Nice work there! Very impressed.
It's cool that you are trying to make it a simulator, rather than just a game.
I see that the wheels are very smooth, how did you achieved that? Did you use one of the standard colliders or something else?
Oooo! Nuts and bolts too!
Nice ampflow model as well.
Loving the details :)
Thanks for the info!
I have tried as well to make a robot combat game, didn't go very far, but I did encounter the problem of the wheels, I used a method where I have the collision model of the wheel not completely fixed to the wheel itself, but I used a configurable joint to make it like a shock absorber radially, so it doesn't jump because of the not completelly smooth collision mesh.
But I'm sure you can find a much better and less messy solution than that!
I love the Idea of using the real controllers!
unity is a good dev environment, i use it, I will check it out,maybe i will use it in a GTM event. Will the rumbles allow more bots that RA2?
EDIT:Looked at it, good start, cant wait to see more,Looks in lots of ways better that RA1 ,RA2 and almost RA3 graphic wise.
Also, nice , that may be the best online fighting game, there are some but none this style, You should also port to tablets, I only know 1 other bot fighting game that is inactive, I would love to see that on tablets.
Also, You can Make AI to make the other bots move with these simple lines of code if you want to try.
Sweet! Thanks for the AI script! I have been wondering how to handle identifying a particular game component. I suppose player1 and player2 would have their own tags?I think you would tag the everybody"Player" and only give the script to the AI players. So th'all kill each other. Did you test the lines i sent you?
When you say "more robots", do you mean more robots that are pre-made and ship with the game, or are you referring to a user's ability to create and store more of their own creations?
Someone give this guy a medal.
Just keep plugging away at it my dude, frequent updates are a must to keep projects like this from dyingSomeone give this guy a medal.
Thanks for the vote of confidence, but I don't want to overpromise and underdeliver!
I figure I need to get everything in the "Priority One" list done before October. If that happens, then I should be in good shape to turn out an actual shippable product sometime in the next few years. 2 months to get the basic game working, then 2 years to polish it. :)
Just keep plugging away at it my dude, frequent updates are a must to keep projects like this from dyingSomeone give this guy a medal.
Thanks for the vote of confidence, but I don't want to overpromise and underdeliver!
I figure I need to get everything in the "Priority One" list done before October. If that happens, then I should be in good shape to turn out an actual shippable product sometime in the next few years. 2 months to get the basic game working, then 2 years to polish it. :)
If you ever need development help, many of the people on the forum have lots of knowledge and experience, and I'm sure they'd be happy to help.
You could use the part of my code for facing the player in you game and just have other animation do the walking.
- An intelligent scoring system that attempts to model the (entirely subjective) judging at our actual competitions. This might prove to be the trickiest part, as it is mostly based on how "exciting" a particular competitor is if no one is knocked out. Does anyone have any ideas on how to do this?
*record scratch* say whaatYou could use the part of my code for facing the player in you game and just have other animation do the walking.
For this version of the game, I am looking to control movement through the physics engine, rather than directly via the transform. I think a mobile version might benefit from simplified transform-based movement though -- it is further down on the list, but still definitely an option I would like to explore. I'm pretty sure I could bust out a top-down version of a mobile game relatively quickly once the full PC version is done.
I'm hoping to put out an announcement on the game in the next week or two. Still waiting on a few details... :)
*record scratch* say whaat
do you understand how long i have been begging to see this happen? so many mobile developers out there and nobody has had even the slightest impulse to try a robot combat game for mobile devices! it has the potential to blow the **** up, i'd think! imagine the online multiplayer... /swoon
i think the most intuitive way to allow controls to be handled would be to allow you to kind of 'drag and drop' useable buttons for your robot onto your screen kind of like how one would customize the button placement for a mobile emulator on their screen. but again that would take a certain amount of know-how to do (not trying to imply that you don't have that kind of know-how, but i have no doubt in my mind that creating a game in any respect for a mobile platform is no easy venture)
ha! now that's some way to think about it, you're absolutely right though. especially considering you've only got so much space you can allow yourself for buttons on a mobile screen before you've run out of space to see what the hell you're doing, it does it's own work keeping outlandish and unrealistic design in check.
I've found that everybody has their own preferred control scheme regardless of game. For controlling robots I've toyed with Tank-controls, Single-stick and even car-style (RT drives, LS steers). If it's something you can afford to develop people will likely enjoy having the option.
ha! now that's some way to think about it, you're absolutely right though. especially considering you've only got so much space you can allow yourself for buttons on a mobile screen before you've run out of space to see what the hell you're doing, it does it's own work keeping outlandish and unrealistic design in check.
- An intelligent scoring system that attempts to model the (entirely subjective) judging at our actual competitions. This might prove to be the trickiest part, as it is mostly based on how "exciting" a particular competitor is if no one is knocked out. Does anyone have any ideas on how to do this?
i would imagine a system that would record the speed of both bots upon impact when it's a non-weapon hit and speed/damage upon weapon hit, maybe even including something like a 'sparks' system that would sway judge opinion in favor of those who generate more sparks from their hits, but also to make things fair for flippers and shovers a counter-point system that reverses judges favor through hazard impact and slams (flips, too) as well. sounds complicated but probably possible if fine tuned juuust right
- An intelligent scoring system that attempts to model the (entirely subjective) judging at our actual competitions. This might prove to be the trickiest part, as it is mostly based on how "exciting" a particular competitor is if no one is knocked out. Does anyone have any ideas on how to do this?
i would imagine a system that would record the speed of both bots upon impact when it's a non-weapon hit and speed/damage upon weapon hit, maybe even including something like a 'sparks' system that would sway judge opinion in favor of those who generate more sparks from their hits, but also to make things fair for flippers and shovers a counter-point system that reverses judges favor through hazard impact and slams (flips, too) as well. sounds complicated but probably possible if fine tuned juuust right
I would comment to not forget F= MA. While you can do shortcuts of how much damage a weapon does and assume a lot of things if one bot is much lighter than another and/or if you scale the weapons at all to the scale of the bot size then please don't forget to scale the amount of damage it can do in collisions, ramming and weapon contacts.
Also on your movement, if you do dot products to decide if a bot can move towards a foe or not, you are not taking into account if one or more motive wheels have been removed or damaged. If they planned for redundancy in having more than usually 4 wheels and that using dot product checks and the opponent is at nearly right angles will cause pretty strong errors in the movement.
Finally, the dot product method assumes always the same level which can be an assumption you can take if you plan on always having flat arenas but will be a problem if you later change mind to have ramps, bumps, multi level options.
Sorry if I have missed things in diving in midstream and seeing some possible issues.
Starcore
IMO you should get a working prototype of 2 bots interacting in an arena before even worrying about anything else, like bot building, points systems or damage models. Walk before you run, so to speak.
As the online multilayer of RA2 is non existend people had to rely on AI to host tournaments. We never really had a choice to say we prefer AI over PvP as we haven't experienced PvP in a propper way yet
If the focus of the game is multiplayer, it will die off pretty quickly due to a lack of sustainable userbase. While multiplayer functionality would be great, I think the focus should be AI combat. It should also be possible for users to make the AI control their own bots.
If the focus of the game is multiplayer, it will die off pretty quickly due to a lack of sustainable userbase. While multiplayer functionality would be great, I think the focus should be AI combat. It should also be possible for users to make the AI control their own bots.
one is the dreaded RA3. THey both had multiplayer, but they were all full of bugs.
i am voting for multiplayer.
RA3 multiplayer is a bit of a mess. It's buggy, occasionally laggy, and you can only play with people on the same continent as you with no option to change servers. It is still far better than RA2 online via Gameranger though.one is the dreaded RA3. THey both had multiplayer, but they were all full of bugs.
i am voting for multiplayer.
I personally haven't tried RA3 yet. How is the online multiplayer experience?
I'm afraid of underestimating how difficult it is do this well.
I expect that there would be a lot of robot parts that appear to randomly teleport when a packet arrives that is delayed by 300 ms and the robots are forced to shift their positions to the new spot. Even with interpolation, there could be weirdness as robots rotate into position under the control of a linear interpolation function instead of the user's input.
RA3 multiplayer is a bit of a mess. It's buggy, occasionally laggy, and you can only play with people on the same continent as you with no option to change servers.
The only reason why we have so much AI is because online play is horrible.
Not that there's anything wrong with making it easy to AI a robot, or having AI'ing options. The Starcore AI pack robots were (IIRC) designed as sparing partners for multiplayer.
Another option I toyed with back in February was to create a point-and-click control scheme. Robots would fight with AI, but you would tell them where to go and who to attack.thats gonna be hard to do, have you ever tryed to AI in RA2?
This might be the worst of all worlds though: it would lack the immediacy of direct controls, would still suffer from syncing issues as robots automagically lerp() to new positions and rotations, and require someone else to be online to battle.
But there is a multiplayer game worse than RA3 worse than RA2, rumble bots,
You can conceptualise and post cool ideas all day, but if you can't implement those ideas into a game it's all for nothing.
Good news!Nice! I look forward to following the game's development!
We are thrilled to announce that we have put together the core team for "Robot Rumble 2.0". tashic, tomgsx, and I will be working together on the project, and have set a launch date target of mid-2019. Starcore has graciously offered his guidance in the development of AI, and we are hoping to make this a big part of the game at launch.
Thank you for all of your kind words of support, and we hope to make this game something that we can all be proud of and enjoy for years to come.
-The Robot Rumble 2.0 Core Development Team
Thanks for the update, the logo looks good. Glad to hear that you're tackling this in a modular manner
Can you comment on if you're taking moddability into account during development? One of this things that has kept RA2 relevant for so long is how much of the game can be modified without touching the actual source code, or in other words how little of the game is hardcoded.
@tashic is attempting to make a mesh builder that allows you to "cut out parts" on a virtual bandsaw and weld them together to make whatever you want.
The other one looked a million times better, but okay.
New one is just some text on a black background. The other one had some character to it. It actually looked like a logo rather than something kinda generic.The other one looked a million times better, but okay.
I appreciate the honesty! What was it you liked about the first logo that is missing from the new one?
Pretty much this. The other one could be an icon for the game as well as the logo so it's got a better branding rather than just some text that you don't instantly see is textured, rather than just plain grey.New one is just some text on a black background. The other one had some character to it. It actually looked like a logo rather than something kinda generic.The other one looked a million times better, but okay.
I appreciate the honesty! What was it you liked about the first logo that is missing from the new one?
Pretty much this. The other one could be an icon for the game as well as the logo so it's got a better branding rather than just some text that you don't instantly see is textured, rather than just plain grey.New one is just some text on a black background. The other one had some character to it. It actually looked like a logo rather than something kinda generic.The other one looked a million times better, but okay.
I appreciate the honesty! What was it you liked about the first logo that is missing from the new one?
Seems like it'd be a good loading bar as well. Though I think having the laser cut out the name would be cooler, though I understand that's more complicated
oh-- and do keep in mind with your question: this is a community built around a game where the most functional part of it's playability is the customization and building, so that's what your answer is going to be. i'm kind of a unicorn here in this sense because i'm more about competition than idle tinkering, and that not being the strong point of the game this commuinity is built around means that people like me (who do exist and likely don't post here because of the lack of mano y mano combat as a strength of the game) could absolutely be a target market of sorts for your game has it the technical capability to implement a solid online battle system. do keep in mind that you can certainly expand your target market outside of the average ra2 player if you pay enough mind to improve on the things where ra2 was weak, rather than just building a stronger ra2 (which limits your community to those of us who are already here, and god forbid that's all!)
makes sense? :approve:
Hey man, that's an outstanding start you guys have right there. My one gripe is just a visual one, and it's one that it shares with a lot of modern games. The lighting is a bit much. I understand that you want everything to appear real and shiny, but the lighting is almost giving the camera a haziness to it. I'd consider trying a bit less shine.
Downloaded it for myself, the special FX are definitely giving me some input lag + framerate drops. The 3D model work is coming along nicely though.
I've got this if that means anything:Downloaded it for myself, the special FX are definitely giving me some input lag + framerate drops. The 3D model work is coming along nicely though.
Sounds good. What kind of a machine are you running on?
I'm curious to see if there is a big difference between running the game with an integrated GPU vs a dedicated card.
The 3D models are all @tashic's work. He's awesome. :smile:
I've got this if that means anything:Downloaded it for myself, the special FX are definitely giving me some input lag + framerate drops. The 3D model work is coming along nicely though.
Sounds good. What kind of a machine are you running on?
I'm curious to see if there is a big difference between running the game with an integrated GPU vs a dedicated card.
The 3D models are all @tashic's work. He's awesome. :smile:
(https://i.imgur.com/r5PA8rl.png)
It's basically a toaster.
I tried the "2P test" mode which ran far smoother than the other game modes. Maybe you could have that be the low graphics setting and the effects used in the other game modes be the high graphics setting.
also it looks good so far considering it's basically the engine tashic had a few months ago with a couple of additions
what are the controls for the second bot in 2P? both the wsad and arrow keys drive the P1 robot.
Running good on my HD7950 (but then. It is 3gb)
Some feedback.
