gametechmods
Site Information => Site News and Feedback => Topic started by: 09090901 on June 13, 2018, 06:17:51 PM
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Hey gamers
We're considering unbanning lra2 from the forums. We've let him back into the GTM discord, and his behavior has improved compared to how he has been in the past. He has also been relatively fine in other communities.
Vote on whether you think we should welcome him back the the forums. The decision at the end of the day comes down to the admins, but I would like to see where people stand in the matter.
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where do i vote
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i vote yes
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Unban w/ a lengthy probation period IMO.
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Unban w/ a lengthy probation period IMO.
What he said.
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where do i vote
So apparently polls are broken in this section. So just post your thoughts on this matter.
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I mean like a week ago he was picking fights on facebook with people the same way he always has. He is who he is. If ya want him around, your choice, but I don't think you gain much.
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I don't think he's changed a whole lot either, honestly. Also the "perma" part of that permaban sure was worth the effort, huh? :really_makes_you_think:
I doubt anyone wants him back other than for the meme of it, and really you aren't gonna be gaining anything substantial either other than more moderating work to do when he inevitably throws some sh**fits. But whatever, you do you.
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I doubt anyone wants him back other than for the meme of it
oof.
I vote yes for ava. Albeit, I was blind to why he was banned in the first place.
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Honestly? No.
He had his chance. Multiple chances. Permaban should mean exactly that, and if the Discord has become such an intergral part of GTM then he should probably be lucky to be allowed back on that.
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he's not as bad as lra... oh. Well. I guess if everything you said is true, let him on.
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When I logged onto my account. The poll disappeared. So I'm a just say yes here. Now
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Sorry but no. Sure Avalanche has turned over a new leaf and may appear to be less of an asshole than he was last year. But with the amount of chances that we have given him throughout his time on Gametechmods, could be us being a little too forgiving for his past actions. Did this site ever try to get "Noodle" or "That Robot is a spy!" unbanned?. It's his own fault he got banned from this site and being perm-banned should be the final word on this. He could of avoid this if he just took the six month ban like a mature person, instead of making all those sock puppet accounts that led to his perm-ban.
So even if you were to unban him, let's just say he'll be on his last leg.
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Excuse the essay-like response but I just wanted to air my thoughts.
On one hand:
- Avalanche caused a lot of issues whilst here that annoyed other users (not saying some of the other users were innocent either).
- People from outside GTM are aware of who Avalanche is (he's made quite the name for himself) and associate GTM with him thus may be less inclined to join GTM.
On the other hand:
- On the Discord, he has improved dramatically in attitude.
- Seems to want to try and make things better.
I have my doubts but I'm happy with the fresh page Ava has taken. At the moment I don't think "Oh god, Ava is online. :dead:" but think "Oh cool, Ava is online: we can talk more about robot building/IRL/random crap." I an inching towards giving Ava one last chance...in which case...
Unban w/ a lengthy probation period IMO.
What he said.
This is probably the best step if he is allowed back. I will just say that it should be kept a close eye on him but let the past be the past. If he comes back, fresh start for him, fresh start for all of us that will associate with him: don't just bring up old stuff to start s***.
Overall, what the hell: I say let's give him one last shot!
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no.
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I don't know who avalanche is but I would say yes because this place needs more active members
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I mean like a week ago he was picking fights on facebook with people the same way he always has. He is who he is. If ya want him around, your choice, but I don't think you gain much.
I'm gonna expand on this. Nah. IIRC this wasn't even his first "permanent" ban.
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I don't know who avalanche is but I would say yes because this place needs more active members
It's best you don't know who he is/what he did. It's why they need a while post about it. It's not a matter of members it's a matter of will he make this community look bad in front of other people
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yes but mandatory good boy chart for him
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Avalanche? Yes, His Behaviour Had Improved in Discord so he should return.
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Lesson learned, guys.
Be as much as of an obnoxious, confrontational asshole as you want. They’ll literally just forget about it and let you back in a few months after kicking you out for good.
