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Messages - TDS
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141
« on: October 20, 2015, 07:19:36 PM »
142
« on: October 19, 2015, 08:19:22 AM »
It lives I'm actually a lot farther than this I just forgot to update the thread 
143
« on: October 11, 2015, 07:40:59 PM »
144
« on: October 10, 2015, 03:13:21 PM »
Today is :make sure I'm not overweight day 
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« on: October 09, 2015, 03:21:52 PM »
Make it wider though, and its illegal
Yes.
so again, the original point, wedge defenses are largely illegal, and have little if anything to do with your offensive "wedgeocity" the rules apparent design to keep matches from being boring shoving matches or everything being vaporized by spinners is not effective at preventing wedges (or other bots that focus on removing wheels from pavement) from dominating the class. virtually every sportsman event in a very long time has been won by a bot whose main design point was to remove wheels from floor despite removing wheels from floor being something the class is supposed to be built to prevent every match devolving into.
146
« on: October 09, 2015, 02:59:00 PM »
Make it wider though, and its illegal
147
« on: October 09, 2015, 02:51:44 PM »
pretty much, but I dont have side scoops, those were just uncut armored plates since I hadnt decided yet if I wanted to be ambitious and do compound angles on the front end (I didnt, I suck at cutting with a jigsaw) so tell me, if you had to pick a bot that looked like a wedge, would it be that, or this?  To be clear, I'm fine with "neither is a wedge" but that a ledge to keep those outrageously long forks that are obviously designed to lift the other similiar forkbots up before their forks contact, is more of a wedge than the forks, even when going way out of the way to adhere to the rules verbatim, is ridiculous to me. I'm fine with it, I'll just run full pressure in those matches and Hopefully it dies before my frame collapses or I get pinned in a corner.
148
« on: October 09, 2015, 02:39:49 PM »
You essentially asked if this with a hammer on top would be Sportsman legal:
Yes, if the angle was much shorter (it was only about an inch or so long) exactly. I dont know what the scale to that is but the "outcropping" to vertical space is about reversed, the front of my machine was originally ~3" tall and the "wedge" was around an inch long, what you have pictured looks to be about 2:1 (3" tall and 6" wedge or whatever) The "oh no injustice" comes in from bots like yours (1) ~6" long X 1/2" tall angled forks attached to a weapon that almost never connects? well its required to make the crusher work and the forks are totally not a wedge at all. (2) 1-1.5" long 1/8" tall angle iron required to deliver more hammer power with complexity added so that it literally /cannot/ wedge: holy **** its a wedge, get it the hell out of here. I even suggested putting the same exact type forks as on your crusher on my hammer, NOPE. It doesn't make sense, and the fact that you're the only troll about it and unwilling to help /and/ are probably one of the biggest "offenders" draws my original old boys club conclusion. The reason that anyone elses apparent solutions don't work for my machine, is because you didnt build it, thats the only logical conclusion I can come to. I have asked for alternatives, I just haven't done so with you, because you're not useful as you've shown in this thread.
149
« on: October 09, 2015, 02:08:36 PM »
At resting position the spike is nowhere near ground level and is primarily decorative. The front pieces are functionally incapable of wedging and serve only to keep the flails from impacting the floor. You asked to put what is effectively a wedge on a Sportsman bot and threw a fit when you got told no. You're more than welcome to add your anti-wedge skirt and fight it in the regular 30lb class.