I would like to agree with kill and say that the post-processing is way too much. The shine and lens effects are really distracting. I image at some point it should be possible for these to be togglable.
What sort of framerates are you expecting? I'm supposedly getting 25fps on my 980ti in 1080p windowed which seems a bit low.
I was puzzled by the low FPS and it turns out that the game isn't putting almost any load on my GPU unless I click out of the game. Then it shoots to over 250fps and 100% GPU load.Some feedback.
I would like to agree with kill and say that the post-processing is way too much. The shine and lens effects are really distracting. I image at some point it should be possible for these to be togglable.
What sort of framerates are you expecting? I'm supposedly getting 25fps on my 980ti in 1080p windowed which seems a bit low.
Good to know. For the next revision I think I will get rid of the "lens dirt" and turn the bloom way down. I'm thinking we can also get rid of the ambient occlusion. It is a nice effect, but I don't think it really adds that much when the scene is so full of hard edges. Motion blur is cool too, but I think we have a better way to do motion blur that doesn't require any post-processing.
If you don't mind my asking, in the "2 Player" mode, are you seeing 60 fps? This scene doesn't have any post-processing at all.
Newest build is pretty good. I noticed that my framerate improved when I was right in the corners, like directly in the spotlights, and worsened in the middle of the arena.
640X480Running good on my HD7950 (but then. It is 3gb)
Thanks for the info! I'm hoping that older dedicated GPU cards will be able to handle the max settings. This will give us more room to play around with particles.
What screen resolution are you running?
I'm gonna download because I want that lava pit.
This already looks better than ra3 guys. Amazing job. Need to test it when I get home
I signed up just to post. I'm pretty excited about the development and time you guys have put into this. I'm a web dev but you guys make me want to learn unity so I can help. Keep up the good work.. seriously so stoked for this.
I will say I think your latest build had some issues. When starting in 1p i couldn't control carbide. Original sin and eruption did their own thing as if it wanted to have a UI but didn't know what to do. the workshop didn't do anything for me either.
I signed up just to post. I'm pretty excited about the development and time you guys have put into this. I'm a web dev but you guys make me want to learn unity so I can help. Keep up the good work.. seriously so stoked for this.
I will say I think your latest build had some issues. When starting in 1p i couldn't control carbide. Original sin and eruption did their own thing as if it wanted to have a UI but didn't know what to do. the workshop didn't do anything for me either.
So, the next things you need to add, ordered from easiest to hardest-
Recognition of OOTA's/Pittings (Will allow for more strategy)
Limited battery life/flipper gas (Eruption can just flip forever right now)
Fix the Warehouse's cameras (I tried a test fight and couldn't see anything)
Smoke/fire effects for damaged components (Good visual indicator, plus adds some flair)
Ability to rip off components (I know it's possible because they fly off when you disable an opponent, but I haven't been able to rip off a single wheel or anything like that)
1 more robot, then support for up to 4 AI's at once (The dream is of course to be able to do massive multi-bot rumbles at some point.)
Softbody physics (yeah this is never happening)
This version is just nice. There is some stuff to do tho.. most of it is already said soo..
If you need arenas i can make some (you will need 3ds max skills tho)
Ive been messing in botlab and made this... (Still wishing for that sketchup mode of building. Maybe add an extenstion to port designs from 3dsmax or sketchup to the game)
[ You are not allowed to view attachments ]
Right now is in very early development so you can expect bugs and issues as a lot of things we are still figuring out.
But good to see we are getting some attention!
Also what about the workshop didn't feel right? Again, still in development and things aren't really explained to the player at the moment.
Welcome to the forum
We are thrilled that you are excited about it! It helps to have people excited about the project when there is so much work left to do.
I think one of the lessons learned on this particular build is to not enable any functions that shouldn’t be tested. At this point the “1 Player” menu option is redundant, and we haven’t bothered to get rid of it, as it doesn’t do anything that the “2 Player” mode does. Likewise for the “2P Test” menu option. We use it to test out new ideas that will eventually be migrated into the game.
The BotLab is partially functional at this point. You can create 3D meshes and assemble the meshes you have created in any size and orientation. It is pretty neat that it works, but it isn’t obvious how it works at this point. Once all of the functionality exists, we will need to do a lot of UI/UX work and testing to make robot building as smooth and intuitive as possible.
We will try to post our development here, but I encourage you to sign up for the mailing list on www.robot-rumble.com to receive news and updates. We will also be using the mailing list to sign people up for beta testing when we are ready for it. It is still pretty early in the development cycle, but I am hoping to be ready for beta in about 12 months.
Right now is in very early development so you can expect bugs and issues as a lot of things we are still figuring out.
But good to see we are getting some attention!
Also what about the workshop didn't feel right? Again, still in development and things aren't really explained to the player at the moment.
Could have just been my system but I was unable to do anything. I understand the development stage, but I felt like I should have been able to at least click and drag to model as it seems others have been able to do?
I like the idea of the pneumatic system having its own individual components. it feels like those parts could be adapted to serve in a similar fashion in crusher/hydraulic systems as well.
This is looking really, really promising. Keep up the good work you guys!
edit: downloading the windows build exe and trying to run it gives me this error:
(https://i.imgur.com/JeKBXzB.png)
seems like you forgot to package the rest of the files with it
This is looking really, really promising. Keep up the good work you guys!
edit: downloading the windows build exe and trying to run it gives me this error:
(https://i.imgur.com/JeKBXzB.png)
seems like you forgot to package the rest of the files with it
Crashes on startup for me every time I try to run it. If I had to guess at the cause I'd say it might be that I have sh**ty integrated intel HD graphics on my laptop, but I can't be certain. I could well have ****ed up the install somehow. Here's the popup I get. I can also send you the crash logs if you'd like.
[ You are not allowed to view attachments ]
I absolutely love the game, so far. I don't know if it actually emulates real life, but I found that the person taking the initiative to move towards the opponent, when they have the same wedge (Eruption vs Eruption), always loses the wedge war. It lead to me losing to Eruption (as Eruption) over and over again until I realised all I had to do was not move, which shouldn't be what anyone should come to the conclusion to. I don't know how much useful this feedback is, honestly, considering the game is in the early stages of development and the pre-built bots are just a demo. Not to mention that I was using a bot against an exact copy of itself. I just thought I'd mention it, anyway. It did make me cry out in joy when I saw this, tho:
(https://i.gyazo.com/db062167e5f73f8d4692084a162e4f5f.jpg)
Edit: After doing Original Sin v Eruption, that could be the way the wedge war works, in this game. Hopefully, this is just because the game is too early in development.
In all honesty, I never get my hopes up too much whenever I see anything like this pop up because the projects usually get abandoned, after a while. Either that or progress on them is made at the pace of a snail dragging a boulder. Nevertheless, I wish you an incredible amount of luck with this project. I really appreciate that you're working on this.
Great progress so far!
I've taken some time to test it thoroughly and here are some notices
- So anytime a select a camera, W and S move the camera setting, and if i press space (weapon button) it selects the camera, which is annoying. Could you remap the camera buttons to f1, f2 & f3 (like in ra2)
- AI Eruption doesn't self right
- Eruption's flipper is too op in damage, or bots are fragile af
- Carbide deals no damage, or force, which makes me think if there is enough weight on spinner for force to flung enemies
Some wishes:
- Immobile countdown timer
- Maybe a component maker, something like a chassis maker
- Material for maker (Steel, alu, etc..., great for comp maker)
- Camera that follows you and AI (Something like Action cam in ra2)
- RA2 like attach point system (maybe add a button to enable/disable it)
All in all great progress and i wish you the best!
7. Which key gets follow camera control? This should be really easy to do.Prolly 4, as it would then be 1,2,3,4
Ability to rip off components (I know it's possible because they fly off when you disable an opponent, but I haven't been able to rip off a single wheel or anything like that)
- Maybe a component maker, something like a chassis maker
- RA2 like attach point system (maybe add a button to enable/disable it)
I've just downloaded the linux version and this is what I get.
[ You are not allowed to view attachments ]
Wow, This is really cool! I had a lot of fun throwing carbide around the arena
However, am I the only one experiencing severe input lag? It seems to take about a second for the game to register my inputs. Idk if its just my low spec laptop or whether it was an intended feature to simulate IRL robot controls maybe?
Wow, This is really cool! I had a lot of fun throwing carbide around the arena
However, am I the only one experiencing severe input lag? It seems to take about a second for the game to register my inputs. Idk if its just my low spec laptop or whether it was an intended feature to simulate IRL robot controls maybe?
We haven't included any input lag in the simulation. What are the specs for your laptop? Are you using keyboard controls?
The game works great on my 2013 11" MacBook Air, but I am curious to see how low we can go with acceptable performance. I am hoping to target midrange phones and WebGL. Phones will probably be okay, but I'm struggling to get WebGL working, not sure why at this point. We might have to wait for the Steam launch before looking into the WebGL version again.
Seems cjbruce hasn't posted about it here yet but there's a new build out, with breakable components, new components for the bot lab, and a prototype version of the arena builder, among other things. I'm only posting about it because I want to offer some feedback:
- The new immobility countdown flickers a lot, which is irritating, and if multiple robots aren't moving then it switches between them rather than each robot having an individual countdown
- The text is wonky on some of the buttons (esp. in the arena builder). Dunno if that's just coz I'm playing in 720p windowed mode though.
- The sound balance feels off - some sounds are too loud, others are too quiet. Dunno if it's just me.
- Eruption's flipper apparently has a limited amount of CO2 but I don't see that indicated anywhere in the UI - if the blue gauge is CO2, then it's not depleting
- If you click "Help" in the Robot Lab, it spawns a fully-finished robot that then sinks through the table. You can spawn them indefinitely and fill the lab with them. Amusing, but probably not intended?
Still looks great and feels great, though. Rome wasn't built in a day, as they say. Keep up the good work!
Link to the latest build:fixed
https://robot-rumble.itch.io/builds
What badger said.Oh yeah, that was one of the bugs I forgot, Eruption always spawns facing backward.
Also the start points seem a bit odd. Like robots often start facing away from each other but sometimes not. I tried a match with original sin in the sumo ring and the physics pushed me out right when I spawned. I could also see the path that AI was planning to take. I assume that's just a debug feature that isn't normally supposed to be visible.
But other than that, great work. I'm looking forward to seeing the robot and arena editors in a more developed form. Looks very promising
What does the bar under the HP bar represent? Would be useful for it to show CO2 levels on Eruption or spinner speed on CarbideOn Carbide, at least, it appears to represent motor temperature or something. If you have the weapon spinning for too long, the bar starts to fill with red, and you have to release the weapon button to get it to lower again. I don't know what happens if the bar fills all the way up but I'm guessing the weapon just stops working.
Gave the newest build a shot, it's starting to look like a very solid base for a full game. I've found some bugs and I have some suggestions.
Bugs:
Some z-fighting with the dummy bot, particularly on the warehouse stage. At one point the mesh floor on the warehouse briefly displayed over the dummy bot's decal.
Suggestions/Compaints:
Eruption's flipper feels super anaemic.
Carbide's spinner feels like it's very slow, but with a ton of torque.
Everything feels like it has way too much HP. Except once an AI Carbide's blade fell off just by hitting my Eruption, with no non-HP damage being cause to my Eruption.
It's difficult to figure out what's doing damage when Original Sin's opponent is taking damage. Is it impact with the arena wall? Contact with the wedge arm things? It feels inconsistent.
What does the bar under the HP bar represent? Would be useful for it to show CO2 levels on Eruption or spinner speed on Carbide
Eruption's limited CO2 supply is realistic, but not very fun at all, especially with how weak its flipper is. Maybe give a debug option to allow unlimited flips?
Part of what made RA2 so long-lasting was the fact that component data was stored in a user-editable format, allowing for customization. Would it be possible to read robot data from text files, allowing the user to edit carbine's spinner speed or eruption's flipper power, for example?
I had a couple more bugs and inconsistencies but I've forgotten them now. Oh well. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Edit: I also managed to flip the DB out of the sumo arena without the DB being killed or the round ending
(https://i.imgur.com/zGRbda1.jpg)
What badger said.
Also the start points seem a bit odd. Like robots often start facing away from each other but sometimes not. I tried a match with original sin in the sumo ring and the physics pushed me out right when I spawned. I could also see the path that AI was planning to take. I assume that's just a debug feature that isn't normally supposed to be visible.
But other than that, great work. I'm looking forward to seeing the robot and arena editors in a more developed form. Looks very promising
What badger said.Oh yeah, that was one of the bugs I forgot, Eruption always spawns facing backward.
Also the start points seem a bit odd. Like robots often start facing away from each other but sometimes not. I tried a match with original sin in the sumo ring and the physics pushed me out right when I spawned. I could also see the path that AI was planning to take. I assume that's just a debug feature that isn't normally supposed to be visible.
But other than that, great work. I'm looking forward to seeing the robot and arena editors in a more developed form. Looks very promising
Also might be nice if the dummy bot was invertible, so it can better serve its purpose as a punching bag. Just my personal opinion
What does the bar under the HP bar represent? Would be useful for it to show CO2 levels on Eruption or spinner speed on CarbideOn Carbide, at least, it appears to represent motor temperature or something. If you have the weapon spinning for too long, the bar starts to fill with red, and you have to release the weapon button to get it to lower again. I don't know what happens if the bar fills all the way up but I'm guessing the weapon just stops working.
