate anchors, etc...
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Pwnator on July 02, 2011, 07:03:59 AM
Standards for stacking has pretty much increased thanks to NC's tool

HOORAY NC'S TOOL
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: NFX on July 02, 2011, 07:07:28 AM
But then some members can stack easier than others. For instance, there are members who can stack a CB into 2 blacks, whereas I can't even stack it into one. I have gotten 3 Niftys together once, 2 SnapperII's together, 2 Lo Power Servos together, and 4 Pinks partly into 2 BA's. But if one member's stacking ability isn't equal to another member's stacking ability, then that puts them at a disadvantage.

I think, in terms of regulation, tournament hosts will have to lay down rules about which stacks are deemed legal and which stacks aren't. If we do put together the list, and someone discovers a new stack without using Superstacking, then we'd have to have multiple-party confirmation before we can deem it legal. Otherwise we'd get a bunch of complaints about it being hax mode.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: 123savethewhales on July 02, 2011, 07:34:21 AM
Listing every single stack-able thing with their quantity is petty close to impossible.  The list just grows exponentially as you increase more parts/conditions.

Any potential multiple-party confirmation is going to be simpler than writing/checking that rulebook.  And anyone who complain about hax mode can just as easily complain about BFE.  But against we don't see BFE complains everywhere.

One reason for not having runaway effect is the showcases.  People can see a steady stream of bots.  Anyone who look like their stacking skill improved significantly overnight is going to raise suspicion.  Getting away with big cheating is just not that easy when people can see your progress.  So if I start a stock showcase now and show some 1337 stacking skills, you will guess I am using BFE even if the same bot might look legit from Pwnator or Ounce.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Jack Daniels on July 02, 2011, 09:37:40 AM
Why is everyone so concerned about Stock Dying?  DSL tournaments still outnumber stock most of the time.  Also, no offense, but stock tournaments often get filled up with newer builders and it just doesn't generate the same interest with Veterans like the old days.

I would be willing to bet that with each discovery over the years people have feared that it would kill off Stock interest.  Dating all the way back the beginning with the first stack, bot file editing, heck even popups had everyone's panties in a wad.

I say, release it to the public and future Stock tournaments can be either:

-Stock abiding by the realistic rule (thus negating the need for any hax)

or

-Stock All In-game Glitches Allowed  (probably ushering in a new era of leet bots that separate the men from the boys *and women from the girls just to include Scourge*)


Newbies would enter the realistic rule tourneys... and power builders would enter the SAIGA tourneys.  Everyone is happy.


Edit: And yes... i know i praised you for keeping it secret at first... but 12 hours gave me time to think about it more thoroughly. I changed my mind.  :P
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: russian roulette on July 02, 2011, 09:53:01 AM
Gets rid of creativity pretty much.
And it means anyone can build anything without trying really...
I don't necessarily agree with this. If you were given the choice to build something with no collision, you'd have more possibilities to create non generic robots and still be effective in combat. With there being more possibilities, there are more chances of you most likely not liking the way your bot turned out.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Urjak on July 02, 2011, 09:58:09 AM
Other than the fact that Sage and Scrap have the right to tell anyone they want, there is no good reason for this glitch to remain secret. We already have BFE. And how exactly do we regulate BFE? By using common sense. We look at a bot and can generally tell if someone uses BFE.

All the n00bs here could easily learn BFE by lurking around these forums and experimenting, and yet stock hasn't died yet. That shows generally that people are honest, and that they want to have worked hard on a robot and pit it against other fair robots. If Hax Mode is released, the only expected effect, depending on how easy the glitch is, is that people will be able to build bots more quickly via stacking those 2 supervolts or Nifty. Come to think of it, this might actually slightly increase the number of bots built because it removes the tiresome amount of time to stack certain components.

In conclusion, this glitch really should be released to the public, if for no other reason then to keep an openness between members to not keep cool or unique glitches to ourselves. That's something I don't think a forum for an otherwise dead game should do. Just my two cents. 
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: System32 on July 02, 2011, 09:59:50 AM
I agree with urjak.
 
Nothing kills faster than ignorance and secrecy.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: JoeBlo on July 02, 2011, 10:21:32 AM
Dont get me wrong here.. I am not saying it will kill of stock just at this moment it has easy potential to turn away loads of players.

As I said (and created a poll for it) since you have to be a brain surgeon to construct a stacking rule-set around it you need to simply outlaw base-plate stacking or let people go nuts (but I foresee the latter as a worse option)

Either case the Glitch can be released, confirmed and Sage and Scrappy get themselves an official title for it (at the moment its nowhere proven to be true.. its just that we trust them both)

Another option is splitting stock.. (yet another one of my one going   projects comes to light again) We Fix up Stock's bugs (ACAMS had a few   AP fixes also the 140 extender, etc) and Brand that as the more   restrictive Stacking game (Outlaw Baseplate Stacking) and leave Stock   how its always been "Whatever you can manage inside the game is legal"

There is something good to come from this already though.. my Buried project "Paper RA2" can surface again..   (Think Paper Mario but RA2) it was set to be released but with the AAM   possibilities (swapping component GMF's for the paper thin versions) I   buried it.. guess I wont have to worry anymore..
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: madman3 on July 02, 2011, 10:25:46 AM
So long as it's kept to custom showcases I don't really care.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: russian roulette on July 02, 2011, 11:17:41 AM
So long as it's kept to custom showcases I don't really care.
Why? It doesn't have custom components, and it is specific for stock. That is just like saying Effe glitched robots or robots that stack belong in the custom components section. If this glitch is kept at a limit, Stock tournament would become ALOT more popular.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: JoeBlo on July 02, 2011, 11:20:05 AM
Read the 4th paragraph of my above post then his reply

At least I think thats what he was talking about?
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Gazea2 on July 02, 2011, 11:28:58 AM
I've been lurking through this thread for a while now and lots of people have repeated themselves. In all honesty, I think Joe's idea is the best. You either:

a) Ban stacking all together and make stock a bad imitation of DSL.
b) Make 2 versions of stock: one with stacking and one without.
c) Put up with it and use your common sense to decide whether they have used this glitch or done it properly.

I don't really mind which option is chosen but I definitely think that it should be released. If not, then suspicions will rise and, eventually, someone else will find out how.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: russian roulette on July 02, 2011, 11:29:41 AM
@Joe
Yes I get that, but it is still stock but just a patched version. Stock showcase should be split in 2 sections if this would happen to go into effect though. Perhaps "RA2:Developer Release" and "RA2 Stock: GTM Release"
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Sage on July 02, 2011, 11:40:57 AM
That would be me  :approve:

Actually, that would be Sage. :P
You should see the number of bots I've made using the Trov glitch.

Did you ever watch my tutorial?


And also, its much easier to stack 2 blacks then to initiate this glitch. That HS was one of the more difficult bots I've had to build. This glitch is a higher difficulty level than snapper loading, so all you guys who think it will make bot building easier for noobs are incorrect. You're all coming up with reasons why it should be released when in reality you're just curious.

If we don't release it, we can still tell between BFE and in-game glitching. That's the point. So why release it if it's just going to be shunned like BFE anyway.

Most builders know exactly what has been stacked normally in the past before, and can call BS on anything that doesn't have video proof. So why must we outlaw stacking now that a few people know this glitch? We don't have to, CAUSE IT'S NOT RELEASED.

Third point, for those who think its a hoax: I'll talk to Scrap, maybe we can get some video proof going.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: JoeBlo on July 02, 2011, 11:42:53 AM
@Joe
Yes I get that, but it is still stock but just a patched version. Stock showcase should be split in 2 sections if this would happen to go into effect though. Perhaps "RA2:Developer Release" and "RA2 Stock: GTM Release"

I wouldnt want the "NarAI effect" when the 2 got jumbled up all the time..

I started building it as Robot Arena 2 - Ultimate Edition (or simply branded "Ultimate" for short) and it had stock parts, AI parts, etc included and marked so people knew what could be used in rule sets along with other bits and pieces and an updated UI.. (similar to the old just a bit more modernized) Also as previous mentioned I wanted to add ACAMS AP mods..
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: kill343gs on July 02, 2011, 11:45:00 AM
c) Put up with it and use your common sense to decide whether they have used this glitch or done it properly.

If we do anything besides this, we are essentially killing what we all know as stock RA2... Adding extra restrictions is not going to solve anything and is nothing short of an overreaction to something we've basically been dealing with since the advent of BFE and AAM.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Gazea2 on July 02, 2011, 11:48:43 AM
c) Put up with it and use your common sense to decide whether they have used this glitch or done it properly.

If we do anything besides this, we are essentially killing what we all know as stock RA2... Adding extra restrictions is not going to solve anything and is nothing short of an overreaction to something we've basically been dealing with since the advent of BFE and AAM.

I couldn't agree more.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Vertigo on July 02, 2011, 12:00:22 PM
Just don't release it and don't cause all the debate and trouble
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Sage on July 02, 2011, 12:04:07 PM
Just don't release it and don't cause all the debate and trouble

Exactly
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: kill343gs on July 02, 2011, 12:04:40 PM
Just don't release it and don't cause all the debate and trouble

Exactly

Assuming that others aren't capable of figuring it out.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Sage on July 02, 2011, 12:08:03 PM
we haven't released the glitch yet, so obviously people know you're cheating.

No they dont.. its not impossible for someone else to figure it out..

Its just the same as claiming a BFE job to be legit... only 6 Stacked Z-Teks doesn't look suspect anymore..

Or it people do something legit (like the 3 Servos on the last page) and we try to ban it becasue its suspect to a glitch we dont even know.

Without the "common sense limit" Stacking just isnt balanced ground now.. My thoughts is that it should go...

But Please head back to the actual topic now, I have shown what I wish to show in my showcase..

I don't understand... are you trying to get us to release it or not? Cause normal stacking is not subject to this new glitch if no one knows how to do it.

Just don't release it and don't cause all the debate and trouble

Exactly

Assuming that others aren't capable of figuring it out.

At that time, THEN let us have this discussion.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Gazea2 on July 02, 2011, 12:09:22 PM
If you don't release it, though, people will always have their suspicions about you whenever you post a new bot or enter a tourney.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Sage on July 02, 2011, 12:13:10 PM
If you don't release it, though, people will always have their suspicions about you whenever you post a new bot or enter a tourney.

Go for it. I mean seriously what could I enter into a tourney that LOOKS legit but is superstacked? You think I'd use hax mode for stacking blacks or something? Honestly.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: kill343gs on July 02, 2011, 12:14:37 PM
Assuming that others aren't capable of figuring it out.

At that time, THEN let us have this discussion.

At that point it could be too late. We may be unfairly delaying someone's tournament or something so we can kick and scratch each other over a person's entry. We may as well figure this out now so we don't have to deal with this later. Obviously people are pretty fired up about this even though it isn't nearly as big a deal as they think it is...
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Gazea2 on July 02, 2011, 12:15:48 PM
If you don't release it, though, people will always have their suspicions about you whenever you post a new bot or enter a tourney.

Go for it. I mean seriously what could I enter into a tourney that LOOKS legit but is superstacked? You think I'd use hax mode for stacking blacks or something? Honestly.
I wouldn't. Other people might. I'm just throwing out possibilities.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Vertigo on July 02, 2011, 12:16:55 PM
If you don't release it, though, people will always have their suspicions about you whenever you post a new bot or enter a tourney.
I believe that Sage and Scrap are good enough members to be trusted
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: russian roulette on July 02, 2011, 12:35:15 PM
If executing this glitch is harder than stacking, then I believe we should all ignore this whole conundrum. Sage and Scrap are trusted members and I believe that this would not effect stock in any way, shape or form.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: System32 on July 02, 2011, 12:37:22 PM
Just don't release it and don't cause all the debate and trouble
Like this whole thread? Half the trouble is caused by not releasing it anyway.
 
If the glitch is so hard anyway release it. It's pretty hypocriticl for a forum to keep hiding building techniques.
 
This about this: If the eFFe and Rupt glitch were kelp secret, where would we all be now?
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: kill343gs on July 02, 2011, 12:46:31 PM
I think S32 brings up a good point. Effe glitch was supposed to ruin stock. Rupt, not quite as big of a deal, but I'm sure there were some doomsayers...
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Sage on July 02, 2011, 12:58:10 PM
Because this glitch is OP. Effe, Rupt, and even sloading have limitations.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: System32 on July 02, 2011, 01:20:35 PM
didn't you say that this was both difficult and had limits on exostacking?
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Sage on July 02, 2011, 01:28:45 PM
didn't you say that this was both difficult and had limits on exostacking?

Well yes, exostacking batteries. Anything else works. Way OP.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: R0B0SH4RK on July 02, 2011, 01:29:24 PM
I don't really see how Hax Mode will ruin stock. Most of you seem to be equating stacking directly with how good the robot is. Following this logic, more stacking = better robot, therefore unlimited stacking = unbeatable bot. This could not be further from the truth. All stacking does is minimize weight spent on the chassis, therefore providing more possibilities for other components. An inefficient use of these components will still yield terrible bots.

I built R4 coming up on 6 years ago, it was 4-5 years old when I entered it into BBEANS. Exactly zero components on it were stacked, and the razors were only attached with some really basic eFFeing. Yet, it widthstood the test of time and took out almost all comers, including Inf's Absolute Chaos, the supposed "unbeatable" 36HS that used tons of stacking, eFFeing and sloading. This should be all of the proof that you need that good design still beats good stacking.

The "Death of Stock" argument also fails to put Hax Mode's applications on all bot types into the equation. Sure, we'd get spinners with more spikes, but we could also have popups with stronger defense, rammers with more impressive weaponry, quicker, more compact VS, and who knows what other effects on building. With new possibilities, we might actually be able to balance the playing field a bit for Rammers and VS. We don't know.
 
Bottom line: I don't see what the big deal is whether or not it's released for public use. I'm confident that Scrap and Sage will refrain from using this glitch for tourneys because they're concerned with the integrity of Stock. If it isn't released, it really doesn't affect the rest of us at all. And if it is released, it won't rape Stock to the extent that we're all afraid of. It's not a really big deal, guys.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Sage on July 02, 2011, 01:30:49 PM
Actually robo AC doesn't have any sloading :D
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Vertigo on July 02, 2011, 01:34:58 PM
TBH, that's actually a good point robo, hadn't thought of it like that
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Gazea2 on July 02, 2011, 01:59:50 PM
I agree. R4 was and still is a good bot.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: NFX on July 02, 2011, 02:20:55 PM
R0B0 brings up an excellent point. Sage and Scrap already said there are limitations with this glitch, and it'll still require some degree of skill to actually apply it to an effective design.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Gazea2 on July 02, 2011, 02:22:44 PM
R0B0 brings up an excellent point. Sage and Scrap already said there are limitations with this glitch, and it'll still require some degree of skill to actually apply it to an effective design.

Then I'm confused as to why they're worried that it'll break stock. If it needs some skill, a newbie won't be able to come along and make an awesome bot, will they?
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: ty4er on July 02, 2011, 02:34:46 PM
Most chassis' will just be a box with not much thought behind it IMO.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: russian roulette on July 02, 2011, 03:00:45 PM
Most chassis' will just be a box with not much thought behind it IMO.
So are most DSL robots (Specifically of the SNS type and VS type)
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: ty4er on July 02, 2011, 03:16:24 PM
Most chassis' will just be a box with not much thought behind it IMO.
So are most DSL robots (Specifically of the SNS type and VS type)
Ah, they have to be the right size for everything needed to fit in so they do have thought behind them :P
But in stock they would just have to be a certain size and you could put nearly anything you wanted in there without re-sizing or whatever.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Virus Bomb on July 02, 2011, 03:20:13 PM
hey sage how much more difficult would you say this glitch is compared to snapper loading?
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Scrap Daddy on July 02, 2011, 03:22:00 PM
haha right on par
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Dexterhunter on July 02, 2011, 03:24:29 PM
I've came across this glitch maybe a few times ever since I played Robot Arena 2. I was recently (as in this year, which is weird in of itself) making a robot: everything was progressing as normal, then I...


Then the next thing I knew was that I was able to stack everything into each other.

Only a few select people should be worthy of being taught this; not something that the mass public should know
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Scorpion on July 02, 2011, 03:25:01 PM
Most chassis' will just be a box with not much thought behind it IMO.
So are most DSL robots (Specifically of the SNS type and VS type)
Ah, they have to be the right size for everything needed to fit in so they do have thought behind them :P
But in stock they would just have to be a certain size and you could put nearly anything you wanted in there without re-sizing or whatever.
EH?
Have you even played stock!
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: ty4er on July 02, 2011, 03:27:59 PM
Most chassis' will just be a box with not much thought behind it IMO.
So are most DSL robots (Specifically of the SNS type and VS type)
Ah, they have to be the right size for everything needed to fit in so they do have thought behind them :P
But in stock they would just have to be a certain size and you could put nearly anything you wanted in there without re-sizing or whatever.
EH?
Have you even played stock!
...no :P
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Serge on July 02, 2011, 03:33:27 PM
Wow, nice job.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: ACAMS on July 02, 2011, 03:53:12 PM

Nothing kills faster than ignorance and secrecy.


I knew how to AAM years before the public, and we all voted to keep that secret way back then, but now axle loading makes it impossible to tell AAM if it was used.
We don't say "NO AXLE LOADING" in tournaments, but should!


It is their secret..........they can tell us if they want to, but if they use it, THEY MUST SHOW HOW IT IS DONE, or it will be called BFE and deemed illegal!


I guess all tournament bots will have to be inspected with apanx bot exporter to see if superstacking was used....or BFE
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: 123savethewhales on July 02, 2011, 04:01:16 PM
how would apanx bot exporter detect BFE?  I mean all it really c is rather or not things are properly "connected".

I just don't see how it can tell the difference between super-stacking or not.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: System32 on July 02, 2011, 04:59:22 PM
Most chassis' will just be a box with not much thought behind it IMO.
So are most DSL robots (Specifically of the SNS type and VS type)
Ah, they have to be the right size for everything needed to fit in so they do have thought behind them :P
But in stock they would just have to be a certain size and you could put nearly anything you wanted in there without re-sizing or whatever.
EH?
Have you even played stock!
...no :P
Then don't post here. I don't argue details on Fetus in fetu. Why? I know jack sh**. I havent learned it or studied it. You haven't touched stock. Get out of this thread. It is something affecting stock only.
 
 
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: ACAMS on July 02, 2011, 06:06:51 PM
how would apanx bot exporter detect BFE?  I mean all it really c is rather or not things are properly "connected".

I just don't see how it can tell the difference between super-stacking or not.