So again, that you keep falling back on that makes me believe that you weren't part of the conversation and have no idea what the plan actually was. The original idea was to use support arms similar to uberclocker as those were apparently legal, this was shot down because uberclockers cage lifter makes them legal, not because they are legal on their own: Clockers anti tippy arms sit behind the jaw, so they do not act as a wedge
Now in your case, they would go under the other bot and potentially be wedgey
Me:
the jaw is kind of hilariously long though, its just hard to design around these things, like the angle iron idea was "hey this obviously can't be used as a wedge" but still got shot down
so its still wedgey even if it isn't angled and can't remove the other bots wheels off the floor? I've seen some nerc forum conversations around grue and such that seem that is the criteria
if its shape can lift the other bots wheels off the floor its illegal, if not good to go
which is why I thought the angle iron was fine, its either 90 degrees or 0 degrees there's no incline unless the other bot somehow hops a few inches int he airThe wedge rule /appeared to be/ intent based, the conversation on the nerc forums that I found concerned grue, who had an angled face on its gripper (for strength) this was too tall for it to not count as a wedge, if the other bot had less than 1/4" or whatever or ground clearance /you did not care/ but a bunch more than that and it will act as a wedge. I cannot find the post but it was literally said by I think AL or Ed something to that effect, as long as it isn't too tall (to provide wedge action) or too long (to be a dustpan) its fine This raised the concern that its an inactive weapon, though the body of the machine and hammer action will turn it into an active weapon, The hinge was added to qualify for the "always perpendicular no matter orientation" criteria, and also to fold back out of the way to not act as a wedge when the hammer wasn't bracing the bottom of the other robot against it, and also satisfies the "static plate" portion of the rules Your "herp derp derp skirts lol" response you always pull out is not accurate, yes, it is/was an idea for wedge defense (as wedges are as I stated largely allowed as long as they also lift, its wedge /defenses/ that are illegal, but it does technically qualify to the rules. While a large plate extending from the bot that is flat or nearly flat to the floor such as in the bots Alf or Zok may satisfy the rule as described above, it will also not be allowed. This or any other static device which has the purpose of removing the opponent's wheels from the arena floor is not allowed. unless your wheels are sub 1" diameter AND placed directly on the front of your bot, AND you are two wheel drive, AND you have virtually no rear ground clearance it is geometrically impossible for the angle "skirt" to remove your bots wheels from the ground. The best answer you can give me is "well you said it was a skirt even though it technically isn't" and "because I said so" Those aren't rules. It was an idea to give me a vertical brace for my hammer (EXACTLY like YOUR OWN CRUSHER on nyx who traps the other bot between a moving part and a hinged fork) and protect the bot from all the lifting forks.
150
« on: October 09, 2015, 01:29:40 PM »
You asked, we gave you an answer, we are sorry that we have not met your expectations.
Next time, don't describe your attachment as an "anti-wedge skirt" with this as the only drawing.
Yes I know, you keep bringing up a basic image I used because the person I was talking to did not understand the basics of the design I was talking about, this was after several iterations and workarounds of virtually exactly what uberclocker has, except to stabilize the hammer instead of forks (though his are apparently allowed because his forks extend farther than the supports) can you explain how this:  who very obviously has surfaces on the front and rear that will not be a 90 degree angle to the floor an inch from the floor when in its normal orientation satisfies the below rule: "Sides of a bot within 1 inch of the floor must be perpendicular to the floor. If your bot can drive in multiple positions (i.e. inverted), your bot must comply in each of these positions. Unusually shaped bots that do not meet the letter of this rule, but that do not contain wedge-like surfaces may be allowed on a case by case basis.
You must also use care when designing your weapon so that the weapon does not violate the no wedge rule. A weapon which requires a small slope below 1 inch or a small plate that is flat to the floor in order to function will be allowed at the discretion of the officials. "It appears that neither end adheres to these rules The front could very easily extend another few fractions of an inch forward within 1" of the floor and not be an angled surface, the small slope is not /required/ as stated. The rear very much appears to sit less than an inch from the floor, has an included surface, and a spike which is not part of an active weapon and is also an inclined surface, both of these could /easily/ comply, and are there for no "not wedging" functional purpose, but chose not to, you dont have to fret over the rules and say "oh jeeze I wish I could angle this surface because it would save me an ounce but I can't" You can just not follow the rules and its fine. That is my annoyance You take the rules verbatim, and apply them to bots who exist or will exist, and they do not adhere to those rules You have you, someone who publicly is a sh**bag about it with your "lololo make it a flat plate on a hinge" (though it keeps getting deleted from the facebook group and I didnt have the foresight to take screenshots) whom also exploits said rules, /and/ has a say in deciding what is legal and what isn't, including technically legal defenses to their own robots. It stinks of old boys club elitist nonsense IMO.
151
« on: October 09, 2015, 12:20:04 PM »
Will it be okay against wedge bots? Does it have enough drive to overcome spinners knocking it away?
its for sportmans class, which has a no wedge rule and only allows spinners up to 400rpm
Yeah I dont really want to hang out in sportsmans for too long TBH, I've found the rules on what is a wedge and what is extremely dependent on who the builder is, not the actual writing of the rules. My original plan to use L bracket or C channel to put about 2X1/8" of plate under the other robot for leverage for the hammer got shot down even though it has absolutely no chance of wedging anything, as did some of the other more basic defenses against the "not really a wedge" bots, coincidentally the ones being dicks about it are the same ones who have said "not really a wedge" bots, like mikencr's chain spinner who has non -90 degree weapon supports and a less than 1" ground clearance rear wedgelike angled surface, but is cool apparently, the same exact supports bolted to my wheelguards to support the hammer swings, not cool. "dont build a dustpan" is apparently okay if the dustpan is a bunch of lifting forks, the 1" clearance rule doesn't count "if you dont decide to use them like that" I dont know man It bugs me on a couple levels, once ruin is rocking and rolling i'll probably armor up and move to big boy pants featherweights and build a crusher or something for sportsmans.