Heck yeah, 500 posts
It was just something I happened to notice while playing the latest build. What clinched it was when I started turning and the bar started filling up faster, because I had three motors running instead of one. Controlling overheating sounds like an interesting game mechanic (and should make it harder for people to make unrealistic bots with tonnes of weapon/drive motors ;) )What does the bar under the HP bar represent? Would be useful for it to show CO2 levels on Eruption or spinner speed on CarbideOn Carbide, at least, it appears to represent motor temperature or something. If you have the weapon spinning for too long, the bar starts to fill with red, and you have to release the weapon button to get it to lower again. I don't know what happens if the bar fills all the way up but I'm guessing the weapon just stops working.
Heck yeah, 500 posts
You are correct on all counts! Nice detective work! (and a little bit scary) :smile:
It was just something I happened to notice while playing the latest build. What clinched it was when I started turning and the bar started filling up faster, because I had three motors running instead of one. Controlling overheating sounds like an interesting game mechanic (and should make it harder for people to make unrealistic bots with tonnes of weapon/drive motors ;) )What does the bar under the HP bar represent? Would be useful for it to show CO2 levels on Eruption or spinner speed on CarbideOn Carbide, at least, it appears to represent motor temperature or something. If you have the weapon spinning for too long, the bar starts to fill with red, and you have to release the weapon button to get it to lower again. I don't know what happens if the bar fills all the way up but I'm guessing the weapon just stops working.
Heck yeah, 500 posts
You are correct on all counts! Nice detective work! (and a little bit scary) :smile:
What does D.B. stand for
Good game, but fix and simplify the bot lab. Make a mobile port too please! I would love to play on the go.
What does D.B. stand for
:bigsmile:
No one is quite sure, but we are open to suggestions.
Good game, but fix and simplify the bot lab. Make a mobile port too please! I would love to play on the go.
The BotLab is our biggest push right now, in addition to cleaning up the physics for each robots. We are tuning dynamics, and once with have dialed things in we will need to figure out how to translate all of the hand-built stuff into the BotLab.
A mobile port is firmly in the "nice to have" category until we can get a solid version up an running for Windows/Mac/Linux. Rethinking everything for mobile will take some work, and our team is pretty small.
That being said, here's a video of me fighting an AI robot on an iPhone 7 Plus:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AXSi9qrPtWw (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AXSi9qrPtWw)
@Ra2Winner999
Please don't make multiple posts in a row. Instead, edit your previous post and add whatever you want to say onto it.
@cjbruce
I don't mean to be pushy, but is there an ETA for the next build's release? I'm really looking forward to it.
Good to hear, will there be any tweaks to Eruption's flipper in the next build? That's what I'm really looking forward to!
Great to hear! Another question, are you planning on having AI bots be part of the .exe of the game (like how it is now) or separated out into their own files, like how RA2 does it?Good to hear, will there be any tweaks to Eruption's flipper in the next build? That's what I'm really looking forward to!
Yup! Way more powerful, with a much improved range of motion. :smile:
Please keep in mind that Carbide, Original Sin, and Eruption only exist in these early development builds. We don't have permission to use them in the final game. Right now we are using them to prove out the physics and AI tactics, and we have the goal of being able to build and test a solid functional replica of a wide range of real-life robots in the BotLab. All of the parameters for a CO2 flipper should be tweakable in the BotLab, such as hinge range of motion, piston diameter, stroke length, buffer tank volume, etc.
Great to hear! Another question, are you planning on having AI bots be part of the .exe of the game (like how it is now) or separated out into their own files, like how RA2 does it?Good to hear, will there be any tweaks to Eruption's flipper in the next build? That's what I'm really looking forward to!
Yup! Way more powerful, with a much improved range of motion. :smile:
Please keep in mind that Carbide, Original Sin, and Eruption only exist in these early development builds. We don't have permission to use them in the final game. Right now we are using them to prove out the physics and AI tactics, and we have the goal of being able to build and test a solid functional replica of a wide range of real-life robots in the BotLab. All of the parameters for a CO2 flipper should be tweakable in the BotLab, such as hinge range of motion, piston diameter, stroke length, buffer tank volume, etc.
Since RW is dead now, if you ask nicely you might be able to get permission from the builders of at least Eruption and Carbide to use their bots, maybe after a rename/recolour to avoid copyright issues w/ Mentorn. I know the builder of Eruption used to post on GTM pretty regularly so I'd be surprised if he were against the idea. Just thinking since it would be a shame for the work that's gone into modelling and implementing these bots to go to waste.
Looking very interesting! Any tweaks to weaponry (Eruption's flipper power, carbide's spinner speed etc)?
Note that we will most likely be removing Eruption, Carbide, and Original Sin from the game, as they all have restrictive licensing agreements.What's the chance you can leave in "Generic Bar Spinner", "Generic UK style Flipper" and "Generic 4WD Wedge bot"?
Cant wait for the new build! any pics of the flail bot
Note that we will most likely be removing Eruption, Carbide, and Original Sin from the game, as they all have restrictive licensing agreements.What's the chance you can leave in "Generic Bar Spinner", "Generic UK style Flipper" and "Generic 4WD Wedge bot"?
Eruption - The flipper is 4 times more powerful than before. It is maybe a tad too overpowered, but it is more fun now. :)You'll regret that.
I feel like the force curve on Eruption's flipper is a bit off, I think maybe either the force is applied over too long a period, or maybe the force doesn't peak quickly enough (awful pic below to explain what I mean), both leading the flipper to feel a bit unsatisfying and unrealistic. That and Eruption's flipper is very inconsistent; sometimes feeling barely less anaemic than before and other times exploding like the gif Guldenflame posted above, or sometimes behaving in a way anywhere between those two extremes. I personally think it would be a good use of time to polish the feel of eruption's flipper and iron out the explosion bug, even if Eruption is not long for this game, as I'm sure it would serve you well if you chose to create another AI flipper or a component that allows the user to create flippers in the botlab.
Awful pic:
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I downloaded this yesterday, but couldn't get it run properly. It's fine in the menus but when I enter a battle I get huge amounts of lag (like 2 seconds after I press a button) is there a simple fix for this?
What I did manage to play I thought it was pretty fun and the physics were pretty realistic and I'd love to see this continue in future
threw the link over to my buds at ARC and one of them discovered that if you have a bot on the very top of Eruption's flipper and fire it, Eruption will explode. he was able to reproduce it pretty consistently.
In addition to the glitches that Badnik mentioned there's also some kind of glitch with Eruption's self righting when controlled by a player. It tends to glitch out and launch the bot around and usually out of the arena even from the opposite side of the ring.
Gonna echo Badnik's praise though. This is the first build I've played of the game and the combat is already fun and addictive as hell. The botlab looks incredibly promising too. Will be watching how things develop extremely eagerly :thumbup
I downloaded this yesterday, but couldn't get it run properly. It's fine in the menus but when I enter a battle I get huge amounts of lag (like 2 seconds after I press a button) is there a simple fix for this?
What I did manage to play I thought it was pretty fun and the physics were pretty realistic and I'd love to see this continue in future
Thanks for the feedback! I am curious as to your system specs. I have been tuning combat to run between 30-60 fps on a 2013 Macbook Air laptop with 8 GB of RAM. The game is CPU-limited on my laptop, with physics taking the vast majority of the CPU time.
Yeah well there's your problem. You can't expect a 3 year old celeron (with no dGPU) that was weak when it was released to play basically any 3-D game released in the past decade or more. Not an issue with the game I'm afraid. Try it on a desktop if you have access to one.I downloaded this yesterday, but couldn't get it run properly. It's fine in the menus but when I enter a battle I get huge amounts of lag (like 2 seconds after I press a button) is there a simple fix for this?
What I did manage to play I thought it was pretty fun and the physics were pretty realistic and I'd love to see this continue in future
Thanks for the feedback! I am curious as to your system specs. I have been tuning combat to run between 30-60 fps on a 2013 Macbook Air laptop with 8 GB of RAM. The game is CPU-limited on my laptop, with physics taking the vast majority of the CPU time.
It's an Acer Aspire ES1-512 (2015 or 2016) with 4 GB of RAM
The processor is an Intel Celeron N2840 if any of this helps
Yeah well there's your problem. You can't expect a 3 year old celeron (with no dGPU) that was weak when it was released to play basically any 3-D game released in the past decade or more. Not an issue with the game I'm afraid. Try it on a desktop if you have access to one.I downloaded this yesterday, but couldn't get it run properly. It's fine in the menus but when I enter a battle I get huge amounts of lag (like 2 seconds after I press a button) is there a simple fix for this?
What I did manage to play I thought it was pretty fun and the physics were pretty realistic and I'd love to see this continue in future
Thanks for the feedback! I am curious as to your system specs. I have been tuning combat to run between 30-60 fps on a 2013 Macbook Air laptop with 8 GB of RAM. The game is CPU-limited on my laptop, with physics taking the vast majority of the CPU time.
It's an Acer Aspire ES1-512 (2015 or 2016) with 4 GB of RAM
The processor is an Intel Celeron N2840 if any of this helps
threw the link over to my buds at ARC and one of them discovered that if you have a bot on the very top of Eruption's flipper and fire it, Eruption will explode. he was able to reproduce it pretty consistently.
Nice catch! I will definitely take a look at this.
Yeah well there's your problem. You can't expect a 3 year old celeron (with no dGPU) that was weak when it was released to play basically any 3-D game released in the past decade or more. Not an issue with the game I'm afraid. Try it on a desktop if you have access to one.I downloaded this yesterday, but couldn't get it run properly. It's fine in the menus but when I enter a battle I get huge amounts of lag (like 2 seconds after I press a button) is there a simple fix for this?
What I did manage to play I thought it was pretty fun and the physics were pretty realistic and I'd love to see this continue in future
Thanks for the feedback! I am curious as to your system specs. I have been tuning combat to run between 30-60 fps on a 2013 Macbook Air laptop with 8 GB of RAM. The game is CPU-limited on my laptop, with physics taking the vast majority of the CPU time.
It's an Acer Aspire ES1-512 (2015 or 2016) with 4 GB of RAM
The processor is an Intel Celeron N2840 if any of this helps
It is good to know though. @Olister92, thank you for sharing!
I am toying with the idea of supporting really old hardware. This comes with other advantages, like being able to throw unlimited numbers of robots in the ring together. Right now I am tweaking everything for two robots, and am pushing physics to the maximum.
If we were willing to give up a bunch of physics fidelity by going to a "magic mobility" system where the forces on an object are drastically simplified like in RA2, we could get by on RA2-like hardware. I'm not convinced that it would be worth it though. The current high-fidelity physics should be able to handle arbitrary shapes created in the BotLab. If you want a pneumatics system, you build it from scratch. All of the hinges and sliding joints are modeled individually. You couldn't do this in RA2, where everything was made of prebuilt components.
I would be curious to see how a Windows computer with a Geekbench single CPU score around 2400 performs. Any takers? :)I have a Surface Book with i7-6600u. Can't really find an accurate score for it but I can benchmark for you.
I would be curious to see how a Windows computer with a Geekbench single CPU score around 2400 performs. Any takers? :)I have a Surface Book with i7-6600u. Can't really find an accurate score for it but I can benchmark for you.
I could also throttle down my desktop if that helps.
I would suggest that the bottleneck for the Acer laptop is the integrated graphics, not the CPU for this particular workload
Nice game!! It's so addictive and here are some of my suggestions.
1.Maybe it can be added something like weapon designing. Build the shape of the blade, the var, the flipper and the axe etc. whatever we like, and choose the material to attach to their weight. I think it could be of great fun. Also the paint job should be various as well so players can create their own best-looking robots.(such as typing words in different shapes)
2.The spinners should be more powerful, it's always embarrassing to see Carbide ripping Original Sin apart and then died incredibly.
3.When a robot end up with no life, it might be more real if it stops moving and been counted down, with the other side spinning around.
It's Nightmare!
I had a quick play with the new build, my feedback:
- Eruption's flipper feels really nice now. Great work on tweaking that!
- Both spinners, however, do not. Their blades/drums are going orders of magnitude too slow. Is this a limitation of the unity engine?
- Carbide's bar is rotating off-center and it looks really derpy
- PLEASE make the Esc key open the pause menu, not close the game!
- I like the addition of the drumbot
- I think the inactivity timer is really well implemented, both mechanically and visually. Great work there.
Good to see some progress. I haven't messed around in the botlab at all, are the bots made there useable in battle yet?
man. this is nuts.
made a sexy robot
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some really neat features in here. im very impressed with what you guys have done, it's far and away the most complete robot builder i've seen besides ra2. I hope the work continues, I can't wait to see where it goes. especially interested in the bot creator. got some very good things so far, I'm especially happy with the custom shapes you can make, ra2 needed a feature like this.
incredible work so far. bot lab has got me excited
i have some bug issues with fighting however, not sure if others are having this. saw phil able to drive his bot but when I try to do a match it always ends immediately after the countdown, and says player 1 has won.