It’s a great system.
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Lesson learned, guys.
Be as much as of an obnoxious, confrontational asshole as you want. They’ll literally just forget about it and let you back in a few months after kicking you out for good.
It’s a great system.
I mean, I can understand this viewpoint completely...it does seem counter-intuitive but I guess I'm just being optimistic about the situation. Thinking about it more, I feel that while he could come back, we should keep on Discord for the time being just to see how it goes. If he carries on the way he is then I'd have no objection to him coming back. I'd just be worried about the after-effects.
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Lesson learned, guys.
Be as much as of an obnoxious, confrontational asshole as you want. They’ll literally just forget about it and let you back in a few months after kicking you out for good.
It’s a great system.
youre totally right considering it has already happened several years ago already. avalanche was already a multiaccount from lra2 after he got banned
see also: hurricaneandrew
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Lesson learned, guys.
Be as much as of an obnoxious, confrontational asshole as you want. They’ll literally just forget about it and let you back in a few months after kicking you out for good.
It’s a great system.
This. I mean, why even have permabans if you're gonna allow a user back in after 6 months to a year? Besides, Avalanche is through. The fact he had another chance after LRA2 and STILL blew it is what leads me to say that he should not come back. Full stop.
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Each side has valid points to support their reasoning, in allowing Avalanche to return we face the action of undermining a permanent ban, this looks pretty bad on the forums half, not only this but could potentially reduce the chance of newer members joining GTM, knowing Avalanche is on the forum, given his previous actions taken within the other Robotic Combat communities.
But, given his recent change, I best believe that he's willing to, and has, shown a positive change in attitude despite having some users poke at him on our discord. Because of this, he is currently part of the discord, as a trial run to best put it. I'm looking to see long term, give 3/4 months or something around that, positive actions and contributions to the community before possible allowing in the slightest for him to get back onto the discord. Another point is that from what I remember with a discussion with Geese is that the system was always meant to have some sort of appeal process, but I could be wrong.
I'm open to him returning but, like Badger said, if it does come to a point of him returning to the forums, we'll be keeping heavy tabs over him.
(This is pretty much an expanded version of TheOrcCorp's comment).
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#freeAvalanche
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The permaban was, quite frankly, undermined by people allowing him into tournaments.
(Not an attack on you btw Ava)
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The permaban was, quite frankly, undermined by people allowing him into tournaments.
(Not an attack on you btw Ava)
What do you mean by this? Anyone should be allowed to enter a tournament.
I honestly liked ava's flaming. But even if you dont he still seems very good at the game.
#freeavalance
I believe he has been banned for too long.
He should of been unbanned 2 months ago, but y'all decided yall was gonna give him a perma ban.
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:really_makes_you_think:
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#freeavalance
I too would like to free avalance
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I'm putting myself in the no camp here. No point in having permanent bans if we don't enforce them.
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I say let's give him one last shot!
I wonder how many last chances he's been given. The phrase probably means nothing to him anymore.
I mean like a week ago he was picking fights on facebook with people the same way he always has. He is who he is. If ya want him around, your choice, but I don't think you gain much.
This is the perfect argument as to why he shouldn't come back, I couldn't agree with it more. He's not gonna change, he is who he is. Everyone that thinks he's improved clearly can't see someone faking their attitude/behaviour. What he says feels so unnatural. For example (from the ARC Dicksword):
(https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/310871389903257600/445207913175449610/e32b15255961186ee5ed1307fa8811f3.png)
Avalanche's aggressive white knight response is not something a normal person would say, nor is it something Avalanche would typically say. He's just trying too hard to look like he's changed and I'm surprised he hasn't annoyed more people with this forced behaviour. Inb4 that was 4 months ago, 'cos that's a great argument.
Not to mention the 'perma' bit of his ban(s). Permas should just be called indefibans.
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why are we debating this exactly? he got permabanned. he is banned permanently. shouldn't have banned him permanently in the first place if it's not permanent.