If it has 3 black batteries in one spot, then BFE, AAM or superstacking was used. The exporter will tell you how many parts are in one spot.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Meganerdbomb on July 02, 2011, 06:40:45 PM
I remember when AAM was a huge secret that only the "vets" knew, then someone else figured it out and let the cat out of the bag, and oh yeah, nothing happened. It'll be the same with this.

Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Somebody on July 02, 2011, 06:56:51 PM
Here's how I see it.

IF it is released, it will help a new kind a building happen, not the death. noobs will still be noobs, with their square extenders, RAD powered heavyweights, and battle axes (BATTLE AXES WOOOOOO). Stacking won't help that.
It will bring in new types of tournaments
1. The usual Stock type tournaments, with no superstacking.
2. Stock tournaments where superstacking can be used in only a realistic manner (where a AP can be put inside a DDT to place a ramplate where it could be put IRL
3. All out, fight to the death superstacking tournaments, providing a jolt to stock
I would love superstacking tournaments lol. Of course everything would be chosen by the host.

Now for all of you that are worried about abuse, have I got a solution for you...
A treaty!!!
Wtf does a treaty have to do with anything??? you ask.
After the glitch is released and we have the new tournaments, we can write up a little thing and pin it to the top of the tournaments forum. Everybody agrees to it if they want to compete in any normal Stock tournaments (1st example above). If they are ever caught with superstacking, they are banned from all stock tournaments FOR LIFE. No exceptions.

An trust me guys, a popup wouldn't work in a tiny little chassis. Superstacking wouldn't be the end of all originality.


EDIT: Foul language removed....user warned

EDIT2: I love how my warning said "Did somebody forget that foul language is not allowed in the main forum?"
Its so third-persony =D
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Virus Bomb on July 02, 2011, 07:21:32 PM
If it has 3 black batteries in one spot, then BFE, AAM or superstacking was used.


No, it's possible to stack 3 blacks without BFE, AAM, or superstacking. If it was like 4-5 blacks and a control board stacked then someone probably AAM, BFE, etc.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: ACAMS on July 02, 2011, 07:26:45 PM
Most games/computers only allow one black and the control board....ANYWAY.....there needs to be rules in place RIGHT NOW about that sort of stuff, and another way to stack, IS JUST ANOTHER WAY TO STACK!

So it does not matter if they tell or not, but if somebody (not the foul language guy) ANYBODY else discovers it and tells....they will get the credit!
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Jack Daniels on July 02, 2011, 07:34:52 PM
Quick Garvin... discover this so we can call it the Garv-Glitch.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: 123savethewhales on July 02, 2011, 07:37:13 PM
Lol let's face it, social pressure is far more effective than secrecy for keeping people in line.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Kujii on July 02, 2011, 10:10:22 PM
This is new? I assumed that stacking that many components in one spot had been being done for ages ._.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Sparkey98 on July 02, 2011, 10:27:33 PM
This is new? I assumed that stacking that many components in one spot had been being done for ages ._.

fail.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Badnik96 on July 02, 2011, 10:40:35 PM
I agree with Jack, Somebody, and Robo. The multiple tourneys thing sounds sick, and good designs > Tricked-out modern bots. Both Seism and R4 were old bots, and they both beat 36hs.

Also, no one remembered Venko's adventures in this kinda stuff? WTF
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Pwnator on July 02, 2011, 10:58:18 PM
Venko's adventures pretty much consisted of Snapper IIs and anchors. That's about it.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Sage on July 02, 2011, 11:15:40 PM
(https://gametechmods.com/uploads/images/26403screenshot_45.jpg)


hehehehehehehe

vid coming soon
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Vertigo on July 03, 2011, 02:29:40 AM
vid coming soon
Showing us how to do it or just proof that it can be done?
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: JoeBlo on July 03, 2011, 02:41:59 AM
There was a vid Scrap posted just before that partially showed how it was done and partially showed proof it worked

Then it disappeared from this thread.. 
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Vertigo on July 03, 2011, 02:44:34 AM
We need to find ScrapTube :P

EDIT: I think he just deleted it (http://www.youtube.com/user/ScrapDadddy)
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Sage on July 03, 2011, 02:51:32 AM
There was a vid Scrap posted just before that partially showed how it was done and partially showed proof it worked

Then it disappeared from this thread.. 

I have no idea what you're talking about


;)
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: JoeBlo on July 03, 2011, 03:13:44 AM
hehehe now im one step ahead of everyone to figuring it out :P
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Vertigo on July 03, 2011, 03:14:56 AM
hehehe now im one step ahead of everyone to figuring it out :P
Wheres the vid?

Checked his YT account, he's never uploaded anything to it

EDIT: And you're a mod, thus able to see deleted posts, wheres the vid? >:|
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Gazea2 on July 03, 2011, 03:16:10 AM
No clue. I didn't see one... Looks like Joe will *hopefully* figure it out.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Vertigo on July 03, 2011, 03:16:54 AM
He obviously has found the vid, as I said, he can see deleted posts
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Gazea2 on July 03, 2011, 03:20:40 AM
Good point.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Badnik96 on July 03, 2011, 03:22:48 AM
oh boy this is gonna get interesting
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: TriTon on July 03, 2011, 03:24:50 AM
Yep, Jb's gonna come out with a giant monster with over 9000 irons that will turn us into chocolate.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: JoeBlo on July 03, 2011, 03:31:32 AM
He obviously has found the vid, as I said, he can see deleted posts

That wouldn't make a difference he obviously deleted the video off his youtube account..

I shall preserve the secret though..  ;)
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Jonzu95 on July 03, 2011, 04:28:30 AM
This is new? I assumed that stacking that many components in one spot had been being done for ages ._.
*facepalm*
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Badnik96 on July 03, 2011, 07:15:39 AM
oh gawd
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Gazea2 on July 03, 2011, 10:21:45 AM
So any more news for this?
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Sage on July 03, 2011, 10:57:41 AM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=39sdEddFsIM# (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=39sdEddFsIM#)


there's the vid. i hope it's proof enough.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: JoeBlo on July 03, 2011, 11:08:22 AM
there's the vid.

What happened to the first part? :P

As said in the pm, F12 would have looked more impressive..
 
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Sage on July 03, 2011, 11:11:56 AM
there's the vid.

What happened to the first part? :P

As said in the pm, F12 would have looked more impressive..
 

First part gives away secrets.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Vertigo on July 03, 2011, 11:13:23 AM
there's the vid.

What happened to the first part? :P

As said in the pm, F12 would have looked more impressive..
 

First part gives away secrets.
Whats the point making a vid to never show anyone? :P
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: NFX on July 03, 2011, 11:22:10 AM
Why does the control board have to be there?
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Scorpion on July 03, 2011, 11:27:02 AM
Example 1 ey?
Should we be expecting more videos showing everybody how awesome this glitch is, and making us all moar jealous? ;p
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Vertigo on July 03, 2011, 11:28:01 AM
Why does the control board have to be there?

Clue Number 1
You need a control board


As said in the pm, F12 would have looked more impressive..

Clue Number 2
F12 can be used to make the glitch work


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=39sdEddFsIM# (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=39sdEddFsIM#)

Clue Number 3
Components other than a Control Board do not have to bee mounted to make the glitch work
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Scorpion on July 03, 2011, 11:29:40 AM
Why does the control board have to be there?

Clue number 1
You need a control board
He's also got custom smart zones in his components section, you might be right about the idea that smartzones are needed.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Vertigo on July 03, 2011, 11:35:17 AM
Why does the control board have to be there?

Clue number 1
You need a control board
He's also got custom smart zones in his components section, you might be right about the idea that smartzones are needed.
Smartzones are weird components, messing about yesterday after seeing this glitch, I found Smartzone Leverage, something I had never seen before, they also detect the presence of another bot when under AI.

I think it is very likely they have something to do with it
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Randa on July 03, 2011, 11:35:38 AM
Why does the control board have to be there?

Clue Number 1
You need a control board


As said in the pm, F12 would have looked more impressive..

Clue Number 2
F12 can be used to make the glitch work


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=39sdEddFsIM# (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=39sdEddFsIM#)

Clue Number 3
Components other than a Control Board do not have to bee mounted to make the glitch work


We got all three clues, it's time to go to the thinking chair!
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: madman3 on July 03, 2011, 11:38:00 AM
Guys, this glitch could be as sporadic as axle size distortion, so don't just assume things :P
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: NFX on July 03, 2011, 11:38:50 AM
I think we might be looking a bit too much into it. But it does show how seriously we are taking this. Or how foolish we are being. =]
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Vertigo on July 03, 2011, 11:42:19 AM
I reckon it's something to do with pausing.
confirmed 100%

Clue Number 4
It's something to do with pausing

Now, in reference to clue No.2, it has something to do with F12. As we all know, F12 shows the collision meshes, and Joe said it would look more impressive showing them.

Clue Number 5
Something happens to the collision meshes
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: NFX on July 03, 2011, 11:45:02 AM
No, pausing has nothing to do with Scrap's post there. He was just confirming that he could make it work 100% of the time.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Skiitzzox220 on July 03, 2011, 11:48:24 AM
Add one more to the number of glitches in the game engine
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Vertigo on July 03, 2011, 11:55:03 AM
Clue Number 1
You need a control board

Clue Number 2
F12 can be used to make the glitch work

Clue Number 3
Components other than a Control Board do not have to bee mounted to make the glitch work

Clue Number 4
Something happens to the collision meshes

Clue Number 5
It is harder to pull off than Snapper Loading


:P
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Scrap Daddy on July 03, 2011, 11:55:44 AM
hahah vertigo is trying so hard to figure it out
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Vertigo on July 03, 2011, 11:59:58 AM
hahah vertigo is trying so hard to figure it out
So what?

Many others have found this, I found once in the botlab I could place anything in anything and just put it down as ZeroG
Now when someone finds it, they will know they can activate it 100%, and it didn't just happen randomly, if the person is good enough they will figure it out too. It's only a matter of time untill that person tells people
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Scorpion on July 03, 2011, 12:00:19 PM
Maybe.....he axle loaded......THE CHASSIS!
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Vertigo on July 03, 2011, 12:01:16 PM
Maybe.....he axle loaded......THE CHASSIS!
Good point there, maybe it is a super glitch that involves other known glitches
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Scorpion on July 03, 2011, 12:09:24 PM
Well, scrap said he came across it when building a backyard ripper rebuild, if that helps.
Also, another thing we can see is that chassis size doesn't seem to matter, but apart from sages bot all the chassis' have been at maximum size, which COULD mean it's easier to do like that?

BTW, which button is pause inside the botlab?
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Vertigo on July 03, 2011, 12:11:28 PM
Its on the top right of the keyboard, says break underneath it

Clue Number 1
You need a control board

Clue Number 2
F12 can be used to make the glitch work

Clue Number 3
Components other than a Control Board do not have to bee mounted to make the glitch work

Clue Number 4
Something happens to the collision meshes

Clue Number 5
It is harder to pull off than Snapper Loading

Clue Number 6
Chassis size doesn't matter, but it could be easier in a larger chassis, like normal stacking
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: NFX on July 03, 2011, 12:13:19 PM
There should be a Pause button on your keyboard. Mines is beside the PrtSc button.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Vertigo on July 03, 2011, 12:15:39 PM
Aha, he didn't show us making the chassis, meaning that he did something in-between building the chassis and the part shown

Clue Number 7
Something must be done in-between making the chassis and attaching the final components
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: NFX on July 03, 2011, 12:17:30 PM
My initial guess was that there was a Smartzone underneath with stuff on it. It didn't work.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Skiitzzox220 on July 03, 2011, 12:18:14 PM
Aha, he didn't show us making the chassis, meaning that he did something in-between building the chassis and the part shown

Clue Number 7
Something must be done in-between making the chassis and attaching the final components
Jesus you're getting these noted fast. But it'll probably end up being Garvin or someone who discovers it.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Vertigo on July 03, 2011, 12:19:19 PM
Aha, he didn't show us making the chassis, meaning that he did something in-between building the chassis and the part shown

Clue Number 7
Something must be done in-between making the chassis and attaching the final components
Jesus you're getting these noted fast. But it'll probably end up being Garvin or someone who discovers it.
What?

Garvin doesn't appear to have the intellectual capacity required
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Scorpion on July 03, 2011, 12:20:05 PM
I tried spamming stuff in the chassis, thinking it might have something to do with too many components being on at one point, i don't think it's worked though...

And no Skiitzzoxzzzxyzxyzxzyxyz, it will be vertigo or NFX or me I reckon ;P
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Skiitzzox220 on July 03, 2011, 12:20:54 PM
Aha, he didn't show us making the chassis, meaning that he did something in-between building the chassis and the part shown

Clue Number 7
Something must be done in-between making the chassis and attaching the final components
Jesus you're getting these noted fast. But it'll probably end up being Garvin or someone who discovers it.
What?

Garvin doesn't appear to have the intellectual capacity required
I was just saying how you're finding clues and backing up your theories pretty fast, and good point
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Meganerdbomb on July 03, 2011, 12:20:57 PM
I hope Garvin figures it out and releases it. Then it will be forever known as the Garvey Glitch and Garvin will be given vet status.

Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Sage on July 03, 2011, 12:34:03 PM
We released proof that we figured it out, thus credit belongs to us (or rather scrap).
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: NFX on July 03, 2011, 12:38:07 PM
Credit should really go to Scrap for discovering this. However, you haven't exactly posted proof of it yet, it could be AAM for all any of us know.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Meganerdbomb on July 03, 2011, 12:38:59 PM

So it does not matter if they tell or not, but if somebody (not the foul language guy) ANYBODY else discovers it and tells....they will get the credit!
Sorry Sage. Acams has spoken.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: G.K. on July 03, 2011, 12:58:02 PM
Sage, for me, the vid is proof enough, but note that others cannot accept it yet. for all they know, you could have modified the collision meshes of those two components - hence Joe suggesting the use of F12.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Urjak on July 03, 2011, 01:46:36 PM
The only difference (or at least the only one I recall) between this video and the one removed (I saw it before if was removed) is that in the first one scrap (or whoever was doing) alternated between tabs, as if snapper loading. Is that part of the secret?

EDIT: And another thing. I tried replicating the same size chassis they had (largest possible baseplate, height around that of an HP Z-tech), and got around 170 kg with aluminum armor. This is 33 kg less than what the video shows (with titanium armor the weight goes over 207 kg). This leads me to believe that there are other components somewhere that we don't see.

Or maybe I am just over-complicating this and my observations are irrelevant. Ah well, can't hurt to try.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Gazea2 on July 03, 2011, 02:23:48 PM
Very nice observations, Vertigo. At the moment, I think we're getting a lot closer.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: kill343gs on July 03, 2011, 02:24:55 PM
You people are trying way too hard
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Gazea2 on July 03, 2011, 02:26:42 PM
This might be the only way that we find out, though.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: ACAMS on July 03, 2011, 02:52:46 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=39sdEddFsIM# (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=39sdEddFsIM#)


there's the vid. i hope it's proof enough.


Why heck, I have been able to do that for years......but it is cheating because you have to edit the files.




That is the goose hax.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Scorpion on July 03, 2011, 02:55:17 PM
The only difference (or at least the only one I recall) between this video and the one removed (I saw it before if was removed) is that in the first one scrap (or whoever was doing) alternated between tabs, as if snapper loading. Is that part of the secret?

EDIT: And another thing. I tried replicating the same size chassis they had (largest possible baseplate, height around that of an HP Z-tech), and got around 170 kg with aluminum armor. This is 33 kg less than what the video shows (with titanium armor the weight goes over 207 kg). This leads me to believe that there are other components somewhere that we don't see.

Or maybe I am just over-complicating this and my observations are irrelevant. Ah well, can't hurt to try.
I imagine, if that's the only real difference, that WILL be why, and well noticed on the chassis thing as well, I thought it looked to heavy to me.

This might be the only way that we find out, though.
I imagine it's just a case of when somebody comes across this, possibly by accident, then we should be able to figure things out.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Gazea2 on July 03, 2011, 02:57:11 PM
Hopefully. I can't see Sage releasing it any time soon.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Scorpion on July 03, 2011, 03:00:47 PM
Maybe scrap daddy will, if we just all bribe him with cupcakes...
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Gazea2 on July 03, 2011, 03:02:25 PM
Key word: Maybe. I really hope so. I have thought up loads of awesome designs that could be possible with this glitch.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Scorpion on July 03, 2011, 03:05:33 PM
I'm just gonna leave this here....
(http://www.conceivablytech.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/06/cupcake2.jpg)
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Meganerdbomb on July 03, 2011, 03:09:46 PM
If it wasn't for Sage's involvement in this, I'd say Scrap was just trolling us. Of course, maybe he recruited Sage to go along with this to make us think it was legit. Or maybe Garvin really will discover the secret on his own and troll all of you.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: 09090901 on July 03, 2011, 03:10:43 PM
Am I the only one who thinks that we would be better off if they don't release it? I mean splitting stock into "super stock"  sounds dumb IMO and all it would do is cause more controversy. Personally, I enjoy the way stock is now. Though if it is released it would most likely be branded like aam and bfe so it wouldnt ruin stock.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Fracture on July 03, 2011, 04:18:06 PM
Why does exciting stuff always happen when I leave the forums

*proceeds to finish reading thread*
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Sage on July 03, 2011, 04:37:16 PM
urjak is right... we used titanium armor.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Scorpion on July 03, 2011, 04:40:37 PM
Any particular reason as to why you were using titanium?  :mrgreen:
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Sage on July 03, 2011, 04:42:52 PM
Any particular reason as to why you were using titanium?  :mrgreen:


uhhhhhh
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: FOTEPX on July 03, 2011, 04:43:26 PM
Any particular reason as to why you were using titanium?  :mrgreen:


uhhhhhh

I think we've cracked it.

Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: cephalopod on July 03, 2011, 04:49:04 PM
They'd surely be less obvious if we cracked it, they'd lie and say no. XD
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Sage on July 03, 2011, 04:51:39 PM
maybe thats what we want you to think
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Scorpion on July 03, 2011, 04:56:30 PM
To carry on vertigo's list

Clue Number 1
You need a control board

Clue Number 2
F12 can be used to make the glitch work

Clue Number 3
Components other than a Control Board do not have to bee mounted to make the glitch work

Clue Number 4
Something happens to the collision meshes

Clue Number 5
It is harder to pull off than Snapper Loading

Clue Number 6
Chassis size doesn't matter, but it could be easier in a larger chassis, like normal stacking


Clue Number 7
Something must be done in-between making the chassis and attaching the final components

Clue Number 8
Switching tabs like in snapper loading seems to be a part of the glitch

Clue Number 9
Titanium armour is either important, or sage is just being trolly...
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Enigm@ on July 03, 2011, 04:58:30 PM
Maybe everyone will riot against Scarppy and Sage and the forum will fall to shambles.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: 09090901 on July 03, 2011, 05:03:23 PM
This thread reminds me of the game Clue :\
Also I learned how how to make motors spin after you remove the control board.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: J on July 03, 2011, 05:03:50 PM
Clue Number 5
It is harder to pull off than Snapper Loading
Well I'm out.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Dexterhunter on July 03, 2011, 05:06:45 PM
Weird, are we on the onset of transitioning into a 'Hax mode' Era? Or is this thing just getting blown out of proportion? Haha.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Scorpion on July 03, 2011, 05:07:25 PM
This thread reminds me of the game Clue :\
Also I learned how how to make motors spin after you remove the control board.
You mean working as wired as well?
If do then voila, another very handy glitch!
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: 09090901 on July 03, 2011, 05:09:12 PM
This thread reminds me of the game Clue :\
Also I learned how how to make motors spin after you remove the control board.
You mean working as wired as well?
If do then voila, another very handy glitch!
Sorta, you have no control over it as it constantly spins. You can still attach stuff though. Sorry for offtopic.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Scorpion on July 03, 2011, 05:10:58 PM
This thread reminds me of the game Clue :\
Also I learned how how to make motors spin after you remove the control board.
You mean working as wired as well?
If do then voila, another very handy glitch!
Sorta, it's completely useless though.
If it works in DSL, not so useless...

EDIT: i'm blaming tiredness here for forgetting why i thought it would be usefull in stock, when it's obvious.
Saves time stacking CB's into batteries.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: ACAMS on July 03, 2011, 05:20:02 PM
I have thought up loads of awesome designs that could be possible with this glitch.


You don't need that, just gmf edit.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: NFX on July 03, 2011, 05:23:03 PM
This thread reminds me of the game Clue :\
Also I learned how how to make motors spin after you remove the control board.
You mean working as wired as well?
If do then voila, another very handy glitch!
Sorta, you have no control over it as it constantly spins. You can still attach stuff though. Sorry for offtopic.
I just discovered this as well! Are you tapping into my mind in some way? If you are, I advise you get out now.
 
I don't think it's very useful at all, though. And it doesn't affect hax mode.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Sage on July 03, 2011, 05:26:19 PM
lol acams is hatin.

One thing I will tell you is this glitch is legit. I'll try one more video to prove it without giving away how to do it.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: NFX on July 03, 2011, 05:32:13 PM
I'm guessing it's to do with the HPZ motor somehow...and if it's discovery was during a Backyard Ripper rebuild, then it's got nothing to do with Air Tanks, Pistons or Smartzones. Probably.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Sage on July 03, 2011, 06:07:06 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k6G1dSAB1uw# (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k6G1dSAB1uw#)
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: J on July 03, 2011, 06:20:58 PM
Sage now has it on voice-command.
More proof he actually is a wizard.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: FOTEPX on July 03, 2011, 06:25:04 PM
My verdict:

Sage = American Harry Potter
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: 123savethewhales on July 03, 2011, 06:28:27 PM
My verdict:

Sage = American Harry Potter
I like to say "I told you so"?  He is clearly a short green wild bearded sage with the staff of inner growth.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: System32 on July 03, 2011, 06:59:46 PM
I love how all the arguments for keeping this glitch away from the public are poorly hidden elitist remarks or versions of "because I said so".
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Sage on July 03, 2011, 07:05:30 PM
I love how all the arguments for keeping this glitch away from the public are poorly hidden elitist remarks or versions of "because I said so".

most of the arguments for showing it are "i wanna know!"
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Skiitzzox220 on July 03, 2011, 07:07:58 PM
I'm surprised no ones asked why the axle and wheel are there, could just be to throw us off the trail (Or maybe they understand Sage's voice?)
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: 123savethewhales on July 03, 2011, 07:13:05 PM
I love how all the arguments for keeping this glitch away from the public are poorly hidden elitist remarks or versions of "because I said so".
I thought they were blatantly obvious elitist remarks.  Actually elitism, or a very selected few people are significantly more responsible than everyone else, is the whole basis of their argument.

The way I see it, the vast majority of the community are responsible enough, but a few n00bs do exist which can cause a lot of troubles.

I love how all the arguments for keeping this glitch away from the public are poorly hidden elitist remarks or versions of "because I said so".
most of the arguments for showing it are "i wanna know!"
Yes, and I didn't even try to hide that fact.  Obviously if I don't want to know then I could of care less.

Even so, elitism is a terrible reason for justifying why "I wanna know" is bad.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Sage on July 03, 2011, 07:17:05 PM
It's not elitism... it's kinda like buried treasure. If you find it, you're not gonna share it with the whole world. Just good friends and family.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: kill343gs on July 03, 2011, 07:27:39 PM
D'aww, I'm sage's older brother!
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: System32 on July 03, 2011, 07:35:06 PM
I love how all the arguments for keeping this glitch away from the public are poorly hidden elitist remarks or versions of "because I said so".
most of the arguments for showing it are "i wanna know!"
Not really. It's a major underlying reason sure, but the arguments I've seen are thus follows:
Arguments against releasing the "Hax Mode" Glitch:

1#:
Good decision not to release it, though. It would pretty much be the end of Stock building if everyone could stack anything into anything and there was no need to learn Snapper Loading, Axle Loading, extender setups or anything like that. But well done on making it work. =]
Elitism argument.

2#:
I think their main concern is that it would cause the death of Stock Building by allowing stuff like this. One way around this would be to treat it like the Realistic Rule in DSL. You CAN build undealistic designs in DSL, stuff like Stacking and eFFe glitching, but it's banned in tournaments and competitive building and things. In the same sense, you COULD build using superstacking in Stock, but it would probably be banned in tournaments. Because most people work on legal tournament building concepts, I don't think they'd focus on the superstacking glitch too much, given that they wouldn't actually be able to utilise it very much. I think it's up to Scrap and Sage, though, it's really their call on whether to disclose their secrets or not.
This is a doom and gloom argument.

3#:
another reason would be that people who can't stack or use glitches to save their lives can make lets say a regular 36HS with the glitch, and no one would notice because the bot could be built without it. definitely want to know how to do it tho
Elitism.

4#:
True, but if we can't use it why release it in the first place.
Why not? This is basically a "I'm not realeasing it because I said so" argument.

5#:
Don't release it otherwise stock popularity would decline within probably about a year. And to be honest it would effect everyone by a good bit and the robot building will become so easy even for beginners. Then probably a good amount of people would leave such as me and this forum would become DSL only forum for about two years and then it would be dead forever. RA2 will become a fully pledged `thing of the past`so release it and RA2 will be in its grave in about two years.
So if this forum wants to live for another 5 years then don't say anything about that glitch.
Doomsaying and a nice elitism start off. Don't want those newbies learing how to play, they might get better than me!

6#:
Gets rid of creativity pretty much.
And it means that noobs can create bots that are equal to vets and such :o
First statement is historically wrong. Second statement is elitist.


The rest of the arguments were refuted or reposted by DSLer's.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: ACAMS on July 03, 2011, 08:09:57 PM
OK, I will admit that it looks like there is a secret, BUT whoever shows how it works gets the credit  :gawe:




Who knows.....it may even be something different.


The Garvin Glitch will be revealed soon folks.
 



Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: kill343gs on July 03, 2011, 08:11:07 PM
GUIZE JUST SHOW IT ITS NOT A BIG DEAL
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Urjak on July 03, 2011, 08:12:38 PM
123STW is aboslutely right, there is no good reason to keep secret. If I ever discover how to do Hax Mode I would release it in a heartbeat. If stock crumbles as a result then so be it, at least we don't have a bunch of "elite" deciding what is and isn't good for the rest of the stock builders.

The key here is that only when the glitch is released will we have any idea what the effects will be. Glitches that have more potential than Hax, such as BFE and AAM, haven't ruined stock and yet they are not all that hard to learn (someone even posted a BFE guide a while back). Thus there is no reason to believe that revealing how Hax Mode works will harm or even change Stock in any way.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: R0B0SH4RK on July 03, 2011, 08:17:42 PM
@ S32:
OR you could have mentioned ACAMS's arguments that releasing this glitch would make BFE/AAM absolutely impossible to check for. Hence, it would be possible for people to blatantly cheat, and we'd never know the difference between hax mode and what we have long considered illegaly built robots.

By the way, why is elitism so bad? They put in the time and effort and brainpower to figure it out, not you. They're entitled to do with their knowledge what they see fit. If Sage and Scrap don't release the methods of how to do it, as long as they don't use it themselves, their discovery has absolutely no effect on us whatsoever.


Why heck, I have been able to do that for years......but it is cheating because you have to edit the files.




That is the goose hax.

^ Why did NOBODY acknowledge this quote? I'm curious about this now, please explain.


@ Sage:
I didn't doubt you before, but to tell you the truth, the second video made me pretty skeptical. How can you activate a process that is from what I understand similar to snapper loading through a voice command? To me, it looks like you've just written a script or program that is similar in nature to NC's movepixel tool, which has allowed you to "activate" Hax mode. In other words, I don't think it's legit. And until I see convincing evidence otherwise (i.e. you show me how to do it), I don't think I can trust you guys on this one. Sorry, man  :(
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: 123savethewhales on July 03, 2011, 08:21:38 PM
123STW   is aboslutely right, there is no good reason to keep secret. If I ever   discover how to do Hax Mode I would release it in a heartbeat. If stock   crumbles as a result then so be it, at least we don't have a bunch of   "elite" deciding what is and isn't good for the rest of the stock   builders.

The key here is that only when the glitch is released   will we have any idea what the effects will be. Glitches that have more   potential than Hax, such as BFE and AAM, haven't ruined stock and yet   they are not all that hard to learn (someone even posted a BFE guide a   while back). Thus there is no reason to believe that revealing how Hax   Mode works will harm or even change Stock in any way.

Well, I won't go that far.  I will say that if his reason is solely to keep it to himself and his close group, he may do so because he did discover it.

People have the right to be selfish with the things they discover, which is fine if the person is willing to admit to that.  It's just all the other stuff about ruining the community or for the better of us all that I have problems with.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Mr. AS on July 03, 2011, 08:23:30 PM
Just ban the glitch in tournaments and having "all stock building crumble" won't be a problem.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Urjak on July 03, 2011, 08:25:12 PM
@ S32:
OR you could have mentioned ACAMS's arguments that releasing this glitch would make BFE/AAM absolutely impossible to check for. Hence, it would be possible for people to blatantly cheat, and we'd never know the difference between hax mode and what we have long considered illegaly built robots.


This makes zero sense. Unless there is a tournament that allows BFE and not Hax Mode, or Hax Mode and not BFE, then there is no complication. We use common sense to screen out BFE, and we can do the same for Hax mode. If there was a tournament where one was legal and not the other (namely Hax mode allowed, BFE not), then all you have to do is look out for bots that have traits that can't be achieved via Hax Mode (such as an incredibly small chassis or random floating components).

Well, I won't go that far.  I will say that if his reason is solely to keep it to himself and his close group, he may do so because he did discover it.

People have the right to be selfish with the things they discover, which is fine if the person is willing to admit to that.  It's just all the other stuff about ruining the community or for the better of us all that I have problems with.

I think you misunderstand me. I was saying that people who know the glitch have no grounds to say that its disclosure would ruin stock, as this would have them acting as if they know what is best for the rest of us. I fully believe that Sage and Scrap have no obligation to reveal the glitch.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: 123savethewhales on July 03, 2011, 08:28:14 PM
@ S32:
OR you could have mentioned ACAMS's arguments that releasing this glitch would make BFE/AAM absolutely impossible to check for. Hence, it would be possible for people to blatantly cheat, and we'd never know the difference between hax mode and what we have long considered illegaly built robots.


This makes zero sense. Unless there is a tournament that allows BFE and not Hax Mode, or Hax Mode and not BFE, then there is no complication. We use common sense to screen out BFE, and we can do the same for Hax mode. If there was a tournament where one was legal and not the other (namely Hax mode allowed, BFE not), then all you have to do is look out for bots that have traits that can't be achieved via Hax Mode (such as an incredibly small chassis or random floating components).
I don't know, judging by the video Sage just voice command the part to no collision, it almost seem easier than BFE.

So then nobody will bother using BFE if you can do that.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Urjak on July 03, 2011, 08:29:22 PM
So then nobody will bother using BFE if you can do that.


And then what? We just ban Hax Mode and we will be fine.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: 123savethewhales on July 03, 2011, 08:30:57 PM
Well yeah.  I am just saying HAX mode bringing in BFE wouldn't even be a problem because voice commanding parts to no collision is easier than typing things in.

I mean, who cares about BFE if you are allowing HAX mode to begin with?  Why do you even need to distinguish a legit HAX mode bot from a BFE one that can be build using HAX mode?  Because BFE is easier?  Well not according to this video.  It's like, who's going to bother using AAM when you can BFE?

Now maybe Sage actually need to stuff up on tinctures and spend a lot of Mana point casting a spell on his machine.  Again, all we see is voice command and going from not stackable to stackable in an instant.  So we have to assume it's easy once activated.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: 123savethewhales on July 03, 2011, 08:46:43 PM
By the way, why is elitism so bad?
Foul language removed
While that is a legitimate question, it does however hold no truth whatsoever on GTM.  Vast majority of the GTM population does show that they can "not cheat".  Take DSL for example, the only people who ever try to push through the realistic rules are first time n00bs or the "respectable" competitive players (ex.  Naryar with Narmour, me trying to push for hollow motor).  Nobody else has any problem building non questionable things.

So I will say elitism in this context is bad because it does not match empirical evidence, making it nothing more than prejudices.

Elitism is a bad thing like baby raping and racism is a bad thing.
I for one think baby raping is a lot worst than both elitism and racism combine.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Clickbeetle on July 03, 2011, 09:03:30 PM
Why has this glitch blown up into an 18-page argument?  I don't get it.


You want the glitch released?  Why?  It will be banned in tournaments anyway.  If you only want to mess around with it non-competitively, you can use BFE or AAM just as easily.  This glitch does NOTHING NEW.  It just does it in a DIFFERENT WAY.  In fact, if I'm reading it right, it's actually less powerful than BFE or AAM.


Are Sage and Scrap just trolling us?  I don't think so, but for the sake of argument, suppose they are.  Now ask yourself: so what?  What's the big deal?  It only matters whether Hax Mode is real or not if you really want to know how to do it.  And if you really want to know how to do it, see the previous paragraph.


Honestly, when I first saw this, I was impressed that such a thing was possible, but I didn't think it could be that big of a deal.  It's too powerful to ever be accepted as a legal glitch, which basically makes it another alternative to BFE and AAM.


Keep the glitch hidden, or release it, it doesn't matter to me and I don't see why it should matter to anyone else.


Edit: If this argument spirals much further down the toilet it will be in danger of facing the lockhammer... right now it's still within the realm of reason but I can see some of System32's posts in particular pushing it over the edge.  Tone it down please.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: 123savethewhales on July 03, 2011, 09:11:34 PM
Curiosity kills a cat, even Schrodinger's cat isn't safe from that.

I mean, if they pull a "I gonna give you a sneak peek at our new trick but I won't show you", of course they are going to attract attention.

If they don't want the attention, then why give a public sneak peek?  They could have really kept it to themselves by not making TLT.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Sage on July 03, 2011, 09:31:41 PM
Click, it's not the same thing as BFE because it's done in-game. But I don't see why people are making such a huge deal either! We posted it to show a new discovery in RA2, and people just got upset that we wouldn't tell them how to do it. R0B0, sorry you don't trust me.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: 123savethewhales on July 03, 2011, 09:42:54 PM
If nobody is curious then you will have a thread with 0 replies and you won't get the attention you want out of this.  Now that you got their attention with you sneak peak, you expect people to just stop being curious?  Surely you don't expect to dangle a mice in front of a cat and take it away just when it pounces at it, without getting scratched.

Edit:  For future reference, this is how cats response to things they are curious about.
http://nyan.cat/ (http://nyan.cat/)
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Fracture on July 03, 2011, 09:48:34 PM
Click, it's not the same thing as BFE because it's done in-game.
True, but the final result is (almost) the same as BFE, and I think we should judge these kinds of things on what they do rather than how to do them. I'm really just seeing this as a branch off of BFE, a bit less potent and done in a different way. Anything having to do with it pretty much also has to do with BFE...if it's legalized in tourneys, so is BFE bar components outside the chassis and whatnot, because no one can tell the difference between the two methods. If BFE is banned right now, then so should Hax Mode if released, at least in regular tourneys.

I'm just surprised that it's only now that everyone is planning these "Super-Stacked" tournaments when those competitions could be easily done using BFE instead (again, without components outside the chassis).

I feel like if this is released it'll be like some newbie says they've discovered a new glitch and it turns out they've just re-released BFE to the public.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: LiNcK on July 03, 2011, 10:13:43 PM
Honestly I think they should release it & THen get it banned from Tournaments.
That way you KNOW that everybody knows the glitch & That nobody is allowed to use it, If someone else discovers it & Uses it discreetly (Not stacking the things THAT much) they will have an advantage over other people.

If its release, Everybody knows it & Knows that its banned, You can also identify it correctly... Because honestly, If UDK how to do the glitch & You see something stacked just a bit more than usual you wont be like: OH! ITS SAGE & SCRAPS GLITCH!!! :OOO


Im just saying that it doesnt necessarily have to ruin RA2, Its like not doing Atomic Research because making Atomic Bombs is bad... Youre not only making Atomic bombs, What about the Power Plants & Other useful things? A law on prohibing atomic bomb use is enough to contain the problem.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: R0B0SH4RK on July 03, 2011, 10:21:44 PM
@ Sage: Nothing to do with a fundamental trust thing, just skepticism. Nothing personal, just business y'know.


@ S32:
OR you could have mentioned ACAMS's arguments that releasing this glitch would make BFE/AAM absolutely impossible to check for. Hence, it would be possible for people to blatantly cheat, and we'd never know the difference between hax mode and what we have long considered illegaly built robots.

This makes zero sense. Unless there is a tournament that allows BFE and not Hax Mode, or Hax Mode and not BFE, then there is no complication. We use common sense to screen out BFE, and we can do the same for Hax mode. If there was a tournament where one was legal and not the other (namely Hax mode allowed, BFE not), then all you have to do is look out for bots that have traits that can't be achieved via Hax Mode (such as an incredibly small chassis or random floating components).


