Author Topic: BFEBOTS! (Read 4948 times)

roboman2444 · « **on:** October 16, 2009, 07:05:31 PM »

im thinking of starting an another tourney. BFEBOTS

Weight Class

will be stock lw and u can BFE, AAM and Zero G the robots!

Prizes

Prize will be many things, from..

A trophy bot( chassis shaped exactly like a trophy) or
To get to be the first person to beta test of rdma2(may be a while)

I will think of more prizes soon.

Format

AI Tournament

Note: since im not that good at AI'ing, please send bindings, plus the .py file if u use one that does not come w/ stock, if possible.

Extra Information

There will be prizes for coolest looking bot, most effort put in to bfe bot, and others

Other Stuff

I did want this to be an online tourney, but it will be hard to do schedules and whatnot. and it would be better in the middle of summer or on xmas vacation. so this tournament will not be an online one but future ones may

This is an idea, so its not final.

kill343gs · « **Reply #1 on:** October 16, 2009, 07:12:15 PM »

Set up your rules in understandable english, learn to AI yourself, come up with some better prizes or nobody will want to enter. If it's an online tourney, why do people even need to AI their bots? You need to make this whole thing more clear.

roboman2444 · « **Reply #2 on:** October 16, 2009, 07:15:52 PM »

its just an idea...
an di can ai, but im bad at it.
edit: its not gunna be an online tourney, only later versions of it are.

123savethewhales · « **Reply #3 on:** October 16, 2009, 07:58:16 PM »

The only thing better than a razor tip with 1000 life is one with an infinite amount of life.

How about buzz lightyear with indestructible spikes and completely covered with indestructible polycarbonate skirts?

Clickbeetle · « **Reply #4 on:** October 16, 2009, 08:20:45 PM »

He means that with BFE, you can attach razor tips to the baseplate, making them invincible.

Or better yet, attach weaponized 20cm extenders to the baseplate. 2 kgs, 100 DP, and infinite HP.

So you could easily make a bot covered in invincible weapons. Therefore ruining the tournament.

If you allow BFE/AAM in a tournament, it needs to be regulated. Heavily.

Example: "You can use BFE/AAM for stacking, and nothing else."

Or, "You can use BFE to change the base type of components, and nothing else. (So you can make servo HP Z-teks, or weaponized extenders and stuff.)"

Edit: this was in reply to roboman saying "Wha?", which he apparently deleted.

roboman2444 · « **Reply #5 on:** October 16, 2009, 08:22:13 PM »

ohhh, bfe lets u atach anything to anything?
and does bfe let u use the rule of 7?

Clickbeetle · « **Reply #6 on:** October 16, 2009, 08:24:59 PM »

BFE lets you attach anything to anything, break the rule of 7, and even stack multiple parts on the same attach point. It also lets you attach parts to nothing, so you can have loose weapons laying around that act as landmines.

Which is why it needs to be regulated if you allow it. Kind of like custom parts--there's no limit to what you can do.

Madiaba · « **Reply #7 on:** October 16, 2009, 08:27:16 PM »

1. Guys let him try his hand here....(deleted spam).

2.

Quote from: kill343gs;73281

Set up your rules in understandable english,.... YEP!

R-man, Phil, Nar, Serge, Apanx, Venko, etc... use English much better than you do. Try using whole words, capital letters and punctuation. If you're going to do this, then both your typing and your thoughts need to be clear,... instead of laborious and/or frustrating.

3. Another point, I'm not sure if it's been agreed that BFE be made public. Or is this tourney for only what one presently knows?

123savethewhales · « **Reply #8 on:** October 16, 2009, 08:33:20 PM »

Since normal damage is useless. It will be a war between who can stack the most flamethrowers and win by scores. That and there's always wheels which I think must be mounted to motors for you to drive (so in theory you can die from immobilization). Piston propulsion would probably be better.

I think "You can only mount parts directly to the chassis at the bot lab" is a good start.

Madiaba · « **Reply #9 on:** October 16, 2009, 08:36:17 PM »

BFE is crazy, as CB noted. If it is allowed, I think it should be for 'Show' bots, not for 'Tourney' bots.

123savethewhales · « **Reply #10 on:** October 16, 2009, 08:47:53 PM »

Yeah you are right, BFE is probably a lot worst (I don't know how to BFE, or what to use to open a bot file for that matter). I was just talking about the kind of things you can do with AAM.

Edit: Lol never mind the only problem was that my notepad was saving files on ANSI instead of Unicode, which mess up the bot file.

somestrangeguy · « **Reply #11 on:** October 17, 2009, 05:24:09 AM »

I was actually having this kind of idea myself, I just never got around to post it, since I have been playing Fallout3 nonstop.