152
« on: October 09, 2015, 11:44:34 AM »
Will it be okay against wedge bots? Does it have enough drive to overcome spinners knocking it away?
In the US there is a sportsman class, where high energy spinners and wedges aren't really allowed, it is supposed to be to vet designs before you throw them into the arena with 6000watt spinners and go home in a trash bin. I should have plenty of budget to reinforce the front I'm not overly concerned with wedges tbh, most aren't designed to deal with hammers of this magnitude, spinners I just need enough armor to stop them, which will be much easier once I put an impeller in the bot. I dont expect many, if any bots to survive multiple hits in the same spot if I manage to pin them to a wall. In other news if someone can find me a 250 psi micro solenoid I'll be very happy
153
« on: October 08, 2015, 09:40:18 PM »
No real progress, working late last few days
front armor mountings together, plate chamfered and ready to be drilled. Lid next then the armor is all set and just need to finish weapon return
Drive belts are in finally too
154
« on: October 07, 2015, 06:39:21 PM »
Todays progress Armor mounting:  Welded and partially ground/sharpened primary weapon, picture does not do justice to its beefyness   Oh yeah and minor testing shows It pentrates through 1/16" steel at 20% power
155
« on: October 07, 2015, 10:29:32 AM »
30lb bot. In UK terms, a featherweight.
A brutal featherweight. I cannot wait to see that thing in action.
Jesus, mary and joseph on a pogo stick this thing is going to utterly obliterate all bots in its weight class.
I really want this in RWRA2 Mod!
Lets not get ahead of ourselves, it has more power available to it than I will be able to deliver right now, my original plan to have front stabilizer "sort of wedges" to help it not go end over end got shot down by the sportsmans guys, probably because they dont know what I'm trying to deal with, so until I get downforce figured out it can't be "too" crazy. The first few outings will determine where I go with the design, once I get it dialed in it should be enough to do some stuff, my main area of concern is the weapon mountings and if the hammer itself is strong enough. (1/4" AR500 steel, 1/2" steel head, a lot of facing rod)
156
« on: October 06, 2015, 07:37:51 AM »
Thanks guys, I dropped off the axes and buffer chamber at welders yesterday when I think are the last parts besides frame reinforcements and such. I changed the rank and pinion to a round shaft based one so I need to figure out the front clevis for the hammer return and how to attach the return spring (which is all a pain in the ass because the piston is off center.
so stuff like that, after nerc I can focus on machining new valves out of aluminum and use the (massive) weight savings to add a second solenoid to power the return stroke
157
« on: October 05, 2015, 11:06:39 AM »
its virtually the same piston that was in terrorhurtz, in a 30 :P
I dont know what a 30 is, but i fear for my life.
It has way more than enough power to punch through the lid, baseplate, and floor, in an ideal world the hammertip will clock in at 320+mph (514.99kph), which puts it above most spinners energy, the piston will put out 1700+lb (771kg) of force. Realistically though I have too many turns in my gas system, fittings are a little undersized, and I wont run at max pressure, and its very difficult to deliver all that energy when you are lifting up your own robot, and the frame will have problems taking that stress. The plan is by end of week have it swinging to some effect, start at 100psi and work my way up a little at a time, and take calipers to the frame until it starts to stretch, and that will be my endpoint for the first outing, once bugs are worked out (and hopefully have the weight for an impeller for increased downforce) it'll be dramatically altering the dimensions of the arenas it fights in :)
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« on: October 04, 2015, 10:09:08 PM »
its virtually the same piston that was in terrorhurtz, in a 30 :P
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« on: October 04, 2015, 06:05:01 PM »
progress this weekend -rack for the rack and pinion almost done, just need to shave down some parts to save weight -machined bearing holes, ablative lexan bumpers, baseplate template, started on armor shell -test fit weapon hub   
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« on: September 23, 2015, 09:22:07 PM »
Test fit  
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