But it's entirely possible that someone could make a bot with a normal sized chassis and not-floating components that looks like they used hax mode, but they used BFE to do it. Hell, that's what I'd do if I were so inclined (and knew how to BFE). So, common sense should consequently tell you "I have no idea whether this bot was built using BFE of Hax mode." This point should make a lot of sense if you're understanding what I'm writing. But hey, we're on the internet. Misunderstandings are easy :3


@ S32: I could be nasty and yell and swear and fling insults right back at you, but I won't. It's pointless. Waste of both of our times.

The whole point is to keep things away from people to spite them.

If this is what you believe is happening right now, than you're far more cynical then I've ever given you credit for. The "social circle" you're currently referring to consists of the two people who figured the glitch out, no more. I don't consider that much of a "social circle" at all. And as far as I can tell, Sage and Scrap are spiting no one, especially not you. If they started distributing it to select members, encouraging its use in tourneys, and then making a huge deal out of it then yes, I can see where you're coming from, but right now it's still at the "hey guys lookie what we just found out! Ain't that cool??" stage. "What's f*cking happening right now" isn't keeping Hax mode a secret to spite members, "what's happening right now" isn't "purely disgusting," "what's happening right now" is a bunch of guys trying to decide where we go from here, and ultimately, Scrap and Sage are entitled to do as they please with their discovery. They can release it to the public, or they can lock it away and make sure it never sees the light of day again.

I will throw in one caveat though: if they choose to keep the secret and either of them enters a bot into a tourney that has used this glitch (if it is actually a glitch), then EVERYBODY has the right to the knowledge because at this point, it stops becoming something cool that they found and starts becoming priveleged information. At this point, you can start screaming "elitist!" and I'll be right there beside you. But now is not the time to be angry, or even really care. It doesn't effect either of us or anyone on this forum.

I'm in a class where by default all forms of elitism used at large are there to put me and everyone I know personally down.

Well, it's a damn good thing that we're all just pixels on each others computer screens, otherwise socio-economic classes might actually matter here. Point is, don't sweat this one man. Just relax and see where this goes from here :)
 
 
 
 
EDIT: Holy crap LiNcK, that made a lot of sense.




Foul language removed....user warned
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: 090901 on July 03, 2011, 10:29:54 PM
welllll
even if it was banned from tourneys, people could still use it to stack blacks and cb in blacks
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: 123savethewhales on July 03, 2011, 10:35:17 PM
I vote that LiNck is the only person that made complete sense here at this point.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Urjak on July 03, 2011, 10:39:39 PM

But it's entirely possible that someone could make a bot with a normal sized chassis and not-floating components that looks like they used hax mode, but they used BFE to do it. Hell, that's what I'd do if I were so inclined (and knew how to BFE). So, common sense should consequently tell you "I have no idea whether this bot was built using BFE of Hax mode." This point should make a lot of sense if you're understanding what I'm writing. But hey, we're on the internet. Misunderstandings are easy :3


I am not saying they are easy to tell apart, I am saying that all we have to do is outlaw both Hax Mode and BFE and the whole problem goes away. I can't think of a situation where being able to tell the difference between the two of them would be of much importance.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Meganerdbomb on July 03, 2011, 10:40:12 PM
I'm with S32 on this. The arguments against releasing this DO smack of elitism. There was talk at one point of releasing this to Click and Trov and no one else, which would be straight up elitism. All the same, sombody else WILL figure this out eventually, and I hope it's Garvin, Sparkles, or FAPTEX. We could call it the Garv Glitch, Sparkle Stacking and FAP mode respectively.

Also, if it's released, I think it SHOULD be considered legal. Rather than being the death of stock, it might help keep it from stagnating a little longer. Sure I can see the problem with Hax mode being indistinguishable from BFE, but if they don't accomplish anything by BFE that they couldn't without the glitch what's the big deal? I happen to hate trying to stack black batteries. I find it harder than axle loading and the eFFe glitch for some reason. If I used BFE to stack two blacks in my bot, and entered it in a tournament, nobody would know, and if they did, would they care?
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: J on July 03, 2011, 10:43:42 PM
I vote that LiNck is the only person that made complete sense here at this point.
Because we all know Sage would try and ninja his way into "sneaking" a few hax-glitches into bots he entered in tournaments and junk.
But it would be all in good humor, really.

We could call it the Garv Glitch, Sparkle Stacking and FAP mode respectively.
Methinks that was on purpose.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Urjak on July 03, 2011, 10:46:49 PM
I vote that LiNck is the only person that made complete sense here at this point.


Sense making I'm complete!


Stupid N00bish joke aside, what LiNck just posted sums up my viewpoint (and probably several other members').
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Meganerdbomb on July 03, 2011, 10:49:58 PM
We could call it the Garv Glitch, Sparkle Stacking and FAP mode respectively.
Methinks that was on purpose.
Of course it was. Just who the heck do you think I am?

If Jonzu discovers it, we'll call it the Super Furry Dawn Glitch. If I discover it, I'll release it as Pinkie Pie Oatmeal Mode.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: R0B0SH4RK on July 03, 2011, 10:50:18 PM

But it's entirely possible that someone could make a bot with a normal sized chassis and not-floating components that looks like they used hax mode, but they used BFE to do it. Hell, that's what I'd do if I were so inclined (and knew how to BFE). So, common sense should consequently tell you "I have no idea whether this bot was built using BFE of Hax mode." This point should make a lot of sense if you're understanding what I'm writing. But hey, we're on the internet. Misunderstandings are easy :3


I am not saying they are easy to tell apart, I am saying that all we have to do is outlaw both Hax Mode and BFE and the whole problem goes away. I can't think of a situation where being able to tell the difference between the two of them would be of much importance.

Funny, I've been saying the same thing too. Although the dialogue between you and I has never been what should happen, but the consequences of a or b happening. Oh well.
 
 
@MNB: It took two guys who have logged unholy amounts of hours in the stock game eight years to finally figure it out and release that it's possible. It's entirely possible that it takes years for others to figure it out too, and somebody else may not figure it out at all. For the whole community knowing how to enter hax mode, it may be now or never. We just don't know.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Meganerdbomb on July 03, 2011, 10:54:03 PM

But it's entirely possible that someone could make a bot with a normal sized chassis and not-floating components that looks like they used hax mode, but they used BFE to do it. Hell, that's what I'd do if I were so inclined (and knew how to BFE). So, common sense should consequently tell you "I have no idea whether this bot was built using BFE of Hax mode." This point should make a lot of sense if you're understanding what I'm writing. But hey, we're on the internet. Misunderstandings are easy :3


I am not saying they are easy to tell apart, I am saying that all we have to do is outlaw both Hax Mode and BFE and the whole problem goes away. I can't think of a situation where being able to tell the difference between the two of them would be of much importance.

Funny, I've been saying the same thing too. Although the dialogue between you and I has never been what should happen, but the consequences of a or b happening. Oh well.
 
 
@MNB: It took two guys who have logged unholy amounts of hours in the stock game eight years to finally figure it out and release that it's possible. It's entirely possible that it takes years for others to figure it out too, and somebody else may not figure it out at all. For the whole community knowing how to enter hax mode, it may be now or never. We just don't know.
Ahh, but once they realized it was possible, how long did it actually take them to figure out how to replicate it? I don't think any of the people I mentioned will discover it though. My money's on Vertigo or Joe Blo.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Enigm@ on July 03, 2011, 10:54:59 PM
 :rolleyes: this thread.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: R0B0SH4RK on July 03, 2011, 10:56:14 PM
@MNB: Once they realized it was possible, it took them three years. Not months or weeks or days. Years.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: 123savethewhales on July 03, 2011, 10:59:01 PM
I vote that LiNck is the only person that made complete sense here at this point.
Sense making I'm complete!

Stupid N00bish joke aside, what LiNck just posted sums up my viewpoint (and probably several other members').
Well it does, it's just he put it in a very compact and complete way.  You don't have to read through 5 or 6 pages to get the whole thing.

Now, naturally this also means I agree with him, otherwise I will argue it makes no sense and try to break it apart word by word.


But it's entirely possible that someone could make a bot with a normal sized chassis and not-floating components that looks like they used hax mode, but they used BFE to do it. Hell, that's what I'd do if I were so inclined (and knew how to BFE). So, common sense should consequently tell you "I have no idea whether this bot was built using BFE of Hax mode." This point should make a lot of sense if you're understanding what I'm writing. But hey, we're on the internet. Misunderstandings are easy :3


I am not saying they are easy to tell apart, I am saying that all we have to do is outlaw both Hax Mode and BFE and the whole problem goes away. I can't think of a situation where being able to tell the difference between the two of them would be of much importance.

Funny, I've been saying the same thing too. Although the dialogue between you and I has never been what should happen, but the consequences of a or b happening. Oh well.
 
 
@MNB: It took two guys who have logged unholy amounts of hours in the stock game eight years to finally figure it out and release that it's possible. It's entirely possible that it takes years for others to figure it out too, and somebody else may not figure it out at all. For the whole community knowing how to enter hax mode, it may be now or never. We just don't know.
Ahh, but once they realized it was possible, how long did it actually take them to figure out how to replicate it? I don't think any of the people I mentioned will discover it though. My money's on Vertigo or Joe Blo.
Highly doubt it.  This is not something a trial and error test can verify.  You can't find it through rational systematic testing, it almost requires an accident.

Otherwise I would have found it by now.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Sage on July 03, 2011, 10:59:39 PM
@MNB: Once they realized it was possible, it took them three years. Not months or weeks or days. Years.

I thought you didn't think it was true?

Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Enigm@ on July 03, 2011, 11:01:15 PM
I agree with S32 on this.
Also, I don't believe this is the doom of stock. I can't stack for shiznit, and this I think would be handy for people like me who can't stack.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Meganerdbomb on July 03, 2011, 11:02:35 PM
Actually, reading back, it was JUST Scrap who discovered it. Sage only knows because Scrap taught him. Anyway, I really doubt I'd use this even if it was released, so I'll just GTFO now.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Urjak on July 03, 2011, 11:02:48 PM
@MNB: Once they realized it was possible, it took them three years. Not months or weeks or days. Years.



This is the sad part. In keeping it secret, they are forcing other members to go back and do possibly months (or even years apparently) to get to the same level of progress that would be achieved if Sage and Scrap shared their knowledge. That is how progress happens, people put time and effort into something and then share the fruits of their labor so that other members can build off of it instead of working from the ground up.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Enigm@ on July 03, 2011, 11:05:05 PM
Honestly, it's just not worth it for a game like RA2.
I have to give Scarp credit, I don't have that kinda perseverance.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: 123savethewhales on July 03, 2011, 11:06:44 PM
@MNB: Once they realized it was possible, it took them three years. Not months or weeks or days. Years.
This is the sad part. In keeping it secret, they are forcing other members to go back and do possibly months (or even years apparently) to get to the same level of progress that would be achieved if Sage and Scrap shared their knowledge. That is how progress happens, people put time and effort into something and then share the fruits of their labor so that other members can build off of it instead of working from the ground up.
Accidents doesn't happen just because you are actively trying to test for it.  You won't find it even if you try.  After all, what can you try besides play more and hope to bump into it?
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: R0B0SH4RK on July 03, 2011, 11:10:15 PM
@MNB: Once they realized it was possible, it took them three years. Not months or weeks or days. Years.

I thought you didn't think it was true?

Skepticism =/= denial, my friend.
 
And I've been talking from both sides of the release it/don't release it argument an awful lot here. For someone that's fairly indefferent as to what you guys decide to do, I've got myself quite involved.
 
I still can't get over the fact that your voice sounds JUST LIKE someone I know.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Urjak on July 03, 2011, 11:11:31 PM
Accidents doesn't happen just because you are actively trying to test for it.  You won't find it even if you try.  After all, what can you try besides play more and hope to bump into it?


Well... taking that more pessimistic view, this could be one of the only real chances that this glitch will be added to the banks of RA2 knowledge.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Sage on July 03, 2011, 11:23:46 PM
I still can't get over the fact that your voice sounds JUST LIKE someone I know.

maybe I am O:
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: TriTon on July 04, 2011, 12:10:22 AM
From the videos, the glitch looks as if everything in the game doesn't have a collision mesh. Is that right?
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: G.K. on July 04, 2011, 01:52:21 AM
...What videos were you watching?
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: TriTon on July 04, 2011, 02:02:41 AM
...What videos were you watching?
The ones Sage put up showing us the glitch...?
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: R0B0SH4RK on July 04, 2011, 02:20:12 AM
Collision meshes are there, dude.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Squirrel_Monkey on July 04, 2011, 02:38:44 AM
One more thing, can it be used for external component overlapping? If so it could be used badly in DSL. i.e. Te difference between a lucky overlap and this Hax mode.
It may only be minor but it's just a slight concern for me.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: JoeBlo on July 04, 2011, 04:48:17 AM
Also, I don't believe this is the doom of stock.

Many of you are looking at the wrong side of the "Stock Apocalypse"..

As I explained to Sage its this half baked messy situation we have now that could drive players away..

Once you have a clean simple cut rules we can go on peacefully with our lives again.. we basically have to come together as a community and make a simple agreement about it.

As it stands now Sage and Scrap can technically use it in existing rule sets as its not listed as an outlawed glitch and fits within the "All building to be done in the botlab"

Now obviously tournaments can make up their own personal rulesets around it but general building standards/ rules and the case if nothing is specified (or forgotten to add) its all up in the air.. Same with the 140cm extender.. tournaments make specific comments about it (becasue we never came to a yes or no agreement)

Why I mention this is remember Sage and I slipped in the 140cm extender in our winning BOTM? no rules prevented it as it fitted within the ruleset of AI / Hidden parts unless specified otherwise.. now its not a big deal but something like limitless stacking is.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Enigm@ on July 04, 2011, 07:18:17 AM
Also, I don't believe this is the doom of stock.

Many of you are looking at the wrong side of the "Stock Apocalypse"..

As I explained to Sage its this half baked messy situation we have now that could drive players away..

Once you have a clean simple cut rules we can go on peacefully with our lives again.. we basically have to come together as a community and make a simple agreement about it.

As it stands now Sage and Scrap can technically use it in existing rule sets as its not listed as an outlawed glitch and fits within the "All building to be done in the botlab"

Now obviously tournaments can make up their own personal rulesets around it but general building standards/ rules and the case if nothing is specified (or forgotten to add) its all up in the air.. Same with the 140cm extender.. tournaments make specific comments about it (becasue we never came to a yes or no agreement)

Why I mention this is remember Sage and I slipped in the 140cm extender in our winning BOTM? no rules prevented it as it fitted within the ruleset of AI / Hidden parts unless specified otherwise.. now its not a big deal but something like limitless stacking is.
Stockocalypse? :gawe:
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: System32 on July 04, 2011, 09:02:02 AM
If this is what you believe is happening right now, than you're far more cynical then I've ever given you credit for. The "social circle" you're currently referring to consists of the two people who figured the glitch out, no more.
You are right, but as someone pointed out, Scrap discovered it. Not only that, Click, JoeBlo and Trov have a possibility of being included, making it a "social pentagon". Finally, you are asking for info on how to do it to curb your skepticism, making it a "social hexagon".
 
And as far as I can tell, Sage and Scrap are spiting no one, especially not you.
If preventing newer members and other members from utilizing a glitch that allows them to be as good as (and later, possibly better) themselves isn't spiteful, It's at least hypocritical considering all the advice they've given with other glitches and building techniques.
 

"What's happening right now" isn't keeping Hax mode a secret to spite members, "what's happening right now" isn't "purely disgusting,"
Yes it is, by proxy. Apart from ACAMS, (Who is just adding random info for people to think about) and some other guy who is derping, all of the people telling scrap and Sage to keep Hax Mode locked away from the public are using variants of this sentence: "Good job Sage and scrap! Keep it away from the newbs!"
 
"what's happening right now" is a bunch of guys trying to decide where we go from here, and ultimately, Scrap and Sage are entitled to do as they please with their discovery. They can release it to the public, or they can lock it away and make sure it never sees the light of day again.
Do you know how insane this sounds to me? If we weren't talking about elitism I'd think we were having an argument over anti-intellectualism.
 
It doesn't effect either of us or anyone on this forum.
21 pages in two days say something else.

 
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Somebody on July 04, 2011, 09:05:03 AM
Stockocalypse? :gawe:

I prefer aStockalypse.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: JoeBlo on July 04, 2011, 09:06:21 AM
I prefer aStockalypse.

Awesome name is awesome

Makes me want to make up a new mod solely to use that name :P
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: GoldenFox93 on July 04, 2011, 09:06:39 AM
Stockocalypse? :gawe:

I prefer aStockalypse.
aStockalypse Now?
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Somebody on July 04, 2011, 09:08:09 AM
Stockocalypse? :gawe:

I prefer aStockalypse.
aStockalypse Now?

Not yet. When its released.  :gawe:
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Squirrel_Monkey on July 04, 2011, 09:08:30 AM
I prefer aStockalypse.

Awesome name is awesome

Makes me want to make up a new mod solely to use that name :P
UI mod based off Motorstorm Apocalypse please!
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: GoldenFox93 on July 04, 2011, 09:22:13 AM
Stockocalypse? :gawe:

I prefer aStockalypse.
aStockalypse Now?

Not yet. When its released.  :gawe:
Well, if it gives me time to reference old war movies, so be it  :D
 
Until then, sing-along time! Who's the leader of the forum that's made for you and me...?
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Skiitzzox220 on July 04, 2011, 10:24:29 AM

I prefer aStockalypse.
^WINNAR^
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: kill343gs on July 04, 2011, 10:59:11 AM
If this is what you believe is happening right now, than you're far more cynical then I've ever given you credit for. The "social circle" you're currently referring to consists of the two people who figured the glitch out, no more.
You are right, but as someone pointed out, Scrap discovered it. Not only that, Click, JoeBlo and Trov have a possibility of being included, making it a "social pentagon". Finally, you are asking for info on how to do it to curb your skepticism, making it a "social hexagon".

Work on your geometry, because I know it too.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: System32 on July 04, 2011, 11:13:14 AM
If this is what you believe is happening right now, than you're far more cynical then I've ever given you credit for. The "social circle" you're currently referring to consists of the two people who figured the glitch out, no more.
You are right, but as someone pointed out, Scrap discovered it. Not only that, Click, JoeBlo and Trov have a possibility of being included (Not excluding kill), making it a "social hexagon". Finally, you are asking for info on how to do it to curb your skepticism, making it a "social heptagon".

