Ghosts

[frezal]

I for one know I feel asleep the way I woke. Yes you turn and toss in your sleep. Every one does. I know cause sometimes my sheets are every were.

How do you know you didn't squirm or roll over in your sleep? Just because your sheets didn't move, that doesn't mean you didn't. Unless of course your nightwear and sheets are velcro.

Judging by what your talking about here you'v never had anything of the sort happen so I'll have a hard time getting the point to you.

I don't get sleep paralysis, but my friend/former roommate does. He's told me all about it. Your story sounds exactly like what he experiences.

When you are in a room or any were and a demon (Or how you guys like it called ghost) is in the area you know. There presents let you know. You mainly get scared or get the feeling you want to leave that area right now or both or possibly more. If your like 85% or more of the world you'll just think I'm a freak and needs to go to a psycho place. Thats what the world more or less does with people who do have these.......expreences (Spelling not coming to me)

Again, what's the more logical conclusion: you were in a well-known, and quite common state known as sleep paralysis where hallucinations and a sense of fear are common, or a supernatural phenomenon occurred that breaks all of the laws of physics?

[Little lost bot]

Some times demons (Ghosts) and logic do not mix so if your a person who thinks logic is every thing let me know because then I'm speaking pointlessly to you.

I for one know I feel asleep the way I woke. Yes you turn and toss in your sleep. Every one does. I know cause sometimes my sheets are every were.

How do you know you didn't squirm or roll over in your sleep? Just because your sheets didn't move, that doesn't mean you didn't. Unless of course your nightwear and sheets are velcro. Either your taking this to the extreme or you analyze every thing and sometimes to far. I fail to see what your comet has to do with this debate. Yes I went to sleep the way I woke, when did I mention though that I din't move at all?

Judging by what your talking about here you'v never had anything of the sort happen so I'll have a hard time getting the point to you.

I don't get sleep paralysis, but my friend/former roommate does. He's told me all about it. Your story sounds exactly like what he experiences. Do I need to provide another one of my experience's with you? One that I was wide awake for and could move and got rid of (sort of)?

When you are in a room or any were and a demon (Or how you guys like it called ghost) is in the area you know. There presents let you know. You mainly get scared or get the feeling you want to leave that area right now or both or possibly more. If your like 85% or more of the world you'll just think I'm a freak and needs to go to a psycho place. Thats what the world more or less does with people who do have these.......expreences (Spelling not coming to me)

Again, what's the more logical conclusion: you were in a well-known, and quite common state known as sleep paralysis where hallucinations and a sense of fear are common, or a supernatural phenomenon occurred that breaks all of the laws of physics? It appears I do need to give another one. If you'll hear it then I'll give it.

[frezal]

Some times demons (Ghosts) and logic do not mix so if your a person who thinks logic is every thing let me know because then I'm speaking pointlessly to you.

If it's not logical, why would you think it's so? Logic is the very basis of human understanding. Here's a bullsh** example for you: My carpet is brown. Therefore all carpet must be brown. That conclusion isn't logical, and thus, is quite a stupid conclusion to make.

Your conclusion is entirely irrational. First of all, you make the assumption that demons exist. You go on to assume that it was a demon who is guilty of shoving you into your bed, and not another person, alien, monster, vampire, bear, taco, Jesus, Evil Lincoln, etc. Those are two huge assumptions with little to no supporting evidence. However, sleep paralysis is something that has been studied, is known to occur, and is known to produce situations very similar to the one you shared. So my question now is, why do you maintain that it was a demon when more plausible explanations exist?

Feel free to share your other encounter(s). I will do my best to analyze the situation and offer up a conclusion of my own, if possible. For the record, I don't feel as though you're a liar. I know you legitimately believe what you're saying. What I'm doing is providing you with possible explanations that can actually be backed by science and reasoning.

[Incredirobotwars]

Looking at this argument, I'd say sleep paralysis. If you don't think so, it's worth doing some research into it. I'm sure there are many people who would, after that experience, think 'that was really freaky, and I can't think of any way to explain it other than ghosts.' So, I don't think there's much need for an argument if we just consider both sides.