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why are we debating this exactly? he got permabanned. he is banned permanently. shouldn't have banned him permanently in the first place if it's not permanent.
because le funni meme user xd
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I say let's give him one last shot!
I wonder how many last chances he's been given. The phrase probably means nothing to him anymore.
I mean like a week ago he was picking fights on facebook with people the same way he always has. He is who he is. If ya want him around, your choice, but I don't think you gain much.
This is the perfect argument as to why he shouldn't come back, I couldn't agree with it more. He's not gonna change, he is who he is. Everyone that thinks he's improved clearly can't see someone faking their attitude/behaviour. What he says feels so unnatural. For example (from the ARC Dicksword):
(https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/310871389903257600/445207913175449610/e32b15255961186ee5ed1307fa8811f3.png)
Avalanche's aggressive white knight response is not something a normal person would say, nor is it something Avalanche would typically say. He's just trying too hard to look like he's changed and I'm surprised he hasn't annoyed more people with this forced behaviour. Inb4 that was 4 months ago, 'cos that's a great argument.
Not to mention the 'perma' bit of his ban(s). Permas should just be called indefibans.
Thanks for some backup.
New guys: give him a chance!
Old guys: he's had 10 years of chances!
And I don't even come here ever besides to talk about battlebots but like still. Thanks but no thanks. The rest of us are excellent at not getting permabanned in the first place. It's like getting back with your ex for a third time because it'll be somehow different this time.
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I was not there when LRA2 was slapped with the banhand, but from what I've seen, he's a p. cool guy. I vote yes, but an eye on him.
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I was not there when LRA2 was slapped with the banhand
Behold the problem with this thread.
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Avalanche's aggressive white knight response is not something a normal person would say, nor is it something Avalanche would typically say. He's just trying too hard to look like he's changed and I'm surprised he hasn't annoyed more people with this forced behaviour. Inb4 that was 4 months ago, 'cos that's a great argument.
Not to mention the 'perma' bit of his ban(s). Permas should just be called indefibans.
Aggressive White Knight would be a little to much. Rather I would say he's more of a behaviour enforcer taking the job too seriously. When some user who has no online social skills to interact with the website and acts in a way that's unacceptable, instead of him trying to calmly explain about what the user is doing wrong, he instead starts an unnecessary flame war over the smallest of all problems like a person not even getting a joke or users telling someone to correct their username. As under his current user name, he had all this time to improve this aggressive behaviour in having respect of minor faults in user's online behaviour patterns and keeping most complaints to himself unless necessary, but instead he kept on going and got himself muted and temporary banned throughout his time, making me believe that he was unbanned, that this old behaviour might be picked up again once he gets back on the forum, despite saying that he has turned over a new leaf. So my vote still stands on no.
Forgot to add. Sure, on some occasions that despite being a massive jerkass of a person who points out the minor of all problems of a user within a flamewar, he does have a point. But as I did say, he should of try and hold his aggressive personality behind his ego and instead try to explain the problem in an non-aggressive manner, so the problem could of solved without having to start a flame war in the first place.
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Yes I'm still relatively new to GTM compared to a lot of you but I have been here for about a year and a half now (I think anyway, maybe less) and I have seen firsthand what Avalanche is capable of as I've been the target of him a few times myself. He does seem different and yes, it could very possibly be all an act. Thing is, it wasn't said at first when this return was happening...which Hoppin cleared up in his comment. This return isn't happening yet, they're going to give him a few months on Discord to see how he acts. If this is all an act like some of you believe, then he won't be able to keep it up forever: he's proven that before. If he stays good, he might end up here....THEN if he acts up, he's gone again. I've given my points for both sides of the argument (not just a simple hur durr, let's give him another chance guys!) and while I believe he could/should have a final chance, I am concerned regarding how he acts upon a possible return and considering how divided people are over this: I'd be worried about the consequences for us as a community if he did return as I get the feeling some members would just leave and I don't want that.
Maybe he shouldn't come back? I don't know anymore.