Work on your geometry, because I know it too.
FIXED
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Meganerdbomb on July 04, 2011, 12:32:36 PM

iPhones are a pain to post with.
Remember when I said I was gonna gtfo this thread? I lied.
I've already said I'm with s32 on this. Now even more so. If it's going to be shared with anybody it should be shared with everybody. It won't bring about the death of stock, and if it's kept legal could even make some new designs possible. The difference between hax mode and BFE could be kept on an honor system. How many people would use Illegal BFE when they could use legal Hax mode? Especially when BFE is probably harder for most people. BFE that goes beyond the limitations of hax mode would stil be detectable.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: J on July 04, 2011, 02:03:47 PM
We could call it the Garv Glitch, Sparkle Stacking and FAP mode respectively.
Methinks that was on purpose.
Of course it was. Just who the heck do you think I am?

If Jonzu discovers it, we'll call it the Super Furry Dawn Glitch. If I discover it, I'll release it as Pinkie Pie Oatmeal Mode.
I saw what you did there.
And 'Oatmeal Mode' for a glitch name would be lulz
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Sparkey98 on July 04, 2011, 03:09:42 PM
I want it to be called the 'shut the heck up about it; it is illegal glitch'
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Scorpion on July 04, 2011, 03:15:38 PM
I want it to be called the 'shut the heck up about it; it is illegal glitch'
It isn't illegal, so that'd be a fairly stupid name for it...
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Sparkey98 on July 04, 2011, 03:17:01 PM
I want it to be called the 'shut the heck up about it; it is illegal glitch'
It isn't illegal, so that'd be a fairly stupid name for it...

Yet.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Scorpion on July 04, 2011, 03:22:00 PM
I want it to be called the 'shut the heck up about it; it is illegal glitch'
It isn't illegal, so that'd be a fairly stupid name for it...

Yet.
It's impossible to class the glitch itself as "illegal" anyway, it could be used just to stack two blacks together, and nobody would know the difference anyway.
Besides that, you can't even say that the extreme uses of this glitch are going to be banned, because it could be that nobody else ever finds out, or that some other compromise is made if this glitch is released or found by another member.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: LiNcK on July 04, 2011, 10:22:36 PM
This glitch can GREATLY benefit robot building, In DSL atleast... With this you can get rid of some ridiculously big meshes & just paste everything thightly together without stacking but still as close as possible.

When I opened this topic & Read about it the first thing that came to mind was this problem Ive had:
(http://i44.tinypic.com/15drlm9.jpg)


Sometimes stuff clearly fits in a chassis or stuff COULD go through eachother (Like maybe making a hole in the chassis for a razor tip to go through or making it go through a static tit sheet) but RA2 wont let you.
With this glitch we could make such things possible, And for DSL atleast it would be VERY helpful & Innovative...
Stock though, Were stacking is allowed I see the problem but we can still regulate it.


Heck, This might get me back into RA2 o.O
Bot building would be ALOT easier if you dont have to worry about meshes, If it is accepted as realistic, It can be done.
I could pasted those drives closer to eachother... I could make stuff go through those rings they have (Look at pic above) if accepted... (In real like if thats just make I would just saw it off)
Such things could make bots more efficient & Just awesome.


Thinking about it now makes me wanna go back to the botlab & Start building with it :D
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: J on July 04, 2011, 10:58:31 PM
So... LiNcK knows this trick? How nice.

Thinking about it now makes me wanna go back to the botlab & Start building with it :D
Sage already demonstrated how ridiculous it can get.
TBH, it seems like fun.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: R0B0SH4RK on July 04, 2011, 11:00:34 PM
Doesn't look like it. I think he just wants to get his ant batteries closer to the burst motors, but he can't so he has to stack them.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: 123savethewhales on July 05, 2011, 02:09:43 AM
I think he's trying to say that it's better to stack batteries into the motor collision mesh, than into each other.

I disagree, I think chassis are small enough on DSL as is.  We don't need anymore collision bypass to save that one quarter square.  I also fail to see anything exciting coming out of it since many bots in DSL are already build with 1x1.5 chassis.

Besides, ants are pretty easy to stack into other mesh even without a new glitch.  It wasn't used because it was regarded as cheating.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: 090901 on July 05, 2011, 01:32:12 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k6G1dSAB1uw# (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k6G1dSAB1uw#)
MUST FIGURE OUT WHICH MOTOR MADE THAT NOISE RIGHT BEFORE IT WAS ACTIVATED.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: System32 on July 05, 2011, 01:34:44 PM
DERPA HERP

You know DSL 3 will nerf that sort of component placement?






Foul language removed, user warned!
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Meganerdbomb on July 05, 2011, 09:34:04 PM
And a good thing too. DSL is practically the same as stock ATM.
Anyway we're getting off the subject, which is that Scrap and Sage are rotten bastards for telling us about this without revealing how to do it!
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: LiNcK on July 05, 2011, 09:57:39 PM
So... LiNcK knows this trick? How nice.

Thinking about it now makes me wanna go back to the botlab & Start building with it :D
Sage already demonstrated how ridiculous it can get.
TBH, it seems like fun.


Nahh, IDK it... Stacking ants like that couldent be easier :P
And I dont plan to use it to stack stuff if it gets released, Just to make realistic bots using as little space as possible... But still realistic, Like my ants prob up there.
Couldent use that bot in a tourney coz it was "Unrealistic" but normally the ants WOULD fit if it wasnt for the HUGE meshes of the BSG... Anyways, Hax Mode could fix that prob & many others. Just like it could be used to ruin Clash Cubes by stacking everything together:P
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: J on July 05, 2011, 10:00:07 PM
Anyway we're getting off the subject, which is that Scrap and Sage are rotten bastards for telling us about this without revealing how to do it!
Basically Sage and Scrap have copies of Base-Set Charazard, and were all trying to trade out Base-Set Poliwhirls for it.
........
YOU KNOW WHAT I MEAN.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Sage on July 06, 2011, 12:29:53 AM
Anyway we're getting off the subject, which is that Scrap and Sage are rotten bastards for telling us about this without revealing how to do it!
Basically Sage and Scrap have copies of Base-Set Charazard, and were all trying to trade out Base-Set Poliwhirls for it.
........
YOU KNOW WHAT I MEAN.

Maybe if you were talking about the game people would understand... but honestly no one plays the card game.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Somebody on July 06, 2011, 09:23:55 AM
Hey guys, make sure we don't piss off Sage or he'll run away and we'll never get the glitch!

Yes that is sage
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M54xDcLfsDI# (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M54xDcLfsDI#)
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: R0B0SH4RK on July 06, 2011, 11:12:59 AM
Haha, I remember that video xD
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: System32 on July 08, 2011, 01:38:42 PM
If this is what you believe is happening right now, than you're far more cynical then I've ever given you credit for. The "social circle" you're currently referring to consists of the two people who figured the glitch out, no more.
You are right, but as someone pointed out, Scrap discovered it. Not only that, Click, JoeBlo and Trov have a possibility of being included, making it a "social pentagon". Finally, you are asking for info on how to do it to curb your skepticism, making it a "social hexagon".
 
And as far as I can tell, Sage and Scrap are spiting no one, especially not you.
If preventing newer members and other members from utilizing a glitch that allows them to be as good as (and later, possibly better) themselves isn't spiteful, It's at least hypocritical considering all the advice they've given with other glitches and building techniques.
 

"What's happening right now" isn't keeping Hax mode a secret to spite members, "what's happening right now" isn't "purely disgusting,"
Yes it is, by proxy. Apart from ACAMS, (Who is just adding random info for people to think about) and some other guy who is derping, all of the people telling scrap and Sage to keep Hax Mode locked away from the public are using variants of this sentence: "Good job Sage and scrap! Keep it away from the newbs!"
 
"what's happening right now" is a bunch of guys trying to decide where we go from here, and ultimately, Scrap and Sage are entitled to do as they please with their discovery. They can release it to the public, or they can lock it away and make sure it never sees the light of day again.
Do you know how insane this sounds to me? If we weren't talking about elitism I'd think we were having an argument over anti-intellectualism.
 
It doesn't effect either of us or anyone on this forum.
21 pages in two days say something else.
You still haven't replied.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Sage on July 08, 2011, 02:50:09 PM
System, no matter what your logic is we'll release it whenever we want to. Scrap found it. There's no law saying he has to share his secrets. In fact he should be able to use this in building every bot he makes, but he doesn't because he knows people will rage. It's actually unfair to Scrap to have this banned in tournaments just because only a few people know it. It's like not letting the best chess player in the world into a tournament simply because he's smarter than everyone else.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Enigm@ on July 08, 2011, 02:53:58 PM
i.e., u jelly, GTM?
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: System32 on July 08, 2011, 04:54:56 PM
lol at sage rage.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Urjak on July 08, 2011, 04:55:27 PM
In fact he should be able to use this in building every bot he makes, but he doesn't because he knows people will rage. It's actually unfair to Scrap to have this banned in tournaments just because only a few people know it.


Alright, now this post really got me. You guy's (you and Scrap) had said previously that this glitch would be unreleased because it would "ruin stock building" and now you're saying it is unfair to Scrap to have this glitch banned? Do you know how crazy that sounds? You're tearing down your only argument for keeping this glitch secret. The reason people want it banned is because it is a cheaty way of building (I am not sold on whether this is even true), not because it is unreleased.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Sage on July 08, 2011, 05:00:47 PM
In fact he should be able to use this in building every bot he makes, but he doesn't because he knows people will rage. It's actually unfair to Scrap to have this banned in tournaments just because only a few people know it.


Alright, now this post really got me. You guy's (you and Scrap) had said previously that this glitch would be unreleased because it would "ruin stock building" and now you're saying it is unfair to Scrap to have this glitch banned? Do you know how crazy that sounds? You're tearing down your only argument for keeping this glitch secret. The reason people want it banned is because it is a cheaty way of building (I am not sold on whether this is even true), not because it is unreleased.

First I said it would ruin stock, you guys didn't agree. Okay, fine, it won't ruin stock. Thus the secondary argument that it's unfair to us that it be banned just because you guys don't know how to do it. It's not a cheaty way of building. It's done completely in-game, just like any other glitch. Go back 5 years and show someone snapper loading, they'll think you're a witch and burn you at the stake.

Also, that's not the only reason we haven't released it yet, nor is it really even the main one. It's Scrap's to release. Why the heck should he have to divulge his secrets?
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Skiitzzox220 on July 08, 2011, 05:03:23 PM
lol at sage rage.
Am I the only one who thinks that sounds really, really awesome
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Urjak on July 08, 2011, 05:07:54 PM
First I said it would ruin stock, you guys didn't agree. Okay, fine, it won't ruin stock. Thus the secondary argument that it's unfair to us that it be banned just because you guys don't know how to do it. It's not a cheaty way of building. It's done completely in-game, just like any other glitch. Go back 5 years and show someone snapper loading, they'll think you're a witch and burn you at the stake.

Also, that's not the only reason we haven't released it yet, nor is it really even the main one. It's Scrap's to release. Why the heck should he have to divulge his secrets?


Well alright, as long as you don't hold by the "ruining stock" argument. However, I don't think people here are saying it should be banned because no one knows how to do it, they are saying it should be banned because it allows you to stack practically anything. This is the exact same reason that BFE and AAM are banned, because the allow for building bots that do not fit the communities expectations. We could allow these bots, like the community probably first did when deciding whether stacking should be allowed, or we could forbid them. Either way, I don't think it is secrecy that makes people want the glitch banned.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Sage on July 08, 2011, 05:14:34 PM
First I said it would ruin stock, you guys didn't agree. Okay, fine, it won't ruin stock. Thus the secondary argument that it's unfair to us that it be banned just because you guys don't know how to do it. It's not a cheaty way of building. It's done completely in-game, just like any other glitch. Go back 5 years and show someone snapper loading, they'll think you're a witch and burn you at the stake.

Also, that's not the only reason we haven't released it yet, nor is it really even the main one. It's Scrap's to release. Why the heck should he have to divulge his secrets?


Well alright, as long as you don't hold by the "ruining stock" argument. However, I don't think people here are saying it should be banned because no one knows how to do it, they are saying it should be banned because it allows you to stack practically anything. This is the exact same reason that BFE and AAM are banned, because the allow for building bots that do not fit the communities expectations. We could allow these bots, like the community probably first did when deciding whether stacking should be allowed, or we could forbid them. Either way, I don't think it is secrecy that makes people want the glitch banned.

Uhhhhhh BFE and AAM aren't banned because of what they do, they are banned because they are done outside of the game.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: R1885 on July 08, 2011, 05:27:06 PM
I'm going to brake the discussion here because this has REALLY gotten out of hand. I'm going out on a limb to say that this thread had bad idea written all over it from the start. This thread has been nothing but arguments that get nowhere, ridiculous reasoning, and some sane comments from guys who know what their talking about.  I could sum up this entire thread with a quote from ATFW:


"Should we do something?"


"Should we do something?"


"We should do something!"



"Should we do something?"


"Should we do something?"


"We should do something!"



"Should we do something?"


"Should we do something?"


"We should do something!"


And continue to infinity and beyond.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Urjak on July 08, 2011, 05:28:41 PM
Uhhhhhh BFE and AAM aren't banned because of what they do, they are banned because they are done outside of the game.


That's news to me. But regardless, the primary reason people want this glitch banned is because of its effects, not its secrecy.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: System32 on July 08, 2011, 05:48:35 PM
Why the heck should he have to divulge his secrets?
Don't you dare try to pin the burden on us.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Sage on July 08, 2011, 06:03:11 PM
Why the heck should he have to divulge his secrets?
Don't you dare try to pin the burden on us.

There's no burden on anyone to do anything.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Urjak on July 08, 2011, 06:59:39 PM
Why the heck should he have to divulge his secrets?


Of course he doesn't have to, but in a community devoted to a dying game, new discoveries should be shared and added to our knowledge banks, not kept shrouded in secrecy because we are afraid of possible change. The RA2 community has evolved considerably since it began; we should never attempt to slow this process by keeping secret a glitch that could very easily never be seen again.


As has been said, Scrap is under no obligation to tell anyone, though in my opinion there is an unwritten responsibility for us all to build up the knowledge and skill of our community through showcasing, advice giving, and new discoveries regarding the function of this game (this glitch for example). The fact that this glitch has also been shared with a few other members (Click and Kill if I recall correctly) also worries me, because it creates a division within our community between an "elite" whom share discoveries and the rest of the community who are kept in the dark save for a tantalizing and sort of cruel demonstration that seems to be saying nothing more than "We found this awesome glitch, but we don't think you newbie guys can handle it so we won't share." This is not how a community should function, especially one devoted to a game that has so few followers.


And with that my "rant" concludes.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: ACAMS on July 08, 2011, 07:10:54 PM
Scrap found it. There's no law saying he has to share his secrets. In fact he should be able to use this in building every bot he makes


If he wants to use it (in tournaments and such) he will have to prove it is not BFE, then it could get disallowed in some tournaments for what it does.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Sage on July 08, 2011, 07:17:00 PM
I understand your concern about the community function thing. Good point.

Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: R0B0SH4RK on July 08, 2011, 07:24:52 PM
You are right, but as someone pointed out, Scrap discovered it. Not only that, Click, JoeBlo and Trov have a possibility of being included, making it a "social pentagon". Finally, you are asking for info on how to do it to curb your skepticism, making it a "social hexagon".

Did Sage tell me how to do it? No. Do Click and Trov and Joe know? I doubt it. Kill has confirmed his knowledge, so that makes three members. Three. I don't know about you, but that's so far from a circle that I'm not concerned about an "elite class" posessing privileged knowledge emerging. And if asking for info in order to curb skepticism admits you to this group, then you're just as much of a member as I am, and so is everybody else who has posted in this thread.
 

If preventing newer members and other members from utilizing a glitch that allows them to be as good as (and later, possibly better) themselves isn't spiteful, It's at least hypocritical considering all the advice they've given with other glitches and building techniques.

If they keep their word and abstain from using their knowledge on a regular basis, than I don't see any hypocracy as their discovery hasn't altered the building landscape at all. If they do exploit their knowledge, however, it's not just hypocritical but also grossly unfair to the rest of us. I believe we can agree on this.
 
 
Yes it is, by proxy. Apart from ACAMS, (Who is just adding random info for people to think about) and some other guy who is derping, all of the people telling scrap and Sage to keep Hax Mode locked away from the public are using variants of this sentence: "Good job Sage and scrap! Keep it away from the newbs!"

I'm not sure you can spite someone "by proxy," but I don't really want to get into semantics. And no, they're not all variants of that sentence. I've read your post outlining arguments that are anti-release, and they read to me like some members have legitimate concerns over the future of the stock game in the event of the release of Hax Mode. Whether or not those concerns are valid is another matter. I, for one, think that some of them are. However, they all operate under the assumption that Hax Mode will be deemed legal, which is a huge oversight, IMO. I think that LiNcK made a lot of sense when he suggested that Scrap and Sage reveal it, but make it illegal.
 
 

Do you know how insane this sounds to me? If we weren't talking about elitism I'd think we were having an argument over anti-intellectualism.

Actually, no I don't.
 
 
21 pages in two days say something else.

It says people care, regardless of whether or not it affects them. I guess it's like pro sports in this sense, where no matter what the outcome, it really should have no effect on anyone.
 
 
 
 
I think that most of the community can agree on this: I think that Scrap and Sage should divulge the secrets of Hax Mode to the greater community, where we can experiment with it ourselves and draw our own conclusions. At this point, we can argue all we like about whether to keep it legal or illegalize it.
 
So, if you don't mind S32, I've humoured you now and I don't really feel the need to argue and debate any longer. We both want the info that Scrap and Sage posess, and we both think the best way to spread this information is by releasing it to the community. Fundamentally, this is all that really matters. Perhaps by taking issue with some of your arguments, I didn't make this viewpoint clear. Go ahead and have the final word in this if you like, but I'd prefer that this be the end of our little exchange. Let's just see where things go from here.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Somebody on July 08, 2011, 07:58:53 PM
Y'know guys, this could be a reeeeally good way to draw back some old members if there is any interest to.

AND I'M NOT SAYING GO TRACK THEM DOWN, STALK THEM, AND BUG THEM. But its just an idea if you were talking with them anyways (like you stayed friends, RA2 is mentioned, and then you explain.)
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: System32 on July 08, 2011, 08:05:32 PM
You are right, but as someone pointed out, Scrap discovered it. Not only that, Click, JoeBlo and Trov have a possibility of being included, making it a "social pentagon". Finally, you are asking for info on how to do it to curb your skepticism, making it a "social hexagon".