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this happens even if I set both players to cpu. I may be doing something wrong but if it's a bug I thought I'd let you guys know.
please don’t be as clueless as robotfan99I thought you were more clueless. Guess I was wrong then.
:realmad(please don’t be as clueless as robotfan99I thought you were more clueless. Guess I was wrong then.
/sarcasm
Can we get Linux builds? I'd like to test this.
To everyone who has given feedback, thank you! We are frantically trying to put everything together for an Alpha release.
We have been talking to lots of real-life roboteers to get permission to use their robots in our game. We have some bad news and some good news on this front.
The Bad:
Display rights to all of the Robot Wars robots are owned by the BBC. Both they and Battlebots are rightfully protective of their intellectual property. This means that we do not have permission to use Carbide, Eruption, or Original Sin in our commercial release. All three robots will be removed from the game.
The Good:
Many of the roboteers themselves are really excited to share their unlicensed designs. We have permission from several of the teams to use their other designs from the live circuit. We should be able to get a few of these designs into the next few builds.
To everyone who has given feedback, thank you! We are frantically trying to put everything together for an Alpha release.
We have been talking to lots of real-life roboteers to get permission to use their robots in our game. We have some bad news and some good news on this front.
The Bad:
Display rights to all of the Robot Wars robots are owned by the BBC. Both they and Battlebots are rightfully protective of their intellectual property. This means that we do not have permission to use Carbide, Eruption, or Original Sin in our commercial release. All three robots will be removed from the game.
The Good:
Many of the roboteers themselves are really excited to share their unlicensed designs. We have permission from several of the teams to use their other designs from the live circuit. We should be able to get a few of these designs into the next few builds.
Cool, will it be steam?
To everyone who has given feedback, thank you! We are frantically trying to put everything together for an Alpha release.
We have been talking to lots of real-life roboteers to get permission to use their robots in our game. We have some bad news and some good news on this front.
The Bad:
Display rights to all of the Robot Wars robots are owned by the BBC. Both they and Battlebots are rightfully protective of their intellectual property. This means that we do not have permission to use Carbide, Eruption, or Original Sin in our commercial release. All three robots will be removed from the game.
The Good:
Many of the roboteers themselves are really excited to share their unlicensed designs. We have permission from several of the teams to use their other designs from the live circuit. We should be able to get a few of these designs into the next few builds.
Cool, will it be steam?
Yup - Steam will be our primary distribution platform. We are working on putting together everything we need for the Steam page right now, but we won't publish the Steam page until we have a complete BotLab where you can build robots and put them into game.
To everyone who has given feedback, thank you! We are frantically trying to put everything together for an Alpha release.
We have been talking to lots of real-life roboteers to get permission to use their robots in our game. We have some bad news and some good news on this front.
The Bad:
Display rights to all of the Robot Wars robots are owned by the BBC. Both they and Battlebots are rightfully protective of their intellectual property. This means that we do not have permission to use Carbide, Eruption, or Original Sin in our commercial release. All three robots will be removed from the game.
The Good:
Many of the roboteers themselves are really excited to share their unlicensed designs. We have permission from several of the teams to use their other designs from the live circuit. We should be able to get a few of these designs into the next few builds.
Cool, will it be steam?
Yup - Steam will be our primary distribution platform. We are working on putting together everything we need for the Steam page right now, but we won't publish the Steam page until we have a complete BotLab where you can build robots and put them into game.
Make it $9.99 early access (trust me, do not say $10.00 it looks expensive while $9.99 looks cheap) to bribe them into buying, note that you should change the price to $19.99 when 1.0 is released.
do what you need to do man. it's easy to cave into even small pressures on projects like this. you're never going to be short on people offering their two cents. I hope that you can take as much time as you can to make a quality game, but I also know that deadlines and costs and such can be very burdensome.To everyone who has given feedback, thank you! We are frantically trying to put everything together for an Alpha release.
We have been talking to lots of real-life roboteers to get permission to use their robots in our game. We have some bad news and some good news on this front.
The Bad:
Display rights to all of the Robot Wars robots are owned by the BBC. Both they and Battlebots are rightfully protective of their intellectual property. This means that we do not have permission to use Carbide, Eruption, or Original Sin in our commercial release. All three robots will be removed from the game.
The Good:
Many of the roboteers themselves are really excited to share their unlicensed designs. We have permission from several of the teams to use their other designs from the live circuit. We should be able to get a few of these designs into the next few builds.
Cool, will it be steam?
Yup - Steam will be our primary distribution platform. We are working on putting together everything we need for the Steam page right now, but we won't publish the Steam page until we have a complete BotLab where you can build robots and put them into game.
Make it $9.99 early access (trust me, do not say $10.00 it looks expensive while $9.99 looks cheap) to bribe them into buying, note that you should change the price to $19.99 when 1.0 is released.
Thanks for the tip! I’m not sure about Early Access yet. At this point we are limited more by time than funding. If we were to do Early Access, I would like to keep its time period short.
https://robot-rumble.itch.io/builds (https://robot-rumble.itch.io/builds)
https://robot-rumble.itch.io/builds (https://robot-rumble.itch.io/builds)
Lovely, thank you.
I'll test it as soon as itch.io's downloads start working again - seems their service is having some issues right now.
https://robot-rumble.itch.io/builds (https://robot-rumble.itch.io/builds)
Lovely, thank you.
I'll test it as soon as itch.io's downloads start working again - seems their service is having some issues right now.
Seems itchio/hwcdn was having issues with either my double NAT or my ISP. Had to download (slooowly) while proxying through another network. ( If you want a better CDN, hit me up on DM, that's my line of work :) ).
So, tested this for a few minutes on Gentoo Linux (Kernel 4.14.10), with my integrated Intel HD Graphics 530 (GL 4.5, GLES 3.2) and Intel i7-6700k and 32GB of RAM. I know, the graphics aren't great, but other games work okay at full HD on low graphics (I play Talos Principle on this machine quite a bit, @30FPS).
What works:
- game launches! full screen only, can't seem to window it (tried alt-enter)
- 1v1 combat launches
- botlab launches
What doesn't work:
- any sort of performance (menus are sluggish, combat view is around 5FPS)
- smoke (?) particles during combat - they get rendered with a white background
- building a robot - I get stuck on 'collision mode' selection, when I click any of the buttons I get a textured box but no wireframe and can't advance to next step
Player.log: https://q3k.org/u/9f1843023508c15946e0bd26ef9e4aa8f052a9bb140bf408be46ef58e7423872.log
If you tell me how I can get this resized to a window, I'll get you some screenshots / recordings. Oh, and any chance you could also release a 64-bit Linux build?
Thanks for the Linux build!
This is awesome
Will be able to create our own arenas for the game?
Looking good! I'm excited to see what building and driving is gonna like with the new botlab.
Luckily for me, the latest version of unity still targets Vista. ;) Just make sure there is a x86 build. You should probably edit your open post. You have not touched it in a little less than a year.
I don't think developers should be held hostage to ancient standards by people who refuse to upgrade to at least semi-recent software/hardware. There's no good reason to be running a 32 bit OS (or any version of Vista for that matter) in 2018.go to hell im running xp why dont you buy me a new computer big boy
You're running on an operating system that is no longer getting security patches. This is the equivalent of living in a house with no lock on the front door. Actually, it's more like living in a house with a hole where a front door should be, with huge neon signs pointing to the hole saying "FREE STUFF IN HERE". You don't need to buy a new PC to upgrade the operating system to a newer, safe version.I don't think developers should be held hostage to ancient standards by people who refuse to upgrade to at least semi-recent software/hardware. There's no good reason to be running a 32 bit OS (or any version of Vista for that matter) in 2018.go to hell im running xp why dont you buy me a new computer big boy
but it is 64 bit
im signing up to test
how soon after signing up for the mailing list should i expect an email that gets me through to download the alpha :heart_smiley:
The Alpha Build is live!
Alpha Trailer: https://youtu.be/pjOqj6xXuI4 (https://youtu.be/pjOqj6xXuI4)
Download the Alpha Build on itch.io: https://robot-rumble.itch.io/builds (https://robot-rumble.itch.io/builds)
Sign up for the closed beta on our website: http://www.robot-rumble.com (http://www.robot-rumble.com)
The Alpha Build is live!
Alpha Trailer: https://youtu.be/pjOqj6xXuI4 (https://youtu.be/pjOqj6xXuI4)
Download the Alpha Build on itch.io: https://robot-rumble.itch.io/builds (https://robot-rumble.itch.io/builds)
Sign up for the closed beta on our website: http://www.robot-rumble.com (http://www.robot-rumble.com)
Wow! This looks amazing! Good job everyone.
I would love to sign up for the beta but my laptop is too crappy and I have to save money for a new one
Hey, i tried to lower the resolution but even though i changed it in the settings, nothing changed and when I quit and came back into the game, it was still on the old one. Do you know how to change it?
The Alpha Build is live!
Alpha Trailer: https://youtu.be/pjOqj6xXuI4 (https://youtu.be/pjOqj6xXuI4)
Download the Alpha Build on itch.io: https://robot-rumble.itch.io/builds (https://robot-rumble.itch.io/builds)
Sign up for the closed beta on our website: http://www.robot-rumble.com (http://www.robot-rumble.com)
Wow! This looks amazing! Good job everyone.
I would love to sign up for the beta but my laptop is too crappy and I have to save money for a new one
Thank you!
Just curious, but how old is the laptop, and can it load the game? I’m trying to get a handle on how far back we can go before the game is unplayable.
Hey, so I played the most recent version this morning and I really love what you’ve done so far. The physics feel really accurate and I love the realistic sound effects. The bot builder works really well and I had fun making a couple of designs. However I do have some thoughts for improvements based on what I’ve played:
-Unless I’m missing something, I couldn’t find a way to stop spinner robots overheating once the weapon was activated, so I always broke down after a few seconds (the smoke particle effect looks really nice btw)
-Royal Robby really needs balancing adjustments imo. I know that the axe does crazy amounts of damage, but the high ground clearance and relative slowness, make it really underpowered overall. I’d recommend making it lower to the ground and drive a little faster, whilst making the axe much less damaging. The AI also doesn’t seem to know to self-right until the immobilisation counter starts
-i feel like robots get broken too quickly, and should have either more HP or do less damage generally
-when making chassis/component shapes, an arrow would be handy to remind you which way is forwards, as I accidentally built a robot facing the wrong way XD
I understand that this is just an alpha, and it’s not meant to be perfect, but I figured you might appreciate some feedback.
(This is also way better than RA3 and it’s still only in alpha)
Great work!
This game just looks better and better with each successive update. The fact it has real live competitors makes it even better IMO - Earthquake and Manta? You sure kept that a surprise!
There's a few issues I noticed, though:
- Every now and then, both robots will suddenly just disappear from the arena. I dunno how it happens, but it seems like a fairly major thing.
- If you flip Royal Robby over, he seems to forget how to move even after he self-rights. He swings his axe back and forth when the immobility counter appears, but other than that he just sits there and lets you keep flipping him or shoving him into hazards. I've actually seen him kill himself from the recoil damage of rocking back and forth while firing.
- The picture of the Test Arena in the Arena Select menu shows the old version, without all the new hazards. Speaking of which, when you're using camera 1, it's impossible to tell that there's a spike hazard thing directly underneath the camera's location until you drive into its strike zone and it wipes out a chunk of your health. I was very confused the first time it hit me.
- On the robot selection screen, some of the robots (like Theseus) are facing in the opposite direction on the turntable. It's a small thing, but it's still worth noting.
I'll have to try the build system at some point.
The Alpha Build is live!
Alpha Trailer: https://youtu.be/pjOqj6xXuI4 (https://youtu.be/pjOqj6xXuI4)
Download the Alpha Build on itch.io: https://robot-rumble.itch.io/builds (https://robot-rumble.itch.io/builds)
Sign up for the closed beta on our website: http://www.robot-rumble.com (http://www.robot-rumble.com)
Wow! This looks amazing! Good job everyone.
I would love to sign up for the beta but my laptop is too crappy and I have to save money for a new one
Thank you!
Just curious, but how old is the laptop, and can it load the game? I’m trying to get a handle on how far back we can go before the game is unplayable.
I'm using a Fujitsu Lifebook E Series. I got it (used) after my old one burned down to write repors on it. It runs win7 and I can start up the game but combat is super laggy on my end. Maybe the Laptop isn't old but crappy as hell.
Some minor feedback from what I can tell:
I tried out the botbuilder by building a flipper.
I'm glad there were tips on how to use some of the stuff. if the botlab keeps the way it is atm they should stay in as they are really helpfull.
I couldn't build a flipper but I guess that has to do with the parts not being available in the lab as of now.
I don't know what the controlls for my bot are. I know that the spacebar spun up the weapon but that's it.
I LOVE that you can shape your own components. that's something I always wanted to have in ra2.
I still have to get used to the motor size. Belted motors would be awesome to have. I couldn't line up both drivemotors on the grid for some reason tho.
and as I said before: Combat is really laggy for me but that's my laptops fault
I'm really happy this is still a work in progress. I'm used to seeing projects announced on this forum die after a year.