What I would have set as the rules:

Stock HW

You can BFE a max of 2 Motors or Extenders outside the chassis, not weapons.

You can stack a max of 2 of anything inside each other, example 2 HPZs in one place.
Batteries are exeption, you can stack 3 of them inside eachother or 2 batts and CB.

This tournament would be in Comat Arena with no hazards on.

I can AI (veeeerrrry poorly, aka, mostlikely just copypaste other bots bindings and call it complete) and I do have ZD Soft recorder.
Also I cant make splashes/backets worth nothing, so I would need someone to do those for me.

JoeBlo · « **Reply #12 on:** October 17, 2009, 05:39:37 AM »

thats a good way of doing it,

opening up more options with BFE but restricting it to a particular amount,

also roboman, (I say this to just about person who starts a tournament for the first time) dont throw a thread together in 5 mins and plan as you go along.

when I write my tournament rules I do it in a word document and spend a bit of time writing it all up and reading over to see if Its all clear and no vague rules or flaws or holes to seriously exploit.

Naryar · « **Reply #13 on:** October 17, 2009, 06:28:04 AM »

No seriously this is going to fail. That just depends of the builder's skill in BFE... either you have a somehow improved bot, either you have a invulnerable 1-hit-kill SHW monster that you do edit to make it appear as a LW...

And even with rules, someone will most likely find a way to tweak them and enter something unbalanced.

You could host a building contest with BFE allowed, however.

Quote from: Madiaba;73305

Venko, etc... use English much better than you do.

Hmm...Not sure about this...

somestrangeguy · « **Reply #14 on:** October 17, 2009, 06:42:49 AM »

Quote from: Naryar;73358

No seriously this is going to fail. That just depends of the builder's skill in BFE... either you have a somehow improved bot, either you have a invulnerable 1-hit-kill SHW monster that you do edit to make it appear as a LW...

And even with rules, someone will most likely find a way to tweak them and enter something unbalanced.

You could host a building contest with BFE allowed, however.

Hmm...Not sure about this...

Well, if I ever do make this tournament I will completly dismantle each and every bot so I will be able to see its weight and if he tried to stack 10HPZs in one place or not.

Oh and an additional detail to the attaching outside of the chassis: Max additional distance of 1. so if your bots front center is on 0.5, 0, you can make it 1.5, 0. I would check this by adding a small component to the corners of the bot and adding 1 to their coordinates.

JoeBlo · « **Reply #15 on:** October 17, 2009, 06:54:59 AM »

just use the bot exporter program and that will give you a list of every component used so you could see whats in it without dismantling

Madiaba · « **Reply #16 on:** October 17, 2009, 07:23:08 AM »

BFE is worse than cheat parts. It eliminates 'Bot building' skills from the equation. It becomes bot file coding skills. And there are many ways to cheat without being caught.

I just can't see good happenning by going here, except to open up a way of by-passing 'skills' for 'inside knowledge', and no way to discern between the two.

It's like undetectable drugs in the Olympics...

123savethewhales · « **Reply #17 on:** October 17, 2009, 03:01:50 PM »

Yeah I was messing around with it yesterday after I got my notepad to save properly. Needless to say it is pretty rigged.

Exporter does help, but you really can't catch everything. Unless you go and read through every bot file yourself to catch those hidden stuff.

It's pretty much, components anywhere, everywhere, connected to anything (or nothing), be any type, super small chassis, indestructible armor/weapon (everything would have 100 dp in this environment).

The point is, if you allow anymore stacking than you can do in the bot lab, it will go out of control. And my guess is even in a "bfe not allow" tournament there are nothing preventing people to using alternative methods to stack their batteries/etc as long they don't get cought. A BFE allow tournament is just going to push cheating to the next level, and it will more or less be a test of how much the game/physics engine itself can handle.

somestrangeguy · « **Reply #18 on:** October 17, 2009, 03:49:40 PM »

Yeah, it would be a just-for-fun-because-I-could type of tournament. But I dont really see it getting off the ground with even 8 entrants beacue of how much people hate BFE, but the rules dont disallow normal stock bots. So it would be humiliating to the BFE users if a normally built bot won the tournament, right?

And additional rules I tought up when I was thinking more about the possibilities of BFE:

You cant add more than 2 components to the same attachemnt points, meaning you can attach 2 wheels on 1 motor or 2 ironspikes on a baseplate anchor and alike.

You cant attach things to connection points you couldnt attach to in Bot Lab.

roboman2444 · « **Reply #19 on:** October 17, 2009, 04:31:49 PM »

that would work...
bascially i am thinking of its a extreme overlapping, tini chassis, and other stuff. basically if every component didnt have a colission mesh and could be put outside the chassis like a smartzone.