Did Sage tell me how to do it? No. Do Click and Trov and Joe know? I doubt it. Kill has confirmed his knowledge, so that makes three members. Three. I don't know about you, but that's so far from a circle that I'm not concerned about an "elite class" posessing privileged knowledge emerging. And if asking for info in order to curb skepticism admits you to this group, then you're just as much of a member as I am, and so is everybody else who has posted in this thread.
All of your refutations I mostly agree on exept for this. I urj, you (As you have told me, rendering this argument mostly invalid) and many others demand an open release to the public. You may not be concerned about an "Elite class" forming, but to be honest is one ever did form you'd be invited, being one of the older members here who is well established in GTM.

As for "spiting by proxy", I would like to say BURN VANCOUVER BURN and by proxy spite those who were horrified at the Vancouver riots.
GO TRACK THEM DOWN, STALK THEM, AND BUG THEM.
I'll get sparky on this, pronto!
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Trovaner on July 08, 2011, 08:26:09 PM

Uhhhhhh BFE and AAM aren't banned because of what they do, they are banned because they are done outside of the game.
Nope, they were banned because they made the game extremely unbalanced and unfair to those who didn't know how to do them (invincible components, components stuck inside of the opponent, landmines, controllable parts that aren't attached to the bot, etc.). That's why most hosts allow their participants to edit the preview pic, chassis appearance/reflective properties, and attach SZs to components.

Also, your chess analogy seems extremely faulty. IMO, it would be more along the lines of having one competitor following more restrictive rules than his opponent.

Looking at the past: (by my understanding)
-Almost since the beginning, .bot file editing wasn't considered fair. It has only been in recent years that we have started making minor distinctions between different sections (SZs and appearance are fair to edit now). It is also somewhat traceable if you know what your looking for (unfortunately, it isn't completely possible to trace). It isn't openly used because most people don't know how to do it and those that do haven't gone overboard (only what is possible with stacking). Shows that some people are capable of showing some restraint.
-AAM wasn't publicly released because the person person who knew how to do it didn't want n00bs to act like they were all that. Instead, he decided to release it to a chosen few. Later, HackerX secretly made a tutorial describing how to do it (everyone had access to the tutorial even if they didn't know it themselves (in fact, its still available to all of you)). Over the course of a few years, people gradually started publicly explaining how to do AAM. There weren't very many ramifications of releasing AAM due to the fact that we had already banned it from tournaments and deemed it as an unfair advantage by that time. Although extremely hard to trace, the difficulty in doing AAM has limited the number of people that use it. Another case of members showing restraint.
-Clickbeetle once asked whether he should make an EZ-AAM program but quickly pulled that offer after deciding that it would make cheating too easy for the general masses. Thereby showing that you don't need to release something this powerful if you don't want to.
-Custom components that inhibit glitches have also been deemed unfair even after being removed. Burst motors that rotate the chassis, weights that cause axles to fall off, and motors that would make snapper loading easier have all been made but haven't been made available to the public (the burst motor was made available but was removed due to having an untraceable advantage).
-After the release of Starcore V1, glitches have been accepted as fair game in stock. Before that, realism was the de facto standard. If we made something that were to break our current standards, we would need to have an AI pack or tournaments that followed the same rule set (to be fair).
-There have been a couple glitches that have been deemed unfair over the years (namely the Trinity and nasty pickle glitches). After a bit of experimentation, they were found to give too big of an advantage (in tournaments). These could be considered precedents of an in game glitch being called unfair in stock.
-Stacking has always been unregulated but whenever someone did anything out of the norm, they were accused of doing AAM or .bot file editing. So there has always been a form of regulation for what would be fair in stacking (although having some written rules would be nice).
-Zero Absolute found a glitch but refused to release it to the public for the same reasons as you. By not releasing it however, his name got attributed to 3 different glitches/hacks (since he never did tell us how to do it). So if you want your name attributed to this, you would need to release how to do it. That's also why we haven't changed the name of the Trinity glitch or AAM (even though there have been numerous claims about discovering it earlier).
-A while back, I found another glitch that could be inhibited using python and the FPS window. Although it can be done completely in game, I chose not to release my findings because it would make stacking externals much easier and more effective than doing the eFFe or snapper/axle loading glitches. Since the end result could potentially look like AAM or .bot file editing, I knew that it would remain regulated even among those that didn't know how to do it. This just shows that we could still regulate a glitch by the standards of some other concept.


In other words, it is completely up to you whether to release it or not but you can't expect anyone who knows to have special privileges in tournaments.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: LiNcK on July 08, 2011, 09:20:53 PM
Guys, Im not trying to insult anyone by saying this but IDK how you guys cant agree on making it illegal or not.
Its just OBVIOUS for mme that if you make it legal bots will be just cubes with 39034926 weapons outside of em, If made illegal bots will be EXACTLY as they are right now, Just that the components will be tighter together (Wich will cause the chassis(es..?) to shirk just a bit).

Also, For the fun builders this will be an awesome glitch to try :P
Soyeah, I vote to just release it & make it illegal, RA2 wont be destroyed then.


My old post to explain to the peeps that havent read:



-
Note that Im only taking DSL into consideration, I dont have stock & I dont use stock since I HATE Stacking unless its realisticly stacking (Just a TINY bit that you could normally cut off, Not batts & Stuff though.)
I know it would be harder to regulate in Stock, But still... If someone has everything pasted together its just damn obvious.


EDIT: For some reason the size & font changed...? o.O
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Sparkey98 on July 08, 2011, 09:35:39 PM
Lets ban all glitches so RFS comes back because only he matters.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Ben Purse on July 08, 2011, 10:10:51 PM
Shut up Sparkey
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: JoeBlo on July 08, 2011, 10:16:31 PM
Many of you are looking at the wrong side of the "Stock Apocalypse"..

As I explained to Sage its this half baked messy situation we have now that could drive players away..

Once you have a clean simple cut rules we can go on peacefully with our lives again.. we basically have to come together as a community and make a simple agreement about it.

As it stands now Sage and Scrap can technically use it in existing rule sets as its not listed as an outlawed glitch and fits within the "All building to be done in the botlab"

Now obviously tournaments can make up their own personal rulesets around it but general building standards/ rules and the case if nothing is specified (or forgotten to add) its all up in the air.. Same with the 140cm extender.. tournaments make specific comments about it (becasue we never came to a yes or no agreement)

Why I mention this is remember Sage and I slipped in the 140cm extender in our winning BOTM? no rules prevented it as it fitted within the ruleset of AI / Hidden parts unless specified otherwise.. now its not a big deal but something like limitless stacking is.

We need to just come straight down to it and vote yes or no.. to many opinions and being changed and flying all over the place we really at not quite at the original point.

So lets just keep "ruin" "death" and "the end" out of this thread from no on and look at how we can structure this

1) Release and Allow- The Glitch is shown, Scrap is awarded it as an official glitch (at the moment it cannot be considered such since it cannot be confirmed 100% doable) and we let it loose in stock

2) Hide and Ban - Obviously the opposite, we pretend it didnt happen and use the "common sense approach" to stacks

3) Middle road - The Glitch is shown, Scrap is awarded it as an official glitch and baseplate stacking is banned.

Now I got some rage pm's from someone whom I wont mention about the stacking ban situation... but its basically to balance things out again. I foresee to many conflicts of people using Hax mode and claiming it legit (then we wind up with a tournament thread that turns into this one)... I mean if you dont go overboard with it you could easily pass boundaries without being detected

There is nothing to say this couldnt happen with AAM or BFE yes but I could see such an more accessible thing dramatically increasing the amount of Cheat vs Legit stacking..
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Mr. AS on July 08, 2011, 10:18:35 PM
There is nothing to say this couldnt happen with AAM or BFE yes but I could see such an more accessible thing dramatically increasing the amount of Cheat vs Legit stacking..
[/quote]
Lets ban all glitches so RFS comes back because only he matters.
You just basically said that 30-70% of the community doesn't matter.

Many of you are looking at the wrong side of the "Stock Apocalypse"..

As I explained to Sage its this half baked messy situation we have now that could drive players away..

Once you have a clean simple cut rules we can go on peacefully with our lives again.. we basically have to come together as a community and make a simple agreement about it.

As it stands now Sage and Scrap can technically use it in existing rule sets as its not listed as an outlawed glitch and fits within the "All building to be done in the botlab"

Now obviously tournaments can make up their own personal rulesets around it but general building standards/ rules and the case if nothing is specified (or forgotten to add) its all up in the air.. Same with the 140cm extender.. tournaments make specific comments about it (becasue we never came to a yes or no agreement)

Why I mention this is remember Sage and I slipped in the 140cm extender in our winning BOTM? no rules prevented it as it fitted within the ruleset of AI / Hidden parts unless specified otherwise.. now its not a big deal but something like limitless stacking is.

We need to just come straight down to it and vote yes or no.. to many opinions and being changed and flying all over the place we really at not quite at the original point.

So lets just keep "ruin" "death" and "the end" out of this thread from no on and look at how we can structure this

1) Release and Allow- The Glitch is shown, Scrap is awarded it as an official glitch (at the moment it cannot be considered such since it cannot be confirmed 100% doable) and we let it loose in stock

2) Hide and Ban - Obviously the opposite, we pretend it didnt happen and use the "common sense approach" to stacks

3) Middle road - The Glitch is shown, Scrap is awarded it as an official glitch and baseplate stacking is banned.

Now I got some rage pm's from someone whom I wont mention about the stacking ban situation... but its basically to balance things out again. I foresee to many conflicts of people using Hax mode and claiming it legit (then we wind up with a tournament thread that turns into this one)... I mean if you dont go overboard with it you could easily pass boundaries without being detected

There is nothing to say this couldnt happen with AAM or BFE yes but I could see such an more accessible thing dramatically increasing the amount of Cheat vs Legit stacking..
I vote for 2.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: System32 on July 08, 2011, 10:21:52 PM
Lets ban all glitches so RFS comes back because only he matters.
You just basically said that 30-70% of the community doesn't matter.
So is RFS a majority or minority?
 
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Mr. AS on July 08, 2011, 10:23:23 PM
Lets ban all glitches so RFS comes back because only he matters.
You just basically said that 30-70% of the community doesn't matter.
So is RFS a majority or minority?
I meant that the stock people are 30-70% of the community. I don't think that RFS played DSL.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Sparkey98 on July 08, 2011, 10:26:07 PM
Lets ban all glitches so RFS comes back because only he matters.
You just basically said that 30-70% of the community doesn't matter.
So is RFS a majority or minority?
I meant that the stock people are 30-70% of the community. I don't think that RFS played DSL.

how do sarcasm
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Scrap Daddy on July 08, 2011, 10:28:26 PM
Let me just let you know what is going on right now. We are currently trying to find out as much as we possibly can about the glitch before we decide whether or not to release it. In the past week we've found out a bunch of different things that allows more stacking to be done and to make the glitch easier to do.


We thought for a few days that stacking was limited to 7 components in a row, but Sage proved that wrong stacking like 20 blacks. We have also found that blacks and most things can be exostacked to a certain extent which means the chassis of GODMODE can probably made even smaller than it is now along with other things.

stay tuned.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: 123savethewhales on July 09, 2011, 02:19:39 AM
The only reason the "in the bot lab" was even introduce is precisely for the level of restrictions it provides.  If "in the bot lab" become unrestricted then obviously we need a new rule to replace that.

As a purely balance issue, a game is "worsen" when diversity is destroyed.  Stacking every single thing into 1 point will surely have this effect.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Dexterhunter on July 09, 2011, 02:21:34 AM
stay tuned.

Oh good god save the children.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: 123savethewhales on July 09, 2011, 02:26:25 AM
stay tuned.

Oh good god save the children.
Lol the children of GTM include Sparkey, Fotepx, GTG, Hard Bot, Ben Purse, Jonzu, etc.  So good luck with that next time you have a conversation with God.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Sparkey98 on July 09, 2011, 02:29:24 AM
stay tuned.

Oh good god save the children.
Lol the children of GTM include Sparkey, Fotepx, GTG, Hard Bot, Ben Purse, Jonzu, etc.  So good luck with that next time you have a conversation with God.

Am I really that bad?
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: 123savethewhales on July 09, 2011, 02:31:24 AM
stay tuned.

Oh good god save the children.
Lol the children of GTM include Sparkey, Fotepx, GTG, Hard Bot, Ben Purse, Jonzu, etc.  So good luck with that next time you have a conversation with God.

Am I really that bad?
I didn't say anything about bad.  I was just making a list of children here from my head.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Sparkey98 on July 09, 2011, 02:32:13 AM
stay tuned.

Oh good god save the children.
Lol the children of GTM include Sparkey, Fotepx, GTG, Hard Bot, Ben Purse, Jonzu, etc.  So good luck with that next time you have a conversation with God.

Am I really that bad?
I didn't say anything about bad.  I was just making a list of children here from my head.
fourteen? Besides I'm pretty sure Ben is somewhere in his twenties if he really is as drunk as he says.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: 123savethewhales on July 09, 2011, 02:33:48 AM
Ben is Listed as 12 on his profile.  Jonzu is listed as 15 but then he acts like 12 most of the time.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Vertigo on July 09, 2011, 02:34:00 AM
Their age is not an excuse, Me (and Badnik IIRC) are 13, and act properly
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Sparkey98 on July 09, 2011, 02:35:13 AM
Their age is not an excuse, Me (and Badnik IIRC) are 13, and act properly

But do I still act like a nine year old most of the time?
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Vertigo on July 09, 2011, 02:36:38 AM
Their age is not an excuse, Me (and Badnik IIRC) are 13, and act properly
But do I still act like a nine year old most of the time?
Mostly not, but you do still have your outbursts
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: ty4er on July 09, 2011, 02:37:50 AM
Their age is not an excuse, Me (and Badnik IIRC) are 13, and act properly
et moi


But some people do have their bursts of idiocity, like me in my showcase not too long ago :P
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: 090901 on July 09, 2011, 02:42:04 AM
Their age is not an excuse, Me (and Badnik IIRC) are 13, and act properly
And then i do 3/4ths of the time :P
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: JoeBlo on July 09, 2011, 04:44:03 AM
I see age isnt a factor when it comes to who goes off topic :P
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: 123savethewhales on July 09, 2011, 07:55:56 AM
I see age isnt a factor when it comes to who goes off topic :P
People are having way too much hypothetical discussion of what "some people" would do when this gets released anyway.  Now you can see first hand.

I am beginning to think that the whole fear of releasing is not without reason.  I mean the moment S32 goes off on elitism, anti-intellectualism, and how not releasing this glitch is like raping babies I knew something must be wrong.  Even if a vast majority of the community is responsible, A few bad apples and hiccups should still exist.  And then we ask, what "good" would it bring if at best it will be banned, and at worst abused to the point of eliminating the last bit of diversity, and we see that releasing this brings nothing good to the community at all.  Any negative will out weight the 0 positive that this provides.  That's not to say I don't personally want to know anyway.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Enigm@ on July 09, 2011, 07:56:54 AM
Either that or Scarp is the greatest troll evar
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: System32 on July 09, 2011, 09:27:30 AM
I mean the moment S32 goes off on elitism, anti-intellectualism, and how not releasing this glitch is like raping babies I knew something must be wrong.  Even if a vast majority of the community is responsible, A few bad apples and hiccups should still exist.
Way to miss the point. If what I was saying is a location, I could put a peice of bread there and you could put a peice of bread where you think my point is (Assuming it's a location) and we'd make an earth sandwich.
 
And then we ask, what "good" would it bring if at best it will be banned, and at worst abused to the point of eliminating the last bit of diversity, and we see that releasing this brings nothing good to the community at all.  Any negative will out weight the 0 positive that this provides.  That's not to say I don't personally want to know anyway.
Hey, If you really want to see where my anti-intellectualism comparison comes from, pretend this here quote is about Higgs boson/the fourth chemical in orb-weaving spider silk/cultural habits of Crows/Scientific experiment X.

 
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: 123savethewhales on July 09, 2011, 09:47:17 AM
And then we ask, what "good" would it bring if at best it will be banned, and at worst abused to the point of eliminating the last bit of diversity, and we see that releasing this brings nothing good to the community at all.  Any negative will out weight the 0 positive that this provides.  That's not to say I don't personally want to know anyway.
Hey, If you really want to see where my anti-intellectualism comparison comes from, pretend this here quote is about Higgs boson/the fourth chemical in orb-weaving spider silk/cultural habits of Crows/Scientific experiment X.
I see how it is a bad comparison.  This is much more like rather we should make modern nuclear and missile technology public.  Knowing exactly what it's abilities are and how a few bad apples like North Korea might just build an ICBM with it.

We are not breaking new grounds, we are not doing anything that isn't possible with BFE.  It is simply a new "method" of doing things.  This is unlike "higgs boson" where you "don't know" what will come out of it.  This is stuff anyone who tap into BFE/game balance know exactly how it will be abused because they already been there and done that.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: System32 on July 09, 2011, 09:53:27 AM
And then we ask, what "good" would it bring if at best it will be banned, and at worst abused to the point of eliminating the last bit of diversity, and we see that releasing this brings nothing good to the community at all.  Any negative will out weight the 0 positive that this provides.  That's not to say I don't personally want to know anyway.
Hey, If you really want to see where my anti-intellectualism comparison comes from, pretend this here quote is about Higgs boson/the fourth chemical in orb-weaving spider silk/cultural habits of Crows/Scientific experiment X.
I see how it is a bad comparison.  This is much more like rather we should make modern nuclear and missile technology public.
Or alternatively, A miracle drug that can cure all Cardio-vascular diseases.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: 123savethewhales on July 09, 2011, 10:02:20 AM
So you are still missing the point that this is just a method to do everything that can already been done?  That it doesn't bring anything good or new?  Nevertheless

Sage and Scrap Daddy should not release a Guide to this method for the following reason.

nonetheless, People should have a chance to play and discover by themselves, as you had done. Not refer to a guide.

So there, people should figure out the method themselves.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: JoeBlo on July 09, 2011, 10:11:49 AM
So there, people should figure out the method themselves.

Im trying... and failing

I think im close to getting it to trigger though..
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: System32 on July 09, 2011, 10:17:13 AM
nonetheless, People should have a chance to play and discover by themselves, as you had done. Not refer to a guide.
So there, people should figure out the method themselves.
Apples and oranges. A glitch that took three years to actively hunt down isn't the same as trimming 0.3 KG off a bot.
 
Learning what works and using it in your bots is a more personal and artistic thing. Using a glitch to make those bots is a utility thing.
 