[Little lost bot]

Some times demons (Ghosts) and logic do not mix so if your a person who thinks logic is every thing let me know because then I'm speaking pointlessly to you.

If it's not logical, why would you think it's so? Logic is the very basis of human understanding. Here's a bullsh** example for you: My carpet is brown. Therefore all carpet must be brown. That conclusion isn't logical, and thus, is quite a stupid conclusion to make. In that case be glad you don't go to school over here then, 90% or more think like that sadly.

Your conclusion is entirely irrational. First of all, you make the assumption that demons exist. You go on to assume that it was a demon who is guilty of shoving you into your bed, and not another person, alien, monster, vampire, bear, taco, Jesus, Evil Lincoln, etc. Those are two huge assumptions with little to no supporting evidence. However, sleep paralysis is something that has been studied, is known to occur, and is known to produce situations very similar to the one you shared. So my question now is, why do you maintain that it was a demon when more plausible explanations exist? I could give you one that was in the day not when I was sleeping.

Feel free to share your other encounter(s). I will do my best to analyze the situation and offer up a conclusion of my own, if possible. For the record, I don't feel as though you're a liar. I know you legitimately believe what you're saying. What I'm doing is providing you with possible explanations that can actually be backed by science and reasoning.

For one of them my cat saw, staring at this one spot...... at what seemed to be nothing for me and the rest of the family. But he was freaked to the point were he would not move at all. I picked him up and moved him and he kept his eye's on the spot. I move him again into my room still staring at this one spot. I went to leave my room and found this spot and felt a cold spot right were he was looking at. the rest of the house was around 20 degrees and this one spot was very cold and only that spot. The spot was not near a window nor in the middle of the place. We got rid of it by praying to Christ and this spot slowly went back to normal and the cat went back to his normal behaver.

[Incredirobotwars]

hm...well...the only way I can think to explain that is...

...uh...

...well...

...*does not compute*...*explodes*

Seriously, tho, that's messed up.

[Scorpion]

Hardly. The getting rid of it by praying makes it even more likely to just be psyhcological.

[Little lost bot]

Hardly. The getting rid of it by praying makes it even more likely to just be psyhcological.

Then explain why 4 beings all felt or saw it? I hardly doubt my entire family suddenly developed it right then and there. You seem to be one of those people that nothing is real or possible if it don't match logic right away.

[NFX]

I think I read somewhere that if you believe something will happen, then your subconscious tricks your senses into creating that occurrence. That might explain the cold spot on the ground, if your initial thought was that it was a ghost, then your subconscious might have created the cold spot on the ground, tricking your brain into thinking it was there.

[Little lost bot]

One, the cat saw it. Two the spot was not on the ground it was in the air. Three I just mentioned the spot to my mom and sis who in turn tested the spot. Then my mom said it was a demon. As for the praying part you'd have to be a Christan to really understand by what I met by praying. The worlds way of thinking will not understand it.

[Scorpion]

Hardly. The getting rid of it by praying makes it even more likely to just be psyhcological.

Then explain why 4 beings all felt or saw it? I hardly doubt my entire family suddenly developed it right then and there. You seem to be one of those people that nothing is real or possible if it don't match logic right away.

I don't dismiss anything that doesn't match logic straight away, I simply don't believe in ghost or demons because there is a very poor supporting case for both.

And hello there NFX, I was just going to say something similair. If I can just judge you for a second, you seem to be the kind of person who's easily led to believe in such superstitions, for whatever reason, but, assuming your family are similair to you in this, which they very well could be, then yes, as NFX said, it's probably just you subconscieously wanting there to be a "ghost" or a "demon" there.

One, you don't know the cat saw it, cats do strange things, mine likes to sleep in a certain cardboard box, that doesn't mean that that box is blessed by the tooth fairy.
Two, where the spot is means squat
Three, actually, that proves my previous judgements.

[SteveM4]

Cold regions in housed can be described by the Coriolis effect.

