Author Topic: A table for bot type efficiency (Read 5467 times)

RpJk · « **on:** October 16, 2011, 04:07:33 AM »

Ok This is an idea to help people understand what bot types are normally good and what they are weak against.

I've got an idea where it is like Pokemon types, Fire> Grass> Water> Fire

This is kinda like this when it comes to Robot Combat.

VS > Rammer > HS >VS

So I thought this would help alot for people who are new to competitive building in RA2.

However I will need suggestions when it comes to hybrids.

Is this a good idea?

ty4er · « **Reply #1 on:** October 16, 2011, 04:18:59 AM »

Would be useful if you actually knew what types are good against others.

HS isn't always better than VS

Pwnator · « **Reply #2 on:** October 16, 2011, 04:25:28 AM »

Quote from: ty4er on October 16, 2011, 04:18:59 AM

Would be useful if you actually knew what types are good against others.

HS isn't always better than VS

And Scizor can still take on Flareon with the right moveset. Specializing something will always be an exception.

So yeah, that's pretty much it.

Naryar · « **Reply #3 on:** October 16, 2011, 04:45:03 AM »

What they said.

RpJk · « **Reply #4 on:** October 16, 2011, 05:09:32 AM »

Ok so give me suggestions.

Pwnator · « **Reply #5 on:** October 16, 2011, 05:22:12 AM »

That's pretty much it, really. List down the other types you would want to include to make this easier.

Naryar · « **Reply #6 on:** October 16, 2011, 05:45:25 AM »

The only clear one is Popup > Rammer. Other than that...

ty4er · « **Reply #7 on:** October 16, 2011, 05:58:19 AM »

pfft my rammer beat a popup [/brag]

Hows about hammer > SS then?

Fracture · « **Reply #8 on:** October 16, 2011, 08:34:04 AM »

Quote from: Naryar on October 16, 2011, 05:45:25 AM

The only clear one is Popup > Rammer. Other than that...

Warmachine

Pwnator · « **Reply #9 on:** October 16, 2011, 08:36:34 AM »

Quote from: Fracture on October 16, 2011, 08:34:04 AM

Warmachine

Quote from: Pwnator on October 16, 2011, 04:25:28 AM

Specializing something will always be an exception.

:P

Fracture · « **Reply #10 on:** October 16, 2011, 08:42:54 AM »

Longbow would be a specialized rammer. Warmachine is pretty typical.

Anyway RA2 isn't exactly comparable to Pokemon in that there are concrete matchups of certain types beating other types, so I'll say good luck with making this idea work.

System32 · « **Reply #11 on:** October 16, 2011, 08:52:27 AM »

SnS > VS
SnS > Popups
SnS < Rammers
SnS = HS

HS > Rammers
HS < VS
HS = SnS
HS = Popups

VS > HS
VS < Popups
VS > Rammers
VS < SnS

Popups > Rammers
Popups > VS
Popups = HS
Popups < SnS

Mr. AS · « **Reply #12 on:** October 16, 2011, 09:14:07 AM »

Stock or DSL?
Because saw-bots are a lot better in DSL than stock...

Naryar · « **Reply #13 on:** October 16, 2011, 09:17:03 AM »

Quote from: Fracture on October 16, 2011, 08:34:04 AM

Quote from: Naryar on October 16, 2011, 05:45:25 AM
The only clear one is Popup > Rammer. Other than that...
Warmachine

That's because the popup had no defense. 90% of popups, at the HW level, have defense.

And one rammer win on a popup doesn't count, cause 95% of the time when a classic rammer faces a classic popup the popup wins anyway. One expection doesn't makes the statement "most of the time popups destroy rammers" false.

Edit : And yes, stock or DSL changes the odds. So we can't really make a simple table for bot efficiency ala Pokémon. Besides, RA2 is more complicated. Bot type isn't the same thing as a type in Pokémon.

RpJk · « **Reply #14 on:** October 16, 2011, 11:55:02 AM »

Quote from: Fracture on October 16, 2011, 08:34:04 AM

Quote from: Naryar on October 16, 2011, 05:45:25 AM
The only clear one is Popup > Rammer. Other than that...
Warmachine

Can I see a pic of Warmachine?

Sage · « **Reply #15 on:** October 16, 2011, 12:04:30 PM »

It depends on the freaking skill level of the bot builder. Generally HS rape everything and Popups rape everything else.

Mecha · « **Reply #16 on:** October 16, 2011, 12:21:05 PM »

Quote from: RPJK on October 16, 2011, 11:55:02 AM

Can I see a pic of Warmachine?

Here you go.

he's the guy in the sky.

Virus Bomb · « **Reply #17 on:** October 16, 2011, 01:29:48 PM »

funny thing about that pic is that the rammer actually isn't warmachine, but just a pretty damn accurate replica of it that i made.

Badnik96 · « **Reply #18 on:** October 16, 2011, 01:36:17 PM »

how about we make a table. Like for a round-robin tourney or PKMN type matchups.

We pit a REALLY GOOD example of two different bot classes against each other (like Seism 13 vs AC for popup vs HS) and do it 10 times.

The robot that wins more times is better than the other. If they both win 5 times, then they are equal in terms of strength.

I'll volunteer to do this over Christmas break if this is a cool idea. (of course we'd have to do both stock and DSL ones)

also we need good examples of each bot type for each weight class (AW, BW, LW, MW, HW, and SHW). Might need some people to send some examples IN THE NAME OF SCIENCE

Naryar · « **Reply #19 on:** October 16, 2011, 02:04:18 PM »

Quote from: Badnik96 on October 16, 2011, 01:36:17 PM

how about we make a table. Like for a round-robin tourney or PKMN type matchups.

We pit a REALLY GOOD example of two different bot classes against each other (like Seism 13 vs AC for popup vs HS) and do it 10 times.

The robot that wins more times is better than the other. If they both win 5 times, then they are equal in terms of strength.

I'll volunteer to do this over Christmas break if this is a cool idea. (of course we'd have to do both stock and DSL ones)

also we need good examples of each bot type for each weight class (AW, BW, LW, MW, HW, and SHW). Might need some people to send some examples IN THE NAME OF SCIENCE

No, one example of a bot is not enough. To be precise, we should just go and amuse ourselves to take stats from every single non-SFTW (cause a SFTW pretty much loses to any bot type) entry into every single tournament and challenge that has ever been done on Gametechmods, see how it won or lost against what bot type, and calculate probabilities out of this.

It'll take a

of a long time, but it will be much more accurate than just one example of a tournament.