Knowing how badly you fail at analogies due to bias, I'm not going to make a crack about you effectively suggesting not using Pause Break in the botlab. Directly.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: 123savethewhales on July 09, 2011, 10:25:32 AM
At least I wasn't the one who also said this.  So much for flip flopping base on your personal interest at the time.

The title says it all really.
Jack Daniels has made the following proposal:
Quote
I say, release it to the public and future Stock tournaments can be either:

-Stock abiding by the realistic rule (thus negating the need for any hax)

or

-Stock All In-game Glitches Allowed  (probably ushering in a new era of leet bots that separate the men from the boys (and women from the girls just to include Scourge))

In the event of Hax Mode being made available to the public, I submit we undergo heavy revisions of the non realistic stock mode.
Please post your proposed revisions for tournaments here. I will make a poll on the 4th of july, 2011.
I think I can find a quote of you defending exactly the opposite of everything you said, and I won't even be quoting out of context.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Urjak on July 09, 2011, 11:15:19 AM
We are not breaking new grounds, we are not doing anything that isn't possible with BFE.  It is simply a new "method" of doing things.  This is unlike "higgs boson" where you "don't know" what will come out of it.  This is stuff anyone who tap into BFE/game balance know exactly how it will be abused because they already been there and done that.


But clearly BFE hasn't caused the end of stock or DSL. It is possible that stock building may change, but in my opinion it is better to err on the side of openness then to speculate on what could happen, and use said speculation to help ensure this glitch never sees the light of day. 
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Skiitzzox220 on July 09, 2011, 11:39:11 AM
Instead of releasing it maybe they could give us some sort of large hint and let us work from that.

Stupid idea I know
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: System32 on July 09, 2011, 12:32:37 PM
Snip
I'm for the death penalty and drug legalisation. OMG FLIP FLOPPING
As I said, apples and oranges.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Sparkey98 on July 09, 2011, 01:04:09 PM
Instead of releasing it maybe they could give us some sort of large hint and let us work from that.

Stupid idea I know
What difference will it make to the outcome? We have a big search and destroy party for a glitch, then what happens?
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Trovaner on July 09, 2011, 01:58:25 PM
I don't see any problem with it being released or not.

Though he has many options, I would consider these to be the most probable...

By releasing it to the community:
-He gets to name it. We already have 3 different glitches/hax attributed to Zero Absolute's thread like this and nobody truly knows which one he used.
-We make some rules for stacking (which probably wouldn't be such a bad thing considering AAM and .bot file editing are so hard to trace).
-We would need to make AI packs that are built to these new standards (in the same way Starcore V1 introduced glitches into common practice). It would not ruin stock but would definitely be something to consider when building bots.
-People would no longer need to complain about stacking (since everyone would have the same limitations)

By not releasing it to anyone else: (like Zero Absolute did)
-Life goes on. Another person may find it and start this conversation over again. Then he may chose to release it or not (with the same benefits).
-Nobody would be allowed to use the glitch in tournaments since it would fall under the .bot file editing (unless its an anything goes tourney).
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: LiNcK on July 09, 2011, 02:42:41 PM
stay tuned.

Oh good god save the children.
Lol the children of GTM include Sparkey, Fotepx, GTG, Hard Bot, Ben Purse, Jonzu, etc.  So good luck with that next time you have a conversation with God.


Im 15 too, But yeah... Im more mature I guess :P


@Trovaner: Not releasing also brings the chance of someone finding out about it & Not talking about it... Just using it without telling anyone. (Ofcourse, He wont be able to overdo it or peeps will notice)


If I found out about it myself, I would use it in a few Tourneys, Win 2/3 tourneys & Then be like: LOOK WHAT I JUST FOUND 1 DAY AGO! And release it :D
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Skiitzzox220 on July 09, 2011, 03:23:02 PM
Instead of releasing it maybe they could give us some sort of large hint and let us work from that.

Stupid idea I know
What difference will it make to the outcome? We have a big search and destroy party for a glitch, then what happens?
I dunno, I did say it was a stupid idea
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Sage on July 09, 2011, 03:34:19 PM
(https://gametechmods.com/uploads/images/22580screenshot_6.jpg)

invincible battery armor anyone?
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: freeziez on July 09, 2011, 03:35:23 PM
(https://gametechmods.com/uploads/images/22580screenshot_6.jpg)

invincible battery armor anyone?


:DDDDD
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Trovaner on July 09, 2011, 03:43:41 PM
@Trovaner: Not releasing also brings the chance of someone finding out about it & Not talking about it... Just using it without telling anyone. (Ofcourse, He wont be able to overdo it or peeps will notice)
If I found out about it myself, I would use it in a few Tourneys, Win 2/3 tourneys & Then be like: LOOK WHAT I JUST FOUND 1 DAY AGO! And release it :D
Since they would be limited to the stacking ability of normal stacking (or get DQ for .bot file editing), it wouldn't be any different than it is now. For example, I could easily .bot file edit a bot that is virtually invisible among the other fair entrants. In fact, we've had a few people already admit to doing this.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Somebody on July 09, 2011, 04:22:09 PM
What is really so bad about using Hax Mode to stack two black batteries? I know that there are some computers that are incapable of stacking them (some people with huge trouble, some like Venko). Is it one of those "its the principle of it" type things?
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: 123savethewhales on July 09, 2011, 04:33:54 PM
We are not breaking new grounds, we are not doing anything that isn't possible with BFE.  It is simply a new "method" of doing things.  This is unlike "higgs boson" where you "don't know" what will come out of it.  This is stuff anyone who tap into BFE/game balance know exactly how it will be abused because they already been there and done that.
But clearly BFE hasn't caused the end of stock or DSL. It is possible that stock building may change, but in my opinion it is better to err on the side of openness then to speculate on what could happen, and use said speculation to help ensure this glitch never sees the light of day.
Well you are right about that, at the same time BFE didn't really bring anything good on the table either.  No improvement to gaming experience or anything.  It was simply banned.

Now see the thing with BFE is that it actually has a few hidden features that makes it difficult unless you know about them, which I mentioned a few times but is never officially documented.  BFE is also easy to mess up, and make the bot stop working entirely.  So even though it is technically released, most people cannot do more than a few minor adjustments with it.  This can explain why no "kids who registered for 2 weeks and think he's all that" is abusing it.  This glitch however I do not know it's level of difficulties.  It is quite possible that the few bad apples can pull it off and cause a lot of unnecessary dramas.

Again, as long as some potential harm is present, with no perceivable benefit, the only rational decision is to not release.  I mean, what will making things tighter do?  Make HS more powerful relative to popups?  God Mode with exostack?  I just can't see any benefit in it.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Urjak on July 09, 2011, 05:05:29 PM
This glitch however I do not know it's level of difficulties.  It is quite possible that the few bad apples can pull it off and cause a lot of unnecessary dramas.

Again, as long as some potential harm is present, with no perceivable benefit, the only rational decision is to not release.  I mean, what will making things tighter do?  Make HS more powerful relative to popups?  God Mode with exostack?  I just can't see any benefit in it.


If there is no real benefit that can be extracted by using the glitch, then exactly what drama are newcomers going to cause? It would be like someone new coming into DSL and stacking all of their components. People will tell them that they are not following the communities standards and they will either change their ways or be shunned. Likewise, if someone did use Hax Mode, the only thing they would get out of it would be a mega stacked bot that would reek of the glitch. We would tell them that competitive stock bots aren't built with the glitch and they will either abandon it or be shunned. The only thing I see changing is that we might have to take a look at how much stacking we consider tolerable (do we draw the line at 4 blacks or 3?), so that we can regulate those who are using the glitch more covertly. I think basic common sense should be enough, though perhaps not. Like I have said, this is just a part of our communities' evolution, same as when BFE and AAM came around. The community makes a decision on regulation and life goes on.


Now I can see a few benefits to this glitch. Most abstractly, the glitch could better our understanding of game mechanics, and through continued testing of it possible lead to even cooler glitches and/or anomalies. I can also see it being useful (depending on how easy it is) for people to stack batteries and such (within the agreed upon limits). I mean if the glitch saves a lot of time, why not use it? In DSL, I can maybe see it being used against components with dodgy meshes (like that accursed 6-mag gearbox). So there are some possible benefits that could come from Hax Mode, and the possible cons don't seem to be severe enough to force the glitch to remain secret.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Sage on July 09, 2011, 05:18:26 PM
It's soo much easier to stack blacks normally than to use this glitch.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: 123savethewhales on July 09, 2011, 05:25:57 PM
This glitch however I do not know it's level of difficulties.  It is quite possible that the few bad apples can pull it off and cause a lot of unnecessary dramas.

Again, as long as some potential harm is present, with no perceivable benefit, the only rational decision is to not release.  I mean, what will making things tighter do?  Make HS more powerful relative to popups?  God Mode with exostack?  I just can't see any benefit in it.


If there is no real benefit that can be extracted by using the glitch, then exactly what drama are newcomers going to cause? It would be like someone new coming into DSL and stacking all of their components. People will tell them that they are not following the communities standards and they will either change their ways or be shunned. Likewise, if someone did use Hax Mode, the only thing they would get out of it would be a mega stacked bot that would reek of the glitch. We would tell them that competitive stock bots aren't built with the glitch and they will either abandon it or be shunned. The only thing I see changing is that we might have to take a look at how much stacking we consider tolerable (do we draw the line at 4 blacks or 3?), so that we can regulate those who are using the glitch more covertly. I think basic common sense should be enough, though perhaps not. Like I have said, this is just a part of our communities' evolution, same as when BFE and AAM came around. The community makes a decision on regulation and life goes on.
When I said benefit, I am specifically talking about the balance of the game.  Certain God Mode does something, but you cease to have a playable game with that.  After everything that needs to be banned gets banned, you really don't have anything left besides maybe increase the tolerance of stack, which we can agree on.

Quote
Now I can see a few benefits to this glitch. Most abstractly, the glitch could better our understanding of game mechanics, and through continued testing of it possible lead to even cooler glitches and/or anomalies. I can also see it being useful (depending on how easy it is) for people to stack batteries and such (within the agreed upon limits). I mean if the glitch saves a lot of time, why not use it? In DSL, I can maybe see it being used against components with dodgy meshes (like that accursed 6-mag gearbox). So there are some possible benefits that could come from Hax Mode, and the possible cons don't seem to be severe enough to force the glitch to remain secret.
Like BFE, if you try to make specific things legal with it and other things not, you are going to end up with pages and pages of rulebooks with so much personal opinions that noone would follow them.

See the "nothing outside the bot lab" rule?  It's there because it's simple.  The cat is put back into the bag and that's that.  It's not really because BFE 2 black batteries is so game breaking per say.  It's just that trying to list every single thing you can/cannot do with it lacks both creditability and objectivity.  Are you going to have a vote on every single stack-able part and it's quantity?  Even if you did do that.  Why should any newcomer have to read through a whole book of house-rules just so a few people can stack one more black then currently possible?  House rules should be simple and improve the gaming experience for almost everyone.  I am almost certain that "Hax Mode Banned" will be voted for once released.

The only possible benefit is "everyone pretend like it's banned but secretly use it to save time".  Again I don't actually have problems with that, but you can already do that with BFE.  If you can't already save time BFE, but expect to do so with this glitch, then clearly that shows the intrinsic difference in their difficulties, and why this will be more abuse-able for the "bad apples".

Now sage also continuously emphasize that this is "not easier" than normally stacking.  Which means that both "save time" and "bad apple" abuse doesn't hold.  But again I just don't have any evidence to believe that from the videos he provided.  Personally though I do believe that it will be easier for me to BFE than to glitch anything, since I know something about BFE that let's me mass copy/paste.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: System32 on July 09, 2011, 06:09:11 PM
It's soo much easier to stack blacks normally than to use this glitch.
Not really at all, as far as I can tell. Axle loading? Half a minute for me. Stacking? Only done it twice, after an hour. This might become a placebo for those who find such stacking difficult.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: TriTon on July 09, 2011, 07:37:16 PM
It's soo much easier to stack blacks normally than to use this glitch.

Some of us find axle and snapper loading far easier than stacking.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Enigm@ on July 09, 2011, 07:49:12 PM
Stacking is impossible for me. D:
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Meganerdbomb on July 09, 2011, 07:54:58 PM
It's soo much easier to stack blacks normally than to use this glitch.
Not really at all, as far as I can tell. Axle loading? Half a minute for me. Stacking? Only done it twice, after an hour. This might become a placebo for those who find such stacking difficult.
I'm the same way. Snapper loading? eFFe glitch? Axle loading? No problem. Stack two blacks? I've only done it ONCE.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: madman3 on July 10, 2011, 04:32:28 AM
No matter how many C02 tanks I can stack together I almost never can stack a black, I've done it 4 times ever.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Vertigo on July 10, 2011, 05:14:12 AM
You just need more stacktice :P
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Skiitzzox220 on July 10, 2011, 07:18:27 AM
You just need more stacktice :P
icwutudidthar
But yeah I've only ever stacked two Blacks once and that was on a stacking practice bot, I've never done it on a serious bot
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Jack Daniels on July 10, 2011, 11:03:33 AM
With two jobs, community service, hobbies, relationships, and a plethora of responsibilities... I just don't have the time or patience to invest even 20 minutes into trying to stack two blacks in a chassis the
"old fashioned" way.  Even if I succeed I still have this empty void in my soul that nags me for wasting 20 minutes of my life.  :P

Any tool that makes this easier/less time consuming gets my attention. 
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: 090901 on July 10, 2011, 11:04:07 AM
See here they are going to find out everything you can do with it which means if it was ever released they would have screwed stock over more then they would have before :D
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Sage on July 10, 2011, 11:31:05 AM
it takes 30 seconds to stack a black average. can do it in 5. it's also taken an hour before. just depends on the bot. but for the most part, ur probably doing it wrong.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Scorpion on July 10, 2011, 01:23:23 PM
it takes 30 seconds to stack a black average. can do it in 5. it's also taken an hour before. just depends on the bot. but for the most part, ur probably doing it wrong.
Nope, not for me atleast, i've watched tutorials on it before to check i'm doin it right, yet it's still VERY hard to stack for me, I have to be pixel precise for stacking a black into a black, and have only ever managed to stack a CB into a nifty once, and that took closer to 30 minutes than 30 secoonds.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Scrap Daddy on July 10, 2011, 01:25:43 PM
as soon as I get home I will make a video showing all the tips and tricks I know for stacking blacks
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Scorpion on July 10, 2011, 01:29:53 PM
as soon as I get home I will make a video showing all the tips and tricks I know for stacking blacks
That could be quite handy



Or you could just release the glitch  :trollface
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Fracture on July 10, 2011, 01:34:28 PM
Sage your PT cracks me up. xD Now I know people are going to think twice about whether you're trolling us.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Jack Daniels on July 10, 2011, 06:18:20 PM
ur probably doing it wrong.

I lol. 

ur probably right. <3
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: System32 on July 11, 2011, 07:16:44 PM
it takes 30 seconds to stack a black average. can do it in 5. it's also taken an hour before. just depends on the bot. but for the most part, ur probably doing it wrong.

To highlight how dumb and fallacious what you said is, I've prepared this quote:
"Hey guys, I'm being white! Look at me being white! Why don't black people be white, it's easy! Black people, you can be white too! You were just doing it wrong!"

Good going missing half a dozen factors that have a possibility of affecting stacking, genius[!]
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Sage on July 11, 2011, 09:16:33 PM
it takes 30 seconds to stack a black average. can do it in 5. it's also taken an hour before. just depends on the bot. but for the most part, ur probably doing it wrong.

To highlight how dumb and fallacious what you said is, I've prepared this quote:
"Hey guys, I'm being white! Look at me being white! Why don't black people be white, it's easy! Black people, you can be white too! You were just doing it wrong!"

Good going missing half a dozen factors that have a possibility of affecting stacking, genius[!]

What other factors?
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: LiNcK on July 11, 2011, 09:18:50 PM
@Trovaner: Not releasing also brings the chance of someone finding out about it & Not talking about it... Just using it without telling anyone. (Ofcourse, He wont be able to overdo it or peeps will notice)
If I found out about it myself, I would use it in a few Tourneys, Win 2/3 tourneys & Then be like: LOOK WHAT I JUST FOUND 1 DAY AGO! And release it :D

Since they would be limited to the stacking ability of normal stacking (or get DQ for .bot file editing), it wouldn't be any different than it is now. For example, I could easily .bot file edit a bot that is virtually invisible among the other fair entrants. In fact, we've had a few people already admit to doing this.


Well, Im a DSL guy, IDK anything about Stock or stacking so I wouldent know the ffects of this to people that stack & Stock tourneys.
I can only see that this is 100% a benefit on the DSL side (Were no stacking is allowed) Atleast its 10)% beneficial for the way I would use it.


In DSL, I can maybe see it being used against components with dodgy meshes (like that accursed 6-mag gearbox). So there are some possible benefits that could come from Hax Mode, and the possible cons don't seem to be severe enough to force the glitch to remain secret.


Ive had that annoyance with the 6-Mag Gearbox, Its damn annoying... But the BSGs are the ones that totally enraged me all the time with those HUGE meshes, You could fit an ant in there :\
If it gets released Im only using it for those mesh probs, And to stack (Partially) thigns that CAN be stacked (Like on my popups, Putting those razors next to eachother straight is a PAIN in the ass, They touch just 1mm, But the meshes are like "I AINT GOIN' NEXT TO DAT FOO' !!!"


Like I said, I cant really give my perspective on the Stock side, And I see this would need ALOOT of regulations for stock if its gonna be released just coz you are allowed to stack in it.
Honestly, Whats keeping me a bit active everyday is THIS thread... If it gets released ill go straight to the botlab for the first time in months :D


EDIT:
Whats up with the random size=medium thingies popping up when I quote?

EDIT 2:
Oh Jeez! Why do all my posts end up being long!?! I see everyone's & Theyre short, Mine takes like 1/4 a page!! D:
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: System32 on July 12, 2011, 09:18:48 AM
it takes 30 seconds to stack a black average. can do it in 5. it's also taken an hour before. just depends on the bot. but for the most part, ur probably doing it wrong.

To highlight how dumb and fallacious what you said is, I've prepared this quote:
"Hey guys, I'm being white! Look at me being white! Why don't black people be white, it's easy! Black people, you can be white too! You were just doing it wrong!"

Good going missing half a dozen factors that have a possibility of affecting stacking, genius[!]