If I'm honest, the gameplay itself hasn't seemed to have improved that much, with my major grips being that the wedge war is still won by sitting still and, once you lose advantage against a flipper, the AI is juggling you nonstop, with very little room for recovery. Then again, I imagine gameplay details like this aren't as important to iron out at this stage in development, I just want to make sure that they're definitely going to get ironed out, at some point.
It may be too early to forecast, but are you intending on updating the game indefinitely after the intended release in 2019? I'd hate for so much effort to go to waste on a game that doesn't get polished to perfection.
Good luck with the rest of development!
it's not my computer so i can't do much of anything without permission to do so and i'd hate to screw up the man's computer trying to upgrade it to another operating system. he's big on the whole 'if it ain't broke, don't fix it' philosophy, and the fact that certain things i want to do might not work isn't going to be the thing that changes his mind.You're running on an operating system that is no longer getting security patches. This is the equivalent of living in a house with no lock on the front door. Actually, it's more like living in a house with a hole where a front door should be, with huge neon signs pointing to the hole saying "FREE STUFF IN HERE". You don't need to buy a new PC to upgrade the operating system to a newer, safe version.I don't think developers should be held hostage to ancient standards by people who refuse to upgrade to at least semi-recent software/hardware. There's no good reason to be running a 32 bit OS (or any version of Vista for that matter) in 2018.go to hell im running xp why dont you buy me a new computer big boy
but it is 64 bit
im signing up to test
Upgrade to at least windows 7 or a lightweight linux distro if you want to be supported by any software in the future. If Microsoft doesn't bother with your OS's security anymore, there's no reason why 3rd party software developers should.
it's not on the poll and it might be too late to add it-- maybe you can put it as a separate checkbox to see what people's reactions are-- but i would personally like to be able to play online with other players regardless of any effective ui or a perfect framerate or what-not. i dont care if i have to type in a host's ip address like back in the days of RA1 if it means i can play against friends in real time online. even if it lags a little. or even if 'real-time' battling isnt possible, i'd at least like to maybe be able to watch our bots fight in real-time, maybe controlled by ai we write ourselves to give me a sense of having an effect on the outcome of my match. :popcorn
anything along these lines even remotely possible? i dont care if it's not a part of the original release, even as a future add-on i'd be more than overjoyed. i could imagine something like this pushing back a potential release date sp again, if it's something that has to sit on the back burner for a later patch and release i'm more than happy with that.
i think i'm the only person on this forum who still wishes for a rean mano-y-mano online tournament of any type. so let me know if this is a even remotely feasible request. thank you!! :heart_smiley:
What are your plans on the damage side of things? As I couldn't test it I can only assume from the trailer that causing damage is possible again (like taking wheels off). You won't bring in soft body stuff tho I guess?
another thing i noticed is that the background music fades out whenever a sound effect plays, which is really annoying once you pick up on it.
Dude this is great!
Out of curiosity, how many robots will be able to be in one match? I think everyone wanted RA2 to include more than 4 robots in one match :D
I think multiplayer could be possible with parsec
Well, it wouldn't be something you'd have to consider. It would just be a solution for those who want to play the game in pseudo-online local multiplayer if you don't actually support online multiplayer.I think multiplayer could be possible with parsec
I hadn’t heard of Parsec. Thank you for mentioning it. It says that it adds 7 ms per frame, and we are already struggling to keep things under 10 ms on a strong laptop. It might be worth a shot once we have nailed down botlab-based gameplay though.
Well, it wouldn't be something you'd have to consider. It would just be a solution for those who want to play the game in pseudo-online local multiplayer if you don't actually support online multiplayer.I think multiplayer could be possible with parsec
I hadn’t heard of Parsec. Thank you for mentioning it. It says that it adds 7 ms per frame, and we are already struggling to keep things under 10 ms on a strong laptop. It might be worth a shot once we have nailed down botlab-based gameplay though.
Someone hosts their own PC and gives other people permission to control their PC (or just certain keys.)Well, it wouldn't be something you'd have to consider. It would just be a solution for those who want to play the game in pseudo-online local multiplayer if you don't actually support online multiplayer.I think multiplayer could be possible with parsec
I hadn’t heard of Parsec. Thank you for mentioning it. It says that it adds 7 ms per frame, and we are already struggling to keep things under 10 ms on a strong laptop. It might be worth a shot once we have nailed down botlab-based gameplay though.
This is really interesting. So the way it works is you take a game that already supports local multiplayer with, say, 4 Xbox controllers, and play it through a Parsec signaling server with each person having their own controller and screen?
Has anyone tried it?
Someone hosts their own PC and gives other people permission to control their PC (or just certain keys.)Well, it wouldn't be something you'd have to consider. It would just be a solution for those who want to play the game in pseudo-online local multiplayer if you don't actually support online multiplayer.I think multiplayer could be possible with parsec
I hadn’t heard of Parsec. Thank you for mentioning it. It says that it adds 7 ms per frame, and we are already struggling to keep things under 10 ms on a strong laptop. It might be worth a shot once we have nailed down botlab-based gameplay though.
This is really interesting. So the way it works is you take a game that already supports local multiplayer with, say, 4 Xbox controllers, and play it through a Parsec signaling server with each person having their own controller and screen?
Has anyone tried it?
I was one of the first to try it for RA2 ;)
https://gametechmods.com/forums/personal-tournaments/robot-wars-online-tournement/msg740486/#msg740486
https://gametechmods.com/forums/brackets-vids-and-awards/centauri-online-tournament-sbv/
Although it's the best option to do pseudo-online multiplayer/netplay in certain games that don't allow for netplay or online multiplayer (like RA2), it's incredibly far from ideal. Tails just mentioned it because he's a bit special
Just tried it out. Pretty fun, though there's not much visual indication of damage. It took me a while to figure out if I'd won my first match because I killed them or because time ran out.
Is deformation planned?
This build looks to be a really big step forward for the game. I've been playtesting recently and have found some bugs that might need some attention.
1:Attracted to pit
This bug occurs with all bots I've tested with where the AI decides to chase a spot on the pit rather than the player
2:Disappearing Screws
TR3 is the only bot I've seen do this but it does it consistently if put in this position.
3:Stuck in Ground:
This bug only seems to affect Bubblegum due to the size of its weapon. It will also do this occasionally on solid ground if it lands right.
4:Crazy Chain
If D.B MK II rotates too violently or something gets in between the chain it responds by totally freaking out.
5:Spawn Bug
This is a very specific bug that only occurs with D.B MK II and TR3 and only occurs in this arena.
Also, I haven't gone too far into depth with the botlab but the first two designs I created seemed to have the wheels clip through the floor, thus making it undriveable despite the wheels spinning.
Hopefully this information and videos below were helpful and I can't wait to see what comes in the next update :mrgreen:
BLA BLA I QUOTED THE WRONG POSThey! thats... totally reasonable.
MENTIONS AI COMBAT BASED MULTIPLAYER AND WHAT NOT.
it's not my computer so i can't do much of anything without permission to do so and i'd hate to screw up the man's computer trying to upgrade it to another operating system. he's big on the whole 'if it ain't broke, don't fix it' philosophy, and the fact that certain things i want to do might not work isn't going to be the thing that changes his mind.You're running on an operating system that is no longer getting security patches. This is the equivalent of living in a house with no lock on the front door. Actually, it's more like living in a house with a hole where a front door should be, with huge neon signs pointing to the hole saying "FREE STUFF IN HERE". You don't need to buy a new PC to upgrade the operating system to a newer, safe version.I don't think developers should be held hostage to ancient standards by people who refuse to upgrade to at least semi-recent software/hardware. There's no good reason to be running a 32 bit OS (or any version of Vista for that matter) in 2018.go to hell im running xp why dont you buy me a new computer big boy
but it is 64 bit
im signing up to test
Upgrade to at least windows 7 or a lightweight linux distro if you want to be supported by any software in the future. If Microsoft doesn't bother with your OS's security anymore, there's no reason why 3rd party software developers should.
now starting the alpha version up, i got tjis error message. i imagine this is a byproduct of having an old computer and or operating system but if this is something resolvable i would ****ing kill to know how to fix it and get this running. im clicking the right thing to open it, right?
I downloaded the alpha on my main rig. When I tryed to start a loacal match or click on the left button at all, It just crashed the game. The bot lab is nice, although it is kind of hard to build, And the last button did not seem to work.
OS:Windows Server 2019 Windows Insider Build 17744
RAM: 8GB
CPU: AMD 3800
Also i would appriciate a 32 bit build of this as well. (I can also test on XP if you make a 32 bit)
You should consider also porting this to IOS and Android, it would be the best game in this genre for Mobile.
I signed up to be a beta tester as well. Great game!
Best Regards, Asbestosstar
Dont be so quick to judge, i think its pretty new my main rig. 3.8ghz with 4 processors. I am just wantthen you do it
a 32 bit build for my other macines. It only prolly takes 5 minutes to do.
Dont be so quick to judge, i think its pretty new my main rig. 3.8ghz with 4 processors. I am just want
a 32 bit build for my other macines. It only prolly takes 5 minutes to do.
Dont be so quick to judge, i think its pretty new my main rig. 3.8ghz with 4 processors. I am just wantSo you've returned, still dumb as ever though :P
a 32 bit build for my other macines. It only prolly takes 5 minutes to do.
will we have the power to share robots also nice game
BFE 2,0 confirmed bois!
Tried the build, and im speechless. Where do i preorder the game XD
does anyone have the link for the download with carbide and original sin? I just found out they were in the game and got removed
Would it be possible to transfer models from the earlier releases when the finished game is made?does anyone have the link for the download with carbide and original sin? I just found out they were in the game and got removed
Sorry about that! We couldn’t get licensing rights for Carbide, Original Sin, or Eruption, so we removed them from the game entirely. The early pre-alpha builds with them are no longer available for download.
Would it be possible to transfer models from the earlier releases when the finished game is made?does anyone have the link for the download with carbide and original sin? I just found out they were in the game and got removed
Sorry about that! We couldn’t get licensing rights for Carbide, Original Sin, or Eruption, so we removed them from the game entirely. The early pre-alpha builds with them are no longer available for download.
I know that's not possible to do for people who haven't downloaded the demo but for those who have...
can't we make the chassis using different shapes in this version?
Can you import RA2 designs into Robot Rumble as well as custom textures and decals?no, 2 different games
Can you import RA2 designs into Robot Rumble as well as custom textures and decals?no, 2 different games
what do you save images as in order to use them on bots in Robot Rumble?
If you put out some documentation on how RR2's bot files are structured, I'm sure someone here could cook up a converter on their own at some point, if there was any demand for such a thing. Just a thought.Can you import RA2 designs into Robot Rumble as well as custom textures and decals?no, 2 different games
We haven't really thought about doing that, and to be honest, it would be a lot of work to try to write and troubleshoot a custom converter that would probably delay RR2 quite a bit.
That being said, I'm hoping you guys like the new BotLab. Both @tashic and I are working on the BotLab right now, with the following in the works:
1. Texture painting: selecting and painting custom decals on faces.
2. Texture saving and loading: exporting UV texture maps for editing in an external program (Photoshop/GIMP), then re-importing the into the game.
3. Getting BotLab robots fighting each other.
Once these are done, I am going to attempt to tackle importing custom .obj files as shapes. If we can figure out how to do this, then users should have the ability to create a 3D model and UV map it in Maya/Blender/3DS Max/Modo/ZBrush/whatever, texture it in Substance Painter/Photoshop/GIMP/whatever, then bring it into the game as a custom shape. If we can get this working, it should be possible for users to create their own movie-quality robots that they can then share with other users via an .RR2Bot file.
I know that this doesn't address the original desire to import old robots, but I hope it will make for some MUCH nicer looking new ones.
If you put out some documentation on how RR2's bot files are structured, I'm sure someone here could cook up a converter on their own at some point, if there was any demand for such a thing. Just a thought.Can you import RA2 designs into Robot Rumble as well as custom textures and decals?no, 2 different games
We haven't really thought about doing that, and to be honest, it would be a lot of work to try to write and troubleshoot a custom converter that would probably delay RR2 quite a bit.
That being said, I'm hoping you guys like the new BotLab. Both @tashic and I are working on the BotLab right now, with the following in the works:
1. Texture painting: selecting and painting custom decals on faces.
2. Texture saving and loading: exporting UV texture maps for editing in an external program (Photoshop/GIMP), then re-importing the into the game.
3. Getting BotLab robots fighting each other.
Once these are done, I am going to attempt to tackle importing custom .obj files as shapes. If we can figure out how to do this, then users should have the ability to create a 3D model and UV map it in Maya/Blender/3DS Max/Modo/ZBrush/whatever, texture it in Substance Painter/Photoshop/GIMP/whatever, then bring it into the game as a custom shape. If we can get this working, it should be possible for users to create their own movie-quality robots that they can then share with other users via an .RR2Bot file.
I know that this doesn't address the original desire to import old robots, but I hope it will make for some MUCH nicer looking new ones.
I tried Robot Rumble 2.0, and I got some results...Dont have a sh** computer
It glitched my computer to death. Even with simple bots. :(:(:(:(:(
I don't know about you, but this game's a hazard...to my computer at least. I'll try it on a different one, but until then, utter disappointment.