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Me and Avalance started on GTM around the same time. He was Oct 2009 and I was Dec 2009. As far as I can remember, we were both pretty tragic. Both of us were about 9 years old at the time so you can imagine why. 8-9 years later, we're both 17.
People can change and I think Avalanche will. I'd give it a while longer, though.
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Age has nothing to do with it. As Somebody said, Ava only caused a fuss on FB a week ago, although I'm just taking his word on that. The way you put it makes it seem like change is an inevitability as he gets older but it actually comes from meaningful reflection and being honest with yourself and others, which Ava clearly hasn't done, opting for the 'forced smile' approach, instead.
while I believe he could/should have a final chance
I don't know how else to impress on you (and other newboys) that he has had loads of 'final' chances. Not just in this community, either. I don't think there's a single robot combat community out there that he hasn't been banned from at least once, dare I say twice.
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why are we debating this exactly? he got permabanned. he is banned permanently. shouldn't have banned him permanently in the first place if it's not permanent.
exactly, he didn't warrant permanent ban in the first place imo
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i'll just say that i think it's pretty cute that certain users think lra2 should still be banned when staff has had talks on banning these (((certain))) users for the same things lra2 does
but ill leave that there gamers :dance:
also on how people feel about him coming back undermining staff authority - wouldn't allowing him back on discord also undermine staff authority, if not more than him being allowed to enter into a tournament :really_makes_you_think: and frankly, he acts a lot better than a lot of users do on there (although that might just be because he knows he's on thin ice but i digress)
also if i do recall, matt never outright said lra2 was "permabanned" iirc in the old discord he said he was banned indefinitely, so this autism over what permabanned means can stop
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Woke idea: dont unban Avalanche, but unban Life Robot Arena 2.
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also if i do recall, matt never outright said lra2 was "permabanned" iirc in the old discord he said he was banned indefinitely, so this autism over what permabanned means can stop
Just saying
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Woke idea: dont unban Avalanche, but unban Life Robot Arena 2.
How can one man be so right in so many ways on a single issue
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also if i do recall, matt never outright said lra2 was "permabanned" iirc in the old discord he said he was banned indefinitely, so this autism over what permabanned means can stop
Just saying
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also this is the second time he was permabanned (lra2 account was as well) so he's like ∞ x ∞ now in case just ∞ wasn't enough
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Age has nothing to do with it.
I disagree entirely. People mature with age. Some take longer than others, mind you.
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Woke idea: dont unban Avalanche, but unban Life Robot Arena 2.
How can one man be so right in so many ways on a single issue
I know!
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I'm not going to take sides as I haven't had a problem with him yet I have still heard the many chances he has had. The only supporting evidence to say he shouldn't be back seems to be that he is being nice on discord which is really not enough. I dont really care what happens with him all know is that my opinion and other more younger members should leave it too the big boys to deal with this.
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Another way to look at it.
Has Avalanche been missed on these forums? I’m gonna guess no.
Would his return add anything of use to these forums? Also gonna go out on a limb and say no.
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Another way to look at it.
Has Avalanche been missed on these forums? I’m gonna guess no.
Would his return add anything of use to these forums? Also gonna go out on a limb and say no.
i have missed him dearly in his absence
also lra2 was unironically one of the most active users on the site before he got baned, take that as you will.
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Another way to look at it.
Has Avalanche been missed on these forums? I’m gonna guess no.
Would his return add anything of use to these forums? Also gonna go out on a limb and say no.
Activity on the forums dropped sharply shortly after he was banned, if that means anything. I personally think GTM cant survive without a little bit of drama.
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avalanche is the only thing keeping gtm alive #freealavanch
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GTM is not GTM without Avalanche/LRA2. It just isn’t.
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GTM is not GTM without Avalanche/LRA2. It just isn’t.
I swear you weren't around when he was here
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GTM is not GTM without Avalanche/LRA2. It just isn’t.
I swear you weren't around when he was here
I was when he caused the Banter Wars topic to be temporarily locked.