What other factors?
What hardware is it being run on? How is it being run? Is it being run quickly? CD or not? Pirate version? Any mods? And damage to the disc? Any corruption to the DL? Ay errors in running? Did you use glitches before? AAM used on the bot? BFE? That's not even touching the things we haven't thought of.
But hey, UR DOIN IT WONG STAKIN IS EZAY LOL NOOB!
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: 123savethewhales on July 12, 2011, 09:51:05 AM
it takes 30 seconds to stack a black average. can do it in 5. it's also taken an hour before. just depends on the bot. but for the most part, ur probably doing it wrong.

To highlight how dumb and fallacious what you said is, I've prepared this quote:
"Hey guys, I'm being white! Look at me being white! Why don't black people be white, it's easy! Black people, you can be white too! You were just doing it wrong!"

Good going missing half a dozen factors that have a possibility of affecting stacking, genius[!]
Michael Jackson did it.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: System32 on July 12, 2011, 10:04:10 AM
Quit being pedantic.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Sage on July 12, 2011, 10:37:51 AM
Do you have any proof that any of those factors actually effect stacking?
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Scorpion on July 12, 2011, 11:18:29 AM
Do you have any proof that any of those factors actually effect stacking?
Venko
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Sage on July 12, 2011, 12:57:49 PM
Do you have any proof that any of those factors actually effect stacking?
Venko

venko just had a ton of time
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Scorpion on July 12, 2011, 12:58:48 PM
Do you have any proof that any of those factors actually effect stacking?
Venko

venko just had a ton of time
lol, but, proof?
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: System32 on July 12, 2011, 02:24:48 PM
Do you have any proof that any of those factors actually effect stacking?

Prove to me they don't.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Sage on July 12, 2011, 02:28:50 PM
Do you have any proof that any of those factors actually effect stacking?

Prove to me they don't.

That's not my burden.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Meganerdbomb on July 12, 2011, 04:13:30 PM
LOL everyone in this thread is so mad.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Urjak on July 12, 2011, 04:28:47 PM
LOL everyone in this thread is so mad.


I don't think anyone in this thread is mad, though come to think of it I am a little bothered that Sage and Scrap would create this thread, already having planned on not releasing it. It seems to just be saying, "Look at how awesome this glitch we discovered is. But we don't trust you newbs so we are going to keep it a secret." I mean why show off a glitch that you plan to never reveal? To get some attention?
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hoax Mode
Post by: ACAMS on July 12, 2011, 04:41:06 PM
OK, I fixed the topic name!
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hoax Mode
Post by: Fracture on July 12, 2011, 04:46:08 PM
For a sec there I thought it was Scrap revealing the whole thing as a hoax. :P
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hoax Mode
Post by: Skiitzzox220 on July 12, 2011, 04:46:32 PM
That's the largest amount of win I've seen in a while
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hoax Mode
Post by: NFX on July 12, 2011, 04:48:36 PM
Who knew one letter could be so poignant.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hoax Mode
Post by: Scrap Daddy on July 12, 2011, 04:51:08 PM
hahahhhahaha :D
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hoax Mode
Post by: Sage on July 12, 2011, 05:09:21 PM
Damn it, you got us ACAMS. Fine... the entire thing was a hoax to draw attention to ourselves.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hoax Mode
Post by: FOTEPX on July 12, 2011, 05:10:12 PM
Damn it, you got us ACAMS. Fine... the entire thing was a hoax to draw attention to ourselves.

LOLWHAT
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hoax Mode
Post by: Mr. AS on July 12, 2011, 05:25:39 PM
Greatest trolling EVAAR.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hoax Mode
Post by: 090901 on July 12, 2011, 05:27:47 PM
Damn it, you got us ACAMS. Fine... the entire thing was a hoax to draw attention to ourselves.
THIS DOESN'T SEEM LEGIT.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: J on July 12, 2011, 05:55:20 PM
LOL everyone in this thread is so mad.
Except us.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hoax Mode
Post by: System32 on July 12, 2011, 06:02:26 PM
Damn it, you got us ACAMS. Fine... the entire thing was a hoax to draw attention to ourselves.
THIS DOESN'T SEEM LEGIT.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hoax Mode
Post by: Meganerdbomb on July 12, 2011, 07:08:21 PM
Even if it's fake, talking about it is still on topic.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hoax Mode
Post by: NFX on July 12, 2011, 07:23:10 PM
It's fake for as long as they withhold how to do it, that's the main problem. Everyone considers it to be either BFE or AAM, even with the videos up there.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hoax Mode
Post by: ACAMS on July 12, 2011, 08:02:15 PM
Arguments moved here https://gametechmods.com/forums/index.php/topic,7416.0.html (https://gametechmods.com/forums/index.php/topic,7416.0.html)


This is to discuss the hoax hax mode
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hax Mode
Post by: Serge on July 13, 2011, 04:06:16 AM
Any corruption to the DL? Ay errors in running?
lol no.

a) When installing the game from a CD, the files' integrity is checked.
b) When unpacking an archive downloaded from the internet, its' integrity is checked.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hoax Mode
Post by: Badger on July 13, 2011, 07:22:19 AM
Assuming this is legit, I don't care if is released or not. It won't affect how I build, as it seems boring and challengeless. I'm not saying that it takes no skill, but I don't think that putting anything anywhere is fun.

Let's be honest, even if it is released, it won't be used competitively, thus you will, most likely, never use it, or use it once or twice.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hoax Mode
Post by: J on July 13, 2011, 09:48:35 AM
I don't care if is released or not
But we now know it doesn't exist.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hoax Mode
Post by: LiNcK on July 13, 2011, 01:19:04 PM
Well, This was the thing to bring me back into RA2 :P
Now that the thread is done, Ill go hibernate like a bear :3

Cyall!
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hoax Mode
Post by: Mecha on July 13, 2011, 01:29:22 PM
Wait...so its fake?
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hoax Mode
Post by: Mr. AS on July 13, 2011, 01:35:07 PM
Wait...so its fake?
Damn it, you got us ACAMS. Fine... the entire thing was a hoax to draw attention to ourselves.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hoax Mode
Post by: RpJk on July 13, 2011, 01:37:26 PM
Typical young buliders.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hoax Mode
Post by: Urjak on July 13, 2011, 01:38:03 PM
Umm... I think Sage was joking about it being a hoax.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hoax Mode
Post by: Vertigo on July 13, 2011, 01:38:30 PM
^this^
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hoax Mode
Post by: Sage on July 13, 2011, 03:41:56 PM
OR WAS I
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hoax Mode
Post by: Scorpion on July 13, 2011, 03:44:33 PM
(http://www.our-happy-cat.com/image-files/6490587phatmansmall.jpg)
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hoax Mode
Post by: Badger on July 13, 2011, 04:00:33 PM
It could be 1 of 3 things:

1. Sage's levels of Sarcasm couldhave broken our detectors
2. He has seen the level of uproar this has caused, and tried to stop it
3. It was all a hoax.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hoax Mode
Post by: 123savethewhales on July 13, 2011, 04:11:42 PM
It's a hoax until it is released.  To believe otherwise is pointless.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hoax Mode
Post by: Sage on July 14, 2011, 12:12:52 AM
Honestly people there has to be someway to prove it's legit without telling you how exactly to do it.

What would convince you?
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hoax Mode
Post by: Urjak on July 14, 2011, 12:15:44 AM
Honestly people there has to be someway to prove it's legit without telling you how exactly to do it.

What would convince you?


There is nothing else. In a video we can't be certain you didn't tamper with the game before hand, and I'm not sure of any other medium you could demonstrate in. I mean a picture would be even worse...
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hoax Mode
Post by: Sage on July 14, 2011, 12:22:15 AM
Honestly people there has to be someway to prove it's legit without telling you how exactly to do it.

What would convince you?


There is nothing else. In a video we can't be certain you didn't tamper with the game before hand, and I'm not sure of any other medium you could demonstrate in. I mean a picture would be even worse...

Could someone explain how I could alter the game WHILE PLAYING to somehow remove collisions? I'm curious where this conspiracy came from.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hoax Mode
Post by: Fracture on July 14, 2011, 12:26:56 AM
What would convince you?
I'm guessing they'd want you to tell somebody who wouldn't lie to the regular community (and say you/Scrap showed you how to do it when you really didn't), but of course in your defense it has to be someone who also won't spread the secret. You can't find a long-time user here as they are prone to being accused of the former given situation, but also can't tell someone who isn't trustworthy or serious enough to keep it a secret, so it should be a new person (6 months or less is good) who doesn't really stay on the AU and Mods' side of things, and who you think you can trust. I vote Geice. :P He's already tried so hard to find it so that's an added bonus.

Just giving some options if you really feel like you want to settle things down.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hoax Mode
Post by: Sage on July 14, 2011, 12:34:01 AM
Me and Scrap are people who would lie to the community?
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hoax Mode
Post by: 09090901 on July 14, 2011, 12:34:36 AM
What would convince you?
He's already tried so hard to find it so that's an added bonus.
Do you mean me? I spent about 2 minutes trying to get it before I got bored.

I think we should all forgot about it and pretend life is happy. Or you can tell Garvin and see what lulz occur.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hoax Mode
Post by: Fracture on July 14, 2011, 06:26:28 AM
Me and Scrap are people who would lie to the community?

Evidently yes. :bigsmile:

I am on the fence about this, them creating such a useful glitch and not releasing it seems a bit fuzzy. I must say though if this is real, then I happily applaud you. But if this is fake or a joke, then I'll laugh my a** off.
Yes, it's a ton of fun to mess around with :D
This is definitively fake.
Damn it, you got us ACAMS. Fine... the entire thing was a hoax to draw attention to ourselves.
THIS DOESN'T SEEM LEGIT.
Umm... I think Sage was joking about it being a hoax.
OR WAS I
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hoax Mode
Post by: JoeBlo on July 14, 2011, 07:01:14 AM
Honestly people there has to be someway to prove it's legit without telling you how exactly to do it.
Tell me and I will back you up

:P

Its impossible to 100% confirm it until people can try it themselves.. and that option is rather controversial at this stage...
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hoax Mode
Post by: 123savethewhales on July 14, 2011, 09:53:40 AM
Honestly people there has to be someway to prove it's legit without telling you how exactly to do it.

What would convince you?
Nothing.  For all I know you might as well be using a memory hack.  If collision is processed with a memory state then it shouldn't even be that hard to freeze it using cheat engine.

But more importantly, I don't believe it because "exist but can never enter my reality" is no different from "not exist".
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hoax Mode
Post by: Sage on July 14, 2011, 10:00:52 AM
Honestly people there has to be someway to prove it's legit without telling you how exactly to do it.

What would convince you?

But more importantly, I don't believe it because "exist but can never enter my reality" is no different from "not exist".

So someone you see on TV doesn't exist, because you have not seen them in real life for yourself?
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hoax Mode
Post by: Thyrus on July 14, 2011, 10:04:05 AM
yes
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hoax Mode
Post by: 123savethewhales on July 14, 2011, 10:19:06 AM
Honestly people there has to be someway to prove it's legit without telling you how exactly to do it.

What would convince you?

But more importantly, I don't believe it because "exist but can never enter my reality" is no different from "not exist".

So someone you see on TV doesn't exist, because you have not seen them in real life for yourself?
A better analogy is "the person I thought I knew on TV most likely does not exist".  Fake personality, makeups, fake names, you name it, they do it.  The only thing that is needed to not believe is "not enough evidences".  If you have to prove "not exist" to not believe, you would have to believe in invisible pink unicorn.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hoax Mode
Post by: freeziez on July 14, 2011, 10:20:56 AM
Are you guys still arguing about this?

The bot is real, and even if it doesn't use Hax Mode, it's still baddass.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hoax Mode
Post by: Badger on July 14, 2011, 10:59:47 AM
Honestly people there has to be someway to prove it's legit without telling you how exactly to do it.

What would convince you?

But more importantly, I don't believe it because "exist but can never enter my reality" is no different from "not exist".

So someone you see on TV doesn't exist, because you have not seen them in real life for yourself?
A better analogy is "the person I thought I knew on TV most likely does not exist".  Fake personality, makeups, fake names, you name it, they do it.  The only thing that is needed to not believe is "not enough evidences".  If you have to prove "not exist" to not believe, you would have to believe in invisible pink unicorn.
Easy to prove, it will be a unicorn, thus solid, therefore it must make contact with everything it touches. I have never been touched by a unicorn that I couldn't see. It could not be a liquid, as a unicorn has a certain shape, and an invisible unicorn made of gas? That would be called air.
And if the unicorn is invisible, it cannot have a colour, so it cannot be pink.  :trollface
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hoax Mode
Post by: 123savethewhales on July 14, 2011, 12:26:26 PM
Honestly people there has to be someway to prove it's legit without telling you how exactly to do it.

What would convince you?

But more importantly, I don't believe it because "exist but can never enter my reality" is no different from "not exist".

So someone you see on TV doesn't exist, because you have not seen them in real life for yourself?
A better analogy is "the person I thought I knew on TV most likely does not exist".  Fake personality, makeups, fake names, you name it, they do it.  The only thing that is needed to not believe is "not enough evidences".  If you have to prove "not exist" to not believe, you would have to believe in invisible pink unicorn.
Easy to prove, it will be a unicorn, thus solid, therefore it must make contact with everything it touches. I have never been touched by a unicorn that I couldn't see. It could not be a liquid, as a unicorn has a certain shape, and an invisible unicorn made of gas? That would be called air.
And if the unicorn is invisible, it cannot have a colour, so it cannot be pink.  :trollface
Hold on a sec, just when the heck did you touch an unicorn?  Oh I got it you bought some Twilight Sparkle toys.

It follows that if you take that toy into a dark room, turn off the light, and touch it, you just touched an unicorn that you couldn't see.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hoax Mode
Post by: LiNcK on July 14, 2011, 02:03:40 PM
Honestly people there has to be someway to prove it's legit without telling you how exactly to do it.

What would convince you?

But more importantly, I don't believe it because "exist but can never enter my reality" is no different from "not exist".

So someone you see on TV doesn't exist, because you have not seen them in real life for yourself?
A better analogy is "the person I thought I knew on TV most likely does not exist".  Fake personality, makeups, fake names, you name it, they do it.


ITS LIKE JERSEY SHORE ALL OVER AGAIN!!!
NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEZZZZZZZZZZ!!!!! D:


Honestly, I dont think we need any more proof, I mean... Why would they lie? What do they get?
Its basically a loss of everyone's time if its fake, Theyll be like: HAHA! You believed us.
So?

Theres no point in lying that you discovered a new glitch really... Atleast for me, Too much works making the vids & To just say that it was a lie & Troll everybody.
Not worth MY time atleast :\
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hoax Mode
Post by: Badger on July 14, 2011, 02:37:28 PM
Honestly people there has to be someway to prove it's legit without telling you how exactly to do it.

What would convince you?

But more importantly, I don't believe it because "exist but can never enter my reality" is no different from "not exist".

So someone you see on TV doesn't exist, because you have not seen them in real life for yourself?
A better analogy is "the person I thought I knew on TV most likely does not exist".  Fake personality, makeups, fake names, you name it, they do it.  The only thing that is needed to not believe is "not enough evidences".  If you have to prove "not exist" to not believe, you would have to believe in invisible pink unicorn.
Easy to prove, it will be a unicorn, thus solid, therefore it must make contact with everything it touches. I have never been touched by an invisible unicorn. It could not be a liquid, as a unicorn has a certain shape, and an invisible unicorn made of gas? That would be called air.
And if the unicorn is invisible, it cannot have a colour, so it cannot be pink.  :trollface
Hold on a sec, just when the heck did you touch an unicorn?  Oh I got it you bought some Twilight Sparkle toys.

It follows that if you take that toy into a dark room, turn off the light, and touch it, you just touched an unicorn that you couldn't see.
Fixed!
And why do you assume that I would buy an MLP toy?
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hoax Mode
Post by: 123savethewhales on July 14, 2011, 02:43:23 PM
Fixed!
And why do you assume that I would buy an MLP toy?
Because it's not like there are other unicorns out there that you can get your hands on.....
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hoax Mode
Post by: Badger on July 14, 2011, 02:48:06 PM
Fixed!
And why do you assume that I would buy an MLP toy?
Because it's not like there are other unicorns out there that you can get your hands on.....
That's what she said!  :trollface
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hoax Mode
Post by: 123savethewhales on July 14, 2011, 03:03:17 PM
Fixed!
And why do you assume that I would buy an MLP toy?
Because it's not like there are other unicorns out there that you can get your hands on.....
That's what she said!  :trollface
So you DO have MLP toys then.

ITS LIKE JERSEY SHORE ALL OVER AGAIN!!!
NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEZZZZZZZZZZ!!!!! D:


Honestly, I dont think we need any more proof, I mean... Why would they lie? What do they get?
Its basically a loss of everyone's time if its fake, Theyll be like: HAHA! You believed us.
So?

Theres no point in lying that you discovered a new glitch really... Atleast for me, Too much works making the vids & To just say that it was a lie & Troll everybody.
Not worth MY time atleast :\
Just because "Sage and SD posted it" isn't good enough.  Why might they lie?  Attention.  After all, what's the point of even telling everyone they found something if they not going to share it?  Attention.  I guarantee that if no one responded to this thread from the very start they would have been disappointed.

So attention is certainly what they wanted, the only question left is how far will they go to get it.  Besides we are on a forum where people will fake their own suicide and gender just to troll.  Not believing without evidences is a good measure to take.  Again this is something universal and not specific to Sage or SD.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hoax Mode
Post by: Badger on July 14, 2011, 03:10:00 PM
I have no MLP toys. Ask MNB for them.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hoax Mode
Post by: Sage on July 14, 2011, 10:15:03 PM
Release thread coming soon.
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hoax Mode
Post by: R0B0SH4RK on July 14, 2011, 10:35:31 PM
The Hax Mode Guide is now up for public comsumption!

The thread: https://gametechmods.com/forums/index.php/topic,7468.0.html (https://gametechmods.com/forums/index.php/topic,7468.0.html)

And since I really don't want to answer this question, I'll answer it before you guys ask:

Neither Scrap nor Sage told me how to superstack. I figured it out on my own using clues from the original thread (on the night of July 3rd if you're really asking. This is also why I neglected to answer S32's argument at first, since I was now talking from the other side of the fence xD). When I did, I approached Sage with what I'd found. He informed me that yes, I had discovered the correct method. When this thread was first posted, I was left in the dark as much as you guys were and was never told.

After, we worked on compiling the guide for you guys. And now you all can Hax Mode.

Happy Building :D
Title: Re: New Glitch - Hoax Mode
Post by: kill343gs on July 14, 2011, 11:46:59 PM
locking thread since we're done talking about how fake this is.