This should really be under Sight News and Feedback, but an error occurred. Sorry.
If this is a bump- sorry.
I tried Robot Rumble 2.0. It literally killed my computer with glitches. Can that be fixed, please?
What exactly does the game do to your computer? And when doing what?
It will help us fix things if you can be more specific.
Also what link are you talking about?
This has to be bait haha, whose multi is thisWhat exactly does the game do to your computer? And when doing what?
It will help us fix things if you can be more specific.
Also what link are you talking about?
...So I downloaded the gamy to my tiny laptop, and every time I try to fight, or build a bot, it glitches!
Is there a way to fix the glitching?
Also, I tried to send the download of RR2 to GTM, and it reported a virus. That could be linked to the glitching.
This has to be bait haha, whose multi is thisWhat exactly does the game do to your computer? And when doing what?
It will help us fix things if you can be more specific.
Also what link are you talking about?
...So I downloaded the gamy to my tiny laptop, and every time I try to fight, or build a bot, it glitches!
Is there a way to fix the glitching?
Also, I tried to send the download of RR2 to GTM, and it reported a virus. That could be linked to the glitching.
Did the game freeze when starting a battle/going to the botlab or does it start and mess with things (physics stuff? model/texture weirdness?)?
Did your antivirus report the virus or whatever you used to upload the download did?
If the virus was in the game the antivirus should have found it before you could open the game in the first place.
Did the game freeze when starting a battle/going to the botlab or does it start and mess with things (physics stuff? model/texture weirdness?)?
Did your antivirus report the virus or whatever you used to upload the download did?
If the virus was in the game the antivirus should have found it before you could open the game in the first place.
Game glitches like there's too much movement. Other than that, graphics are GREAT!
AntiVirus reported that it found a virus before the second time I played it. I put it to work removing it, and it was removed from my game.
Screen resolution is in settings, right?
Anyway, the computer I'm trying RR on is a small Google laptop.
Only google laptops i know that exist are Chromebooks and Pixelbook.
They have Google OS and it isnt compatible with any windows program
New BotLab trailer is up!The progress in the vid shown is huge next to first release of the game, keep up the work!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RD0nETeRKAg (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RD0nETeRKAg)
New Steam page is up!
https://store.steampowered.com/app/884180/Robot_Rumble_2/ (https://store.steampowered.com/app/884180/Robot_Rumble_2/)
Merry Christmas. :)
Texture painting is now working, and we have a few more things to do with the robot workshop before we shift focus to asset production.
I've been reading through Serge's mod to remove a bunch of built-in RA2 limitations in the thread below. There is a discussion about whether or not the game should prevent components from intersecting each other. It is currently on our list of things to implement for RR2, but we haven't done it yet. It looks like a lot of people would rather have the component clipping check disabled, and just leave things up to whoever is running the tournament to make sure that robots are legal.I think it should be like how DSL-IRL RA2 tourneys are run. With the clipping allowed, but as long as it can be done in real life and extenders/plates that intersect can be cut IRL to give slot, allow things that otherwise won't be possible due to game limitation but possible in real life, and of course, no intersecting motors or batteries with another of those
What do you think? Should RR2 check to make sure you don't have one component intersecting with another component?
https://gametechmods.com/forums/modifications/robot-arena-2-component-freedom-(remove-7-component-limit!)/ (https://gametechmods.com/forums/modifications/robot-arena-2-component-freedom-(remove-7-component-limit!)/)
PS - Serge, incredible work! :beer:
I've been reading through Serge's mod to remove a bunch of built-in RA2 limitations in the thread below. There is a discussion about whether or not the game should prevent components from intersecting each other. It is currently on our list of things to implement for RR2, but we haven't done it yet. It looks like a lot of people would rather have the component clipping check disabled, and just leave things up to whoever is running the tournament to make sure that robots are legal.I think it should be like how DSL-IRL RA2 tourneys are run. With the clipping allowed, but as long as it can be done in real life and extenders/plates that intersect can be cut IRL to give slot, allow things that otherwise won't be possible due to game limitation but possible in real life, and of course, no intersecting motors or batteries with another of those
What do you think? Should RR2 check to make sure you don't have one component intersecting with another component?
https://gametechmods.com/forums/modifications/robot-arena-2-component-freedom-(remove-7-component-limit!)/ (https://gametechmods.com/forums/modifications/robot-arena-2-component-freedom-(remove-7-component-limit!)/)
PS - Serge, incredible work! :beer:
please please please do NOT allow parts to clip. We already have one buggy game that does this when it never should have in the first place. We want to have to put thought into where components are placed, otherwise we might as well just build stuff in CAD.
PLEASE address the failings of ra2, dont mimic them for the sake of familiarity!
please please please do NOT allow parts to clip. We already have one buggy game that does this when it never should have in the first place. We want to have to put thought into where components are placed, otherwise we might as well just build stuff in CAD.
PLEASE address the failings of ra2, dont mimic them for the sake of familiarity!
Roger! I’ll take a look at it this weekend. :smile:
We’re trying to figure out the CAD->RR2 workflow in parallel to this.
please please please do NOT allow parts to clip. We already have one buggy game that does this when it never should have in the first place. We want to have to put thought into where components are placed, otherwise we might as well just build stuff in CAD.
PLEASE address the failings of ra2, dont mimic them for the sake of familiarity!
Roger! I’ll take a look at it this weekend. :smile:
We’re trying to figure out the CAD->RR2 workflow in parallel to this.
A pretty standard output from all sorts of CAD packages is a .dxf file, which is generally a 2D output of a part. Being able to import .dxf files and set the scaling/sizing on them somehow, and extrude them to a given thickness, would be an amazing and easy to use tool in comparison to the usual process of getting new parts into RA2. Like I have a lot of spinning bar ideas that I'd love to test out, but don't want to spend the money/time/effort to test them in the limited environment of real robotics. This would let me do a great apples to apples comparison.
please please please do NOT allow parts to clip. We already have one buggy game that does this when it never should have in the first place. We want to have to put thought into where components are placed, otherwise we might as well just build stuff in CAD.
PLEASE address the failings of ra2, dont mimic them for the sake of familiarity!
Roger! I’ll take a look at it this weekend. :smile:
We’re trying to figure out the CAD->RR2 workflow in parallel to this.
A pretty standard output from all sorts of CAD packages is a .dxf file, which is generally a 2D output of a part. Being able to import .dxf files and set the scaling/sizing on them somehow, and extrude them to a given thickness, would be an amazing and easy to use tool in comparison to the usual process of getting new parts into RA2. Like I have a lot of spinning bar ideas that I'd love to test out, but don't want to spend the money/time/effort to test them in the limited environment of real robotics. This would let me do a great apples to apples comparison.
Sorry for the confusion! Rather than "CAD->RR2 workflow", I should have said "3D surface modeling (Blender, Max, Maya, etc)->RR2 workflow". At some point the CAD output needs to be converted into a bunch of low poly triangles for use in the game, and rather than reinventing the wheel, I would rather leverage software created by a professional.
When I'm modeling parts for the game, I convert mechanical drawings to images, insert them as reference images in blender, then create a low-poly version using the 2D reference images. I have tried bringing in parts created in TinkerCad and Fusion 360, but the geometries created by those programs are unsatisfactory for use in the game. I'm hoping to get to the point where users can create stuff in Blender, pull it into a Unity project, export it as an asset bundle, then import it into RR2 for use in the robot workshop. I haven't tried it yet, but this should work in principle.
Regarding using RR2 to test out new spinner shapes, be wary of the limitations of the physics engine. A 6000 RPM spinner revolves at 100 revolutions per second. Right now RR2's physics simulation is running at 400 updates per second, so the spinner would spin 90 degrees in between each update. This creates all sorts of problems when it comes to collision detection and resolution. As much as I would like to have a perfect spinner simulator, RR2 isn't going to be it. Realistically speaking, I'm hoping to have something that my students can use to mock up ideas early on in their design process, to see how different robot styles might play against each other.
This looks so professionally done, can`t wait to play this
Free component-modding tools? Shut up and take my money!
Could you elaborate on the "daisy-chaining", though? I'm not sure how that's supposed to work.
I love the idea of being able to openly create components through the component tool. I feel that if this is going to be in-placed, I would love to see support/interrogation of the Steam workshop or at least have somewhere on the internet for player and mod creators to share the components they've made through this tool, for other users to download and play around with.
GTM sounds good. Steam is also good imoI love the idea of being able to openly create components through the component tool. I feel that if this is going to be in-placed, I would love to see support/interrogation of the Steam workshop or at least have somewhere on the internet for player and mod creators to share the components they've made through this tool, for other users to download and play around with.
Agreed. Assuming we can get this working, we are open to ideas on where to host the repository. Maybe gametechmods? :smile:
This looks incredible, gentlemen. Just watched the video and want to express my support. I'm excited for this.
“Daisy chaining” already works in a primitive way in the Alpha release. You can add components to an axle, but you can also “weld” anything onto any other surface. Want to make spiked wheels? Just add spikes to the surface of the wheel.ah so its like attaching two components together except without ap's so stuff can go anywhere?
“Daisy chaining” already works in a primitive way in the Alpha release. You can add components to an axle, but you can also “weld” anything onto any other surface. Want to make spiked wheels? Just add spikes to the surface of the wheel.ah so its like attaching two components together except without ap's so stuff can go anywhere?
Pretty sure it's the same build from 05/09/2018 as before. Excited for new updates and beta stuff soon though!
That's what I thought, cool. (I'm from the UK so that date I wrote is 05 Sept and not 09 May ha)
for i in range(1,100)
if i == 42 then continue
print("Considering " + i + "...")
end for//Loop through every movable object
for(objName : movingObjs)
{
//if moving objects should be stopped
if (!on)
{
//Stop the velocity of the physics component of the moving object
CallNativeFunc(objName,"ScrollingObject","Update");
} else
{
//Otherwise re-initiate the physics component of the moving object to start the movement again
CallNativeFunc(objName,"ScrollingObject","Start");
}
}
How much freedom are we giving?
Will it be a set of defined functions which we edit the contents of?
Or will there be a lot more available?
The issue with RA2 AI is that you could modify parameters which were unrelated to movement/weaponry and make instant win AIs.
I almost feel like a drag and drop overlay might be more intuitive from a basic programming level.
I echo what Badger says. I imagine you can hide those values from the user.
The other disputed factor in RA2 was movements that were not "human reproducible" along the lines of rapidly switching a motor on and off to save power or doing fancy things such as meltybrain.
Sounds like you have a pretty good grasp of how it should we to though. I have very little preference for either language. What sort of math libraries do they include? I imagine that might be a factor in more complicated routines.
The issue with Meltybrain in RA2 is that it's ONLY possible with AI. There's no real way to do it (at least that isn't cludgy as hell) for a player-controlled bot. If you can find a way to get meltybrain to work for both player and AI driven bots, I can't see why it would be an issueI echo what Badger says. I imagine you can hide those values from the user.
The other disputed factor in RA2 was movements that were not "human reproducible" along the lines of rapidly switching a motor on and off to save power or doing fancy things such as meltybrain.
Sounds like you have a pretty good grasp of how it should we to though. I have very little preference for either language. What sort of math libraries do they include? I imagine that might be a factor in more complicated routines.
Uh oh. I had fully assumed that people would be okay with melty brain controls.
We can do something where state is only updated and made available to the AI every 0.1 seconds, so even though the AI can run at 60 FPS, it is only reading new state information at 10 FPS. Or we could do it in reverse, where state is read every 60 fps, but control signals are only applied to the motors every 10 FPS.
I fully expect that good AI controls would be able to kick a human player's butt. At least that is what I had in my head -- when competing against other players, you are putting your very best AI against their very best AI.
The issue with Meltybrain in RA2 is that it's ONLY possible with AI. There's no real way to do it (at least that isn't cludgy as hell) for a player-controlled bot. If you can find a way to get meltybrain to work for both player and AI driven bots, I can't see why it would be an issueI echo what Badger says. I imagine you can hide those values from the user.
The other disputed factor in RA2 was movements that were not "human reproducible" along the lines of rapidly switching a motor on and off to save power or doing fancy things such as meltybrain.
Sounds like you have a pretty good grasp of how it should we to though. I have very little preference for either language. What sort of math libraries do they include? I imagine that might be a factor in more complicated routines.
Uh oh. I had fully assumed that people would be okay with melty brain controls.
We can do something where state is only updated and made available to the AI every 0.1 seconds, so even though the AI can run at 60 FPS, it is only reading new state information at 10 FPS. Or we could do it in reverse, where state is read every 60 fps, but control signals are only applied to the motors every 10 FPS.
I fully expect that good AI controls would be able to kick a human player's butt. At least that is what I had in my head -- when competing against other players, you are putting your very best AI against their very best AI.
How complex is the game's AI going to be? Will it be like RA2, where the robots more or less just drive straight at each other, or will you be able to program more complex behaviours? Things like pushing opponents towards hazards, timing flips instead of hitting the button instantly, preserving CO2 when it starts to run out, trying to aim for specific points like wheels...