Air is a fluid, like water. And, like water draining from the sink, it rotates in a anti-clockwise direction due to the earth rotating.
If you live in a warm house, and someone has entered the house within the last 2 hours and cold air got in, the overall temperature of the house will hardly change as the cold air rushed through the door. Since cool air has a higher density than warm air, it sinks toward the bottom the house.
If you have the right scenario, you could walk up the stairs and physically feel it getting warmer. If many people cam upstairs cool air would be dragged up with them, since the distilling effect isn't that strong. The cool air will rise slowly and then settle normally, but if he house is of a awkward shape, like if furniture is about the place. It will form a pocket of cool air, rotation in an anti-clockwise direction as it slowly descends at a very slow rate.

Next point

Felines can see into the Ultra-violet (that how lions hunt at night) and if this floating pocket of air is a rare occurrence in your house or you have a cat that has recently joined the house hold. The cat could see a space of Violet floating in the air, and the cat will not know what it is, so will look at it to make sure it isn't a threat. Since the pocket or cool air is rotating and descending, the cat would have been scared of its movement, so will be very still.

Next

You feel where the cat is looking and feel the cool air pocket and your brain cant think up a rational explanation so it must be a "demon" due to your religious upbringings. As you preyed for the "demon" to go away, as the pocket may have descended since, it would no longer be in the same place where it was before, so you think it is gone. The cat assumes it is not a threat and assumes normal behaviour.

PHEW!

[Little lost bot]

I said what I did there do to getting similar responses before like that anyway I for one like to know how those around me behave including the family cat. Who acted out of character for the brief time there. Up until then I haven't had one decide to show up at day time.




I was trying to avoid this debate.

Cold regions in housed can be described by the Coriolis effect.

Air is a fluid, like water. And, like water draining from the sink, it rotates in a anti-clockwise direction due to the earth rotating.
If you live in a warm house, and someone has entered the house within the last 2 hours and cold air got in, the overall temperature of the house will hardly change as the cold air rushed through the door. Since cool air has a higher density than warm air, it sinks toward the bottom the house.
If you have the right scenario, you could walk up the stairs and physically feel it getting warmer. If many people cam upstairs cool air would be dragged up with them, since the distilling effect isn't that strong. The cool air will rise slowly and then settle normally, but if he house is of a awkward shape, like if furniture is about the place. It will form a pocket of cool air, rotation in an anti-clockwise direction as it slowly descends at a very slow rate.

Next point

Felines can see into the Ultra-violet (that how lions hunt at night) and if this floating pocket of air is a rare occurrence in your house or you have a cat that has recently joined the house hold. The cat could see a space of Violet floating in the air, and the cat will not know what it is, so will look at it to make sure it isn't a threat. Since the pocket or cool air is rotating and descending, the cat would have been scared of its movement, so will be very still.

Next

You feel where the cat is looking and feel the cool air pocket and your brain cant think up a rational explanation so it must be a "demon" due to your religious upbringings. As you preyed for the "demon" to go away, as the pocket may have descended since, it would no longer be in the same place where it was before, so you think it is gone. The cat assumes it is not a threat and assumes normal behaviour.

PHEW!

Both things that would have caused it were not present there though. By then the cat had lived with the family for 5 years. And we had been home for some time and no one was leaving nor coming in the last 4-5 hours.

[SteveM4]

What did you, as a family do 3 hours before the event?

[Little lost bot]

We all in the living room talking about school, cat was on a chair at that moment. Windows were shut do to smoke and dust out side. Door remained shut for 4-5 hours after me and my sis got home from school a couple hours before.

[SteveM4]

Hmm.

Thats the best theory I have so either be scared you house is possessed or that there is a small draught

[frezal]

One, the cat saw it. Two the spot was not on the ground it was in the air.

Cats stare. That's what they do. Also, like humans, cats can only see visible light. They cannot see ultraviolet light, but rather have a membrane that reflects light back into the retina. If your room was well lit, your cat was actually at a disadvantage because this membrane causes cats to see worse than humans in light. Besides, a cat's vision maxes out at 2-3 feet in front of its face.

So basically, if your cat could see something, you should have been able to see it as well. You didn't, so why are you so certain that your cat did?

Three I just mentioned the spot to my mom and sis who in turn tested the spot. Then my mom said it was a demon. As for the praying part you'd have to be a Christan to really understand by what I met by praying. The worlds way of thinking will not understand it.