Also when he went all out ballistic (nearly all the time) on the old GTM discord.
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Age has nothing to do with it.
I disagree entirely. People mature with age. Some take longer than others, mind you.
I agree that people mature with age but Avalanche should have already reached the point in which his age catches up with his behaviour. That's what I meant by age having nothing to do with it, at this point.
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Maybe change the term 'permaban' to 'indefinite ban'?
I know this isn't massively helpful on the topic but I wasn't around when Avalanche and have had no contact with the guy sp I'm not gunna comment on whether or not he should return.
Just a bit of food for thought
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also if i do recall, matt never outright said lra2 was "permabanned" iirc in the old discord he said he was banned indefinitely, so this autism over what permabanned means can stop
Just saying
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Hi, my name is Matt and my username is not 090901.
I appreciate all the thoughtful (and not so thoughtful) input on the matter. This is something I plan on mulling over long term. In the meantime, let me make something perfectly clear.
The community, somewhere along the lines, coined the phrase permaban. Not me. And yes, LRA2 was "Permanently banned" years before I was an admin. The decision to unban him and let him rejoin as Avalanche a while after was not made by me, and if you will recall through some fairly recent posts I've made, I let it be known that allowing previously banned, stigmatized users to rejoin under a new username was not something I would be tolerating going forward, because it's a shady practice and I have no interest in hiding our intentions from you guys. I have no intention of calling anything I do here permanent, long term bans included.
We allowed him back into our discord under supervision, as we saw him mingling well with others elsewhere recently. It's not totally out of the question that he's done a little growing up. Maybe. We don't know for sure. I know some of you lot have tried to antagonize the sh** out of him, and for the most part it hasn't worked. Shame on you for testing him. That's our job, not yours.
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Now that the dust has settled, we can safely say that LRA2 is 100% confirmed unbanned soon.
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Whick one of you ****os said no? Ill send asbestosstar attack on yall
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Well, if we're letting people back from long-standing bans providing they've reformed, I'll straight up admit I'm TRiaS.
Not even joking.
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Well, if we're letting people back from long-standing bans providing they've reformed, I'll straight up admit I'm TRiaS.
Not even joking.
Now that is a banger meme
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Well, if we're letting people back from long-standing bans providing they've reformed, I'll straight up admit I'm TRiaS.
Not even joking.
Now that is a banger meme
Not even memeing, I am TRiaS.
Honestly, my reputation was/is strongly deserved. I was dealing with depression back when I started trying to troll the forum, and deliberately behaving like a retard was a form of entertainment for me, mainly because I was done with Robot Arena at the time. Looking back, it's cringe-worthy how much of a tryhard I was. I'm still far from being anything special at bot building (I still don't play all that much, but I got back into the game recently), but I have zero intentions of trying to cause trouble as I once did, and I genuinely do appreciate this community (deep down, I probably did back then too.)
I guess, like Mouldy, I grew up. I'm 21 now, and I'm going to study Psychology in University come September.
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NOOOO avalanche lost the vote
Does this mean I can have his spot in tournaments?
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NOOOO avalanche lost the vote
Does this mean I can have his spot in tournaments?
nah mate ava's most likely returning. and even then he isn't going anywhere
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NOOOO avalanche lost the vote
Does this mean I can have his spot in tournaments?
nah mate ava's most likely returning. and even then he isn't going anywhere
Then what was the point of the vote.
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NOOOO avalanche lost the vote
Does this mean I can have his spot in tournaments?
nah mate ava's most likely returning. and even then he isn't going anywhere
Then what was the point of the vote.
To give us peons the false illusion that we have power here.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RHIdSxs5_eQ
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GTM is bunch of Communists
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Well, if we're letting people back from long-standing bans providing they've reformed, I'll straight up admit I'm TRiaS.
Not even joking.
Now that is a banger meme
Not even memeing, I am TRiaS.