Basically, we've covered that the AI shouldn't be able to do anything that a human player can't. But ideally, the opposite should be true, and human's shouldn't be able to do anything that an AI can't. I know that's unlikely, but the more lifelike the AI is, the better, IMO. It would prevent what you get in RA2 sometimes, where two robots with equal wedginess just push each other slowly round in a circle for three minutes.
What if we use actual artificial intelligence?How complex is the game's AI going to be? Will it be like RA2, where the robots more or less just drive straight at each other, or will you be able to program more complex behaviours? Things like pushing opponents towards hazards, timing flips instead of hitting the button instantly, preserving CO2 when it starts to run out, trying to aim for specific points like wheels...
Basically, we've covered that the AI shouldn't be able to do anything that a human player can't. But ideally, the opposite should be true, and human's shouldn't be able to do anything that an AI can't. I know that's unlikely, but the more lifelike the AI is, the better, IMO. It would prevent what you get in RA2 sometimes, where two robots with equal wedginess just push each other slowly round in a circle for three minutes.
Caveat: We are going with miniscript for now, and I haven’t explored the language yet. Bearing this in mind, I can see two limitations at this point:
1. AI scripts are going to be limited to a single file — no includes.
2. The available inputs to the AI are whatever data we choose to include from the native code (C# in this case) side. I am totally open to taking suggestions at this point. We can choose to be more precise than just driving at the chassis origin or COM. If we want, we can choose to target the nearest motor, or get a list of all of the motors and target the farthest one. At this point we don’t have anything coded, so anything is technically possible. It is just a matter of converting ideas into reality.
What if we use actual artificial intelligence?How complex is the game's AI going to be? Will it be like RA2, where the robots more or less just drive straight at each other, or will you be able to program more complex behaviours? Things like pushing opponents towards hazards, timing flips instead of hitting the button instantly, preserving CO2 when it starts to run out, trying to aim for specific points like wheels...
Basically, we've covered that the AI shouldn't be able to do anything that a human player can't. But ideally, the opposite should be true, and human's shouldn't be able to do anything that an AI can't. I know that's unlikely, but the more lifelike the AI is, the better, IMO. It would prevent what you get in RA2 sometimes, where two robots with equal wedginess just push each other slowly round in a circle for three minutes.
Caveat: We are going with miniscript for now, and I haven’t explored the language yet. Bearing this in mind, I can see two limitations at this point:
1. AI scripts are going to be limited to a single file — no includes.
2. The available inputs to the AI are whatever data we choose to include from the native code (C# in this case) side. I am totally open to taking suggestions at this point. We can choose to be more precise than just driving at the chassis origin or COM. If we want, we can choose to target the nearest motor, or get a list of all of the motors and target the farthest one. At this point we don’t have anything coded, so anything is technically possible. It is just a matter of converting ideas into reality.
Take Google's Deep mind AI, and use it in this game, this specific AI can learn by itself, and it has taught itself how to walk, so I think it could teach itself to play RR2, but it's probably impossible to doWhat if we use actual artificial intelligence?How complex is the game's AI going to be? Will it be like RA2, where the robots more or less just drive straight at each other, or will you be able to program more complex behaviours? Things like pushing opponents towards hazards, timing flips instead of hitting the button instantly, preserving CO2 when it starts to run out, trying to aim for specific points like wheels...
Basically, we've covered that the AI shouldn't be able to do anything that a human player can't. But ideally, the opposite should be true, and human's shouldn't be able to do anything that an AI can't. I know that's unlikely, but the more lifelike the AI is, the better, IMO. It would prevent what you get in RA2 sometimes, where two robots with equal wedginess just push each other slowly round in a circle for three minutes.
Caveat: We are going with miniscript for now, and I haven’t explored the language yet. Bearing this in mind, I can see two limitations at this point:
1. AI scripts are going to be limited to a single file — no includes.
2. The available inputs to the AI are whatever data we choose to include from the native code (C# in this case) side. I am totally open to taking suggestions at this point. We can choose to be more precise than just driving at the chassis origin or COM. If we want, we can choose to target the nearest motor, or get a list of all of the motors and target the farthest one. At this point we don’t have anything coded, so anything is technically possible. It is just a matter of converting ideas into reality.
What did you have in mind?
Take Google's Deep mind AI, and use it in this game, this specific AI can learn by itself, and it has taught itself how to walk, so I think it could teach itself to play RR2, but it's probably impossible to doWhat if we use actual artificial intelligence?How complex is the game's AI going to be? Will it be like RA2, where the robots more or less just drive straight at each other, or will you be able to program more complex behaviours? Things like pushing opponents towards hazards, timing flips instead of hitting the button instantly, preserving CO2 when it starts to run out, trying to aim for specific points like wheels...
Basically, we've covered that the AI shouldn't be able to do anything that a human player can't. But ideally, the opposite should be true, and human's shouldn't be able to do anything that an AI can't. I know that's unlikely, but the more lifelike the AI is, the better, IMO. It would prevent what you get in RA2 sometimes, where two robots with equal wedginess just push each other slowly round in a circle for three minutes.
Caveat: We are going with miniscript for now, and I haven’t explored the language yet. Bearing this in mind, I can see two limitations at this point:
1. AI scripts are going to be limited to a single file — no includes.
2. The available inputs to the AI are whatever data we choose to include from the native code (C# in this case) side. I am totally open to taking suggestions at this point. We can choose to be more precise than just driving at the chassis origin or COM. If we want, we can choose to target the nearest motor, or get a list of all of the motors and target the farthest one. At this point we don’t have anything coded, so anything is technically possible. It is just a matter of converting ideas into reality.
What did you have in mind?
Not sure if this has been mentioned, but will there be basic default AI scripts for different weapon types that the player can apply straight to a robot? Just thinking for players who might find writing AI scripts to be difficult, if they’ve never done any scripting or basic programming. That said, I did look up MiniScript and it looks pretty simple to use, even compared to python.
while 1
hRaw = controlSignal
vRaw = dotProduct
spinnerOn = false
wait(0.1)
end while
I know its a buttload of extra work and also that I'm a bit late to the party but I think the most ideal way to program robots would be through a graphical language. Those tend to be much more friendly towards those that aren't familiar with programming (and would also be more familiar to people who use stuff like labview).
If you were to come up with your own icons it would probably be possible to have a 1-to-1 correspondence to miniscript (so at least a transpiler could be easy). Maybe just keep this as a suggestion for when after all the more important stuff is finished.
Quick suggestion: It might be a good idea to put the selectable bots in a list of some sort or another, instead of putting all the possible options on the screen at once. I think it'll look cleaner, and it will scale better with more bots than your current solution. Maybe look at how either RA2 or Robot Wars: Extreme Destruction do this. Slightly different implementations of the same idea.
I'm looking forward to testing the new build 👍
PS - Serge, incredible work! :beer:
Feedback:
- Default Windows desktop 64-bit.exe isn't a very friendly name for the game's .exe.
- Windows defender warned me about the file being potentially malicious. I'm sure it's a false flag but this is the first time this has happened to me, so it might be alarming enough to scare some potential players away, assuming I'm not the only one getting this
- A lot of the time both bots just refuse to move after the match starts. I noticed that this happened more frequently when playing as/against Theseus or Royal Robby.
- Both Earthquake and Manta's flippers seem to be non-functional, aside from draining gas.
- Royal Robby's axe has a nasty habit of just flinging itself into space for no reason when fired, much like the Firestorm flipper glitch in DSL2.1.
- As a minor balance note, I'd love to see Royal Robby have a lower ground clearance so he can actually get under the sides of some buts, like Terrorhurtz IRL. As of right now he's mostly useless against anything with a wedge.
Enjoying what I've played of the new build so far! Am I right in thinking there's no way to create flippers in the botlab at the moment though, or am I missing
something?
Edit: On another note, it seems that flippers in this build aren't working full stop, whether controlled by player or AI. Tested with Earthquake, Manta and TR3. Pressing the flip button decreases the gas meter, but doesn't do anything.
Thanks for responding to my feedback, the build is working a lot better now.
A few more things I've noticed:
- Human controller flipper bots seem to have their weapons still controlled by AI, as in they fire without user input
- Inverted bots only fire their weapon when the countdown starts. It would be nice for the AI to behave more like they do in RA2, where there is a toggleable 'invertible' setting, where if false the bot fires it's weapon until it is uninverted.
- Royal Robby doesn't seem to have a weapon firing sound effect
- When you're trapped under the flipper of an AI, they seem to spam fire their weapon fruitlessly until they run out of CO2 (screenshot of the positioning I'm talking about is attached). Maybe add a short cooldown for the AI firing their weapon, and only let them fire again once their weapon has fully/mostly retracted? Just a thought.
- I think you've been a bit stingy with the CO2 allowance for each bot, but that's personal preference. Maybe instead of a hard limit, the flip power (and CO2 useage) decreases non-linearly, so later flips are weaker but use less CO2 (due to the pressure having decreased as a result of running low).
Hope that helps 👍
I'm enjoying this version so far, the only problem being that the bot lab is super laggy for me, which might just be my computer.
Feedback-
Royal Robby is super glitchy, and randomly flies into space sometimes after firing the axe. Also, it seems to have way too much ground clearance, and no beta-style tail to keep it from flopping, even when dealing a not glitchy hit.
Bubblegum feels broken, since it seems like its impossible to destabilize it, and it still does RA2 damage by just grinding away and doing nothing while the opponent dies trying to kill it
Theseus' AI has absolutely no clue what to do when its flipped over and just drives around aimlessly
Sometimes robots will just sit there and do nothing after outwedging each other
gameplay seems pretty nice and i like what you got for the botlab so far (especially those scaleable shapes)
it seems D.B 2's flail tends to go a bit crazy during fights sometimes
i have 2 questions:
-what is the Temp stat bar for ? is it something related to pneumatics ?
-is this like RA2 where you need the weapon components to do damage (e.g adding spikes at the end of a bar) or can i just spin a rescaled cube shape as a bar spinner and it will still hurt sh** ?
I'm enjoying the new RR2 version. Keep it up.
I'm enjoying the new RR2 version. Keep it up.
Glad to hear, and thank you!
I'm enjoying the new RR2 version. Keep it up.
Glad to hear, and thank you!
Since I know you're in the RR2 building community, I have something to ask- What gave you the idea to make RR2?
I'm enjoying the new RR2 version. Keep it up.
Glad to hear, and thank you!
Since I know you're in the RR2 building community, I have something to ask- What gave you the idea to make RR2?
Great question! It originally started a few years ago with our school's robot combat club. We do one competition a year with 85 pound robots. Our students typically finish their robots at the last minute, and typically have never driven their robots before we put them into the arena. Since the winner of a round is often determined by the better driver, I figured we could have a huge advantage if our drivers had practiced before the actual competition.
Thus RR2 was born.
Since then the game has morphed into more than a robot driving simulator, but I still intend to use it on the first day we meet next school year to help students figure out what designs work. Right now we are working on wiring up multiplayer controls, and I am super excited for the day when we can give each student a controller and have them go 1 on 1 in an arena with controllers that are pretty close to the Spektrum DX6's that we use IRL.
Fun is important, but the core game also needs to be grounded in reality in order to be useful as a trainer.
You must be some sort of guy with superpowers, ‘cause this game you’re making is mind-blowing.
good progress, i cant drive my bots tho
ra2's successor is finally here
Apanx would undoubtedly be the first guy you should go to on that frontra2's successor is finally here
We’re trying! Hopefully by launch time we are worthy.
Speaking of that, I am looking to put together a team of RA2 AI experts to work on the usability of the RR2 AI system. My goal is to capture all of the possible inputs a player want to have for their robot’s AI.
Any recommendations on who I should ask for help?
ra2's successor is finally hereJust saying, but i may still play RA2 and host tournaments on there after RR2. Like, RR2 is great, but RA2 also feels like a good classic to me, and Idk if my laptop will lag running RR2 or not
I wire them up, but they dont move in test area or battlesgood progress, i cant drive my bots tho
Uh oh. That's not right. Are you using the latest Alpha version 2.01? What exactly is going wrong?
Hey, Kix. I can send you a download of the latest version, if you want it...i mean its pretty much the same as the one i downloaded
I wire them up, but they dont move in test area or battlesgood progress, i cant drive my bots tho
Uh oh. That's not right. Are you using the latest Alpha version 2.01? What exactly is going wrong?Hey, Kix. I can send you a download of the latest version, if you want it...i mean its pretty much the same as the one i downloaded
I wire them up, but they dont move in test area or battlesgood progress, i cant drive my bots tho
Uh oh. That's not right. Are you using the latest Alpha version 2.01? What exactly is going wrong?Hey, Kix. I can send you a download of the latest version, if you want it...i mean its pretty much the same as the one i downloaded
I'm not sure if you saw this on the other thread, but maybe this will help? Double posting the instructions here. Please let me know if this doesn't work for you, and we will do some more advanced troubleshooting.
@tashic is working on motor wiring now. It is complicated, and taking a while to sort through.
Stuff that should work right now:
1. Attach a couple of AmpFlow motors, one or the left wheel and one for the right wheel.
2. Attach wheels to the motor attachment points. You will probably need to rotate the view to get the wheels to snap to the axles.