Ah, so that's what this is about. You obviously come from a deeply religious family. Your mother's explanation for any odd phenomenon is "demons". She has clearly raised you to not question her judgment. But consider for a moment that it's not a demon and that there was just a cold spot in your house. We know that cold spots develop. On the other hand, we have no evidence that it was a demon in your house. What if it was the Holy Ghost keeping an eye on you? There's just as little evidence to support that as there is a demon.

The praying likely got rid of the problem the same way that placebos can cure diseases: you essentially tricked yourself into improvement. You desperately wanted to get rid of the unknown. Your mother provided an answer to the unknown. To you, she is a highly reputable source, so you accepted her answer. You were scared. She then provided the solution: praying. You prayed. No longer could the cold be felt anymore. Why? Before the praying, you were (maybe even subconsciously) looking for anything out of the ordinary. After the praying, you were looking for normalsy. It's really that simple.

As I've said before, this solution is testable. Yours relies on many assumptions and in no way can be tested. So, why believe it was a demon?

[Little lost bot]

One, the cat saw it. Two the spot was not on the ground it was in the air.

Cats stare. That's what they do. Also, like humans, cats can only see visible light. They cannot see ultraviolet light, but rather have a membrane that reflects light back into the retina. If your room was well lit, your cat was actually at a disadvantage because this membrane causes cats to see worse than humans in light. Besides, a cat's vision maxes out at 2-3 feet in front of its face.

So basically, if your cat could see something, you should have been able to see it as well. You didn't, so why are you so certain that your cat did? As I said before I for one like to know how those around me behave including the family cat. And I'm very sure cats can see further than that. Other wise he is extremely good at tracking lazer light paths for starters.

Three I just mentioned the spot to my mom and sis who in turn tested the spot. Then my mom said it was a demon. As for the praying part you'd have to be a Christan to really understand by what I met by praying. The worlds way of thinking will not understand it.

Ah, so that's what this is about. You obviously come from a deeply religious family. Your mother's explanation for any odd phenomenon is "demons". She has clearly raised you to not question her judgment. But consider for a moment that it's not a demon and that there was just a cold spot in your house. We know that cold spots develop. On the other hand, we have no evidence that it was a demon in your house. What if it was the Holy Ghost keeping an eye on you? There's just as little evidence to support that as there is a demon.

The praying likely got rid of the problem the same way that placebos can cure diseases: you essentially tricked yourself into improvement. You desperately wanted to get rid of the unknown. Your mother provided an answer to the unknown. To you, she is a highly reputable source,Funny that you would say that. We can disagree so bad that I have punched her before while she was slapping me. so you accepted her answer. You were scared. She then provided the solution: praying. You prayed. No longer could the cold be felt anymore. Why? Before the praying, you were (maybe even subconsciously) looking for anything out of the ordinary. After the praying, you were looking for normalsy. It's really that simple.

As I've said before, this solution is testable. Yours relies on many assumptions and in no way can be tested. So, why believe it was a demon? Ain't all problems testable? Yes it is on assumptions thats how humans work. For all you know you could be talking to a computer thats giving these answers. How do you know your not? Other factors. Do all agree with some of these factors? No. The way I'v been brought up may seem......... religious but it also explains so other things for me as well. Science can't explain every thing. For one Its very depressing to think your nothing (note the "Nothing") more then a random chemical mix that is now some how living. But now I'm going off on a different topic all together there. The place is small and not much air flow. Yes these no evidence that I can say or you'll accept to prove it was a demon not a random air pocket.   

[Naryar]

Magical thinking VS rationalism ?

No need to battle, that's a stalemate already :P

[NFX]

I am in agreement with Nar. But I believe that it is simply a figment of your own imagination, trying to come up with some explanation for what's happening, and only receiving "demons" from your brain. I also agree with frezal (!) about the placebo effect, if you believe something will happen, then it will happen. Or, at the very least, your brain will put together a series of otherwise unrelated events and come to the conclusion that the thing has happened. And rooms do get cold spots in them, but I'm not certain why. KM's explanation about air being a fluid seems the most believable to me so far.