Honestly, my reputation was/is strongly deserved. I was dealing with depression back when I started trying to troll the forum, and deliberately behaving like a retard was a form of entertainment for me, mainly because I was done with Robot Arena at the time. Looking back, it's cringe-worthy how much of a tryhard I was. I'm still far from being anything special at bot building (I still don't play all that much, but I got back into the game recently), but I have zero intentions of trying to cause trouble as I once did, and I genuinely do appreciate this community (deep down, I probably did back then too.)
I guess, like Mouldy, I grew up. I'm 21 now, and I'm going to study Psychology in University come September.
welcome back smelly boi
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Then what was the point of the vote.
get a feel for community opinions
and lets make one more thing clear, nobody has said anything about a timeline involving this.
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NOOOO avalanche lost the vote
Does this mean I can have his spot in tournaments?
nah mate ava's most likely returning. and even then he isn't going anywhere
Then what was the point of the vote.
Both this vote and the vote on the like feature are redundant. What's the point in getting the feel for community opinions when you don't make decisions based on them? It feels like this 'generation' of moderators make changes because they can and Trov didn't. I admit I can't really say much when I attempted to change some tournament rules/organisation when I was a mod and I'm not even an active member of the community. Nevertheless, I still like to state my opinion.
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Because it's nice to know that it isn't actually a resounding yes or a resounding no? The vote is close. That alone says something.
I really don't appreciate the attitudes in this thread acting like he's already here pissing in your frosted flakes. I've stated multiple times that I'm taking several things into consideration here, and I don't deserve to be treated like a piece of sh**.
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i think this thread has done a good job of showing who's opinions should be considered and who's shouldnt in decisions for gtm's future
also to tom's comment "this generation of moderators", you do realize matt has been moderating this site for 10 years right?
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Well, if we're letting people back from long-standing bans providing they've reformed
Pretty much has always been the case on GTM history, however I don't see it happening with Avalanche/LRA2 anytime soon based on how his personality/attitude maturity level/whatever hasn't changed at all in the last 10 years lol, dude has had enough "last chances" in his life.
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Well, if we're letting people back from long-standing bans providing they've reformed
Pretty much has always been the case on GTM history, however I don't see it happening with Avalanche/LRA2 anytime soon based on how his personality/attitude maturity level/whatever hasn't changed at all in the last 10 years lol, dude has had enough "last chances" in his life.
I'm out of the loop, but I think it's fair to put the LRA2 days behind him, he was like 9 years old or something, and we all act like retards online at that age.
I don't know enough about Avalanche's current behaviour so I don't have any opinion on the Avalanche situation, but I think yearly sitout periods for the worst people, especially if they're young, is a good metric to determine whether someone has matured enough. Seeing as he was permabanned back in October, I'd say wait until then before determining whether he's mature enough to be let back into the community. I think that's a fair compromise for those who want him to actually be punished, and those who eventually want him back in the community.
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Thought: His original ban was for a year. By multiaccounting he got permabanned, which has lead to the conversation in this thread and the result of him being unbanned at some point in the future, possibly before that year ban would've expired.
tl;dr: lra2 multiaccounting to avoid his year ban could result in him getting unbanned earlier than if he hadn't multiaccounted.
edit: His original ban was for 6months, nvm
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His original ban was for six months, not a year
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I really don't appreciate the attitudes in this thread acting like he's already here pissing in your frosted flakes.
He was banned to stop pissing in our frosted flakes. The argument that one shouldn't not want him back because he hasn't done anything sh** on the forum yet makes no sense because he's banned.
I don't deserve to be treated like a piece of sh**.
No-one is treating you that way. Where did this even come from?
i think this thread has done a good job of showing who's opinions should be considered and who's shouldnt in decisions for gtm's future
wut
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The fact that the mere mention of letting him back has generated this much forum activity is reason enough to do so imo.
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TBH who needs lra2 when you got supahotslayar13
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We've given it some more thought, and
(http://memecrunch.com/meme/B0ITM/yeah-that-s-gonna-be-a-no-for-me-dog/image.jpg)