3. Go over a few screens to the "Controls" tab. Select the motor on the left side of the screen, and click "Left Drive Motor". Select the motor on the right side of the screen and click "Right Drive Motor". The game assumes that the forward direction for the robot is forward the rusty green lathe in the back of the room.
4. Click on the game controller icon at the top of the screen to test the controls.
5. Use WASD to drive.
ra2's successor is finally hereJust saying, but i may still play RA2 and host tournaments on there after RR2. Like, RR2 is great, but RA2 also feels like a good classic to me, and Idk if my laptop will lag running RR2 or not
booted up the new demo, some bugs ive found
-manta's flipper and bubblegum in general are rather buggy and like to clip their parts into each other leading to physics weirdness
-bubblegum and crippling depression's weapons spin the wrong direction
-ai robots seem to have a problem navigating around the pit cover? like when they drive over it they seem to be stuck navigating in that one small square until another robot pushes them out
-spinner sound effects do not stop when a match is restarted, leading to the same sfx being overlayed multiple times
-ai flippers cannot self-right
-royal robby's axe retracts too fast for its own good imo
-floor spikes seem to do too much damage
-ive had matches where ballerina's weapon won't spin, for some reason. i think this has something to do with the aforementioned sfx bug
I can play the game on Internet site right? Because I haven't tried it yet as I assume I have to download for it, and I don't want to download updates a lot every time a new version comes out tbh, considering the stage of the game now. If it's Internet though, I may be able to try on late April, because RL stuffra2's successor is finally hereJust saying, but i may still play RA2 and host tournaments on there after RR2. Like, RR2 is great, but RA2 also feels like a good classic to me, and Idk if my laptop will lag running RR2 or not
I totally respect that. RA2 is awesome. It has an incredible community with unheard-of longevity.
I wouldn't give up on the laptop though. I'm doing all of my game dev on a laptop, and am targeting a 2013 MacBook Air with 8 GB of RAM as the minimum. Would you mind trying the game on your laptop and letting us know how it goes?
Apanx would undoubtedly be the first guy you should go to on that frontra2's successor is finally here
We’re trying! Hopefully by launch time we are worthy.
Speaking of that, I am looking to put together a team of RA2 AI experts to work on the usability of the RR2 AI system. My goal is to capture all of the possible inputs a player want to have for their robot’s AI.
Any recommendations on who I should ask for help?
I can play the game on Internet site right? Because I haven't tried it yet as I assume I have to download for it, and I don't want to download updates a lot every time a new version comes out tbh, considering the stage of the game now. If it's Internet though, I may be able to try on late April, because RL stuffra2's successor is finally hereJust saying, but i may still play RA2 and host tournaments on there after RR2. Like, RR2 is great, but RA2 also feels like a good classic to me, and Idk if my laptop will lag running RR2 or not
I totally respect that. RA2 is awesome. It has an incredible community with unheard-of longevity.
I wouldn't give up on the laptop though. I'm doing all of my game dev on a laptop, and am targeting a 2013 MacBook Air with 8 GB of RAM as the minimum. Would you mind trying the game on your laptop and letting us know how it goes?
Ive seen it, dw i have done it, yet to no availI wire them up, but they dont move in test area or battlesgood progress, i cant drive my bots tho
Uh oh. That's not right. Are you using the latest Alpha version 2.01? What exactly is going wrong?Hey, Kix. I can send you a download of the latest version, if you want it...i mean its pretty much the same as the one i downloaded
I'm not sure if you saw this on the other thread, but maybe this will help? Double posting the instructions here. Please let me know if this doesn't work for you, and we will do some more advanced troubleshooting.
@tashic is working on motor wiring now. It is complicated, and taking a while to sort through.
Stuff that should work right now:
1. Attach a couple of AmpFlow motors, one or the left wheel and one for the right wheel.
2. Attach wheels to the motor attachment points. You will probably need to rotate the view to get the wheels to snap to the axles.
3. Go over a few screens to the "Controls" tab. Select the motor on the left side of the screen, and click "Left Drive Motor". Select the motor on the right side of the screen and click "Right Drive Motor". The game assumes that the forward direction for the robot is forward the rusty green lathe in the back of the room.
4. Click on the game controller icon at the top of the screen to test the controls.
5. Use WASD to drive.
Ive seen it, dw i have done it, yet to no availI wire them up, but they dont move in test area or battlesgood progress, i cant drive my bots tho
Uh oh. That's not right. Are you using the latest Alpha version 2.01? What exactly is going wrong?Hey, Kix. I can send you a download of the latest version, if you want it...i mean its pretty much the same as the one i downloaded
I'm not sure if you saw this on the other thread, but maybe this will help? Double posting the instructions here. Please let me know if this doesn't work for you, and we will do some more advanced troubleshooting.
@tashic is working on motor wiring now. It is complicated, and taking a while to sort through.
Stuff that should work right now:
1. Attach a couple of AmpFlow motors, one or the left wheel and one for the right wheel.
2. Attach wheels to the motor attachment points. You will probably need to rotate the view to get the wheels to snap to the axles.
3. Go over a few screens to the "Controls" tab. Select the motor on the left side of the screen, and click "Left Drive Motor". Select the motor on the right side of the screen and click "Right Drive Motor". The game assumes that the forward direction for the robot is forward the rusty green lathe in the back of the room.
4. Click on the game controller icon at the top of the screen to test the controls.
5. Use WASD to drive.
Im the test bot area (after i press the controller icon
I did the same thing for my bot IronTail. Works great.Im the test bot area (after i press the controller icon
The first thing that comes to mind is that maybe the wheels aren’t attached to the axle correctly. Is it possible that they are affixed to the body of the motor instead? Maybe try mounting a motor vertically, then attaching a bar spinner to the axle, then calling the motor a drive motor?
(http://www.robot-rumble.com/assigningabarspinner.gif)
The following is a list of all of the inputs I think an AI would need to make decisions on which tactic to choose:
The following is a list of all of the inputs I think an AI would need to make decisions on which tactic to choose:
There should probably be a separate item between 5 & 6 that checks for the currently attainable win condition (so as to not waste processing power on edge location on closed arenas and whatnot).
But to be honest, while a list is nice and all, it's kinda hard to see the whole picture without those fitting in multiple flowcharts (immobility checker should run concurrently with the other combat functions, for example).
The following is a list of all of the inputs I think an AI would need to make decisions on which tactic to choose:
There should probably be a separate item between 5 & 6 that checks for the currently attainable win condition (so as to not waste processing power on edge location on closed arenas and whatnot).
But to be honest, while a list is nice and all, it's kinda hard to see the whole picture without those fitting in multiple flowcharts (immobility checker should run concurrently with the other combat functions, for example).
This one goes out to all of the AI programmers in the crowd. I need your help! Please let me know if I am missing anything!Maybe, for robots with CO2, how much they have left? So if they start running out, maybe they prioritise self-righting over mindlessly swinging at anything in the vicinity, and when they run out, they know to stop firing the weapon. Robots in RA2 will keep firing their pistons long after their CO2 has run out.
The following is a list of all of the inputs I think an AI would need to make decisions on which tactic to choose:
1. position and rotation of self (in 3D world space)
2. position and rotation of nearest enemy (in 3D world space)
3. position of nearest waypoint from navmesh (in 3D world space)
[Example: Distance to nearest enemy is computed using #1 and #2.]
4. list of our own motors
5. list of our own smart zones
[Example: If all of our weapon motors are gone, then switch to shoving.]
6. location of nearest edge
[Used for pushing battles.]
7. location of scoring zone
[Used for "king of the hill" arenas.]
8. time of my last good hit on enemy
[To decide if my attacks are working.]
9. self immobile time
10. self isImmobile
11. nearest enemy immobile time
If we do this right, everything that an AI needs could be derived from the above inputs.
Am I missing anything?
This one goes out to all of the AI programmers in the crowd. I need your help! Please let me know if I am missing anything!Maybe, for robots with CO2, how much they have left? So if they start running out, maybe they prioritise self-righting over mindlessly swinging at anything in the vicinity, and when they run out, they know to stop firing the weapon. Robots in RA2 will keep firing their pistons long after their CO2 has run out.
The following is a list of all of the inputs I think an AI would need to make decisions on which tactic to choose:
1. position and rotation of self (in 3D world space)
2. position and rotation of nearest enemy (in 3D world space)
3. position of nearest waypoint from navmesh (in 3D world space)
[Example: Distance to nearest enemy is computed using #1 and #2.]
4. list of our own motors
5. list of our own smart zones
[Example: If all of our weapon motors are gone, then switch to shoving.]
6. location of nearest edge
[Used for pushing battles.]
7. location of scoring zone
[Used for "king of the hill" arenas.]
8. time of my last good hit on enemy
[To decide if my attacks are working.]
9. self immobile time
10. self isImmobile
11. nearest enemy immobile time
If we do this right, everything that an AI needs could be derived from the above inputs.
Am I missing anything?
Also maybe a list of arena hazards (for avoidance and/or shoving opponents towards them)? Or does that come under "edges"?
I think the best starting point is to determine:
1. The processes that are active throughout the whole match (immobility check, enemy tracking/mobility check, win condition evaluation, obstacle evaluation that modifies the shortest path between the bots).
2. A default engagement tactic that is active only while mobile, armed, & powered.
3. The processes that are triggered by mid-match conditions (new engagement tactic when new win condition is determined, such as keeping distance when enemy is stuck, shoving when disarmed, evading when crippled/stuck/low on power, etc.).
Then from those processes you can derive the necessary data to build your functions upon:
- Positioning and mobility status for the processes in #1
- Battery, air, drive, weapon, & armor statuses for the processes in #2
- Control signals that are triggered from the processes in #2 maybe a bit from #1
My engineering background is in microelectronics so I might be over-complicating things. Someone who has a strong background in control systems, feel free to correct me. :smile:
I think it's important to understand why AI is important in RA2. It acts as a way to fairly battle bots in lieu of multiplayer. It's a bandage on the problem of the game's netcode being so bad as to be unfit for purpose. As player vs AI fights are unfair, the only way to have a fair fight in RA2 between 2 player created bots is to have an AI battle between both. The problem with this is that it leaves out a large component of what makes real battles interesting, which is the battle of driver vs driver as well as bot vs bot.Honestly, I think that maybe Parsec can work rather than an in built multi-player system
What I'm hinting at is that it might be worth looking into multiplayer over an AI scripting language. I don't want to come off as though I think I'm entitled to decide what you should/shouldn't prioritize in the game, but I think chasing this AI system might not be wise, looking through the lens of a player. RA2 already does this well, what we're missing as a community is multiplayer. Unfortunately I'd assume that multiplayer would be a lot more complex on the developer side than an AI system.
I disagree. Again, I think Parsec is just a bandaid, and not a particularly useful one looking at its lack of adoption for RA2, which would seemingly be the ideal scenario for the service. It has several issues, such as it being inherently unfair (the host has a sizeable latency advantage), being a pain in the ass both to set up the service and to set up bots and controls and relying on very solid network speeds. These issues combine to result in it barely being used in GTM as of late.I think it's important to understand why AI is important in RA2. It acts as a way to fairly battle bots in lieu of multiplayer. It's a bandage on the problem of the game's netcode being so bad as to be unfit for purpose. As player vs AI fights are unfair, the only way to have a fair fight in RA2 between 2 player created bots is to have an AI battle between both. The problem with this is that it leaves out a large component of what makes real battles interesting, which is the battle of driver vs driver as well as bot vs bot.Honestly, I think that maybe Parsec can work rather than an in built multi-player system
What I'm hinting at is that it might be worth looking into multiplayer over an AI scripting language. I don't want to come off as though I think I'm entitled to decide what you should/shouldn't prioritize in the game, but I think chasing this AI system might not be wise, looking through the lens of a player. RA2 already does this well, what we're missing as a community is multiplayer. Unfortunately I'd assume that multiplayer would be a lot more complex on the developer side than an AI system.
I disagree. Again, I think Parsec is just a bandaid, and not a particularly useful one looking at its lack of adoption for RA2, which would seemingly be the ideal scenario for the service. It has several issues, such as it being inherently unfair (the host has a sizeable latency advantage), being a pain in the ass both to set up the service and to set up bots and controls and relying on very solid network speeds. These issues combine to result in it barely being used in GTM as of late.I think it's important to understand why AI is important in RA2. It acts as a way to fairly battle bots in lieu of multiplayer. It's a bandage on the problem of the game's netcode being so bad as to be unfit for purpose. As player vs AI fights are unfair, the only way to have a fair fight in RA2 between 2 player created bots is to have an AI battle between both. The problem with this is that it leaves out a large component of what makes real battles interesting, which is the battle of driver vs driver as well as bot vs bot.Honestly, I think that maybe Parsec can work rather than an in built multi-player system
What I'm hinting at is that it might be worth looking into multiplayer over an AI scripting language. I don't want to come off as though I think I'm entitled to decide what you should/shouldn't prioritize in the game, but I think chasing this AI system might not be wise, looking through the lens of a player. RA2 already does this well, what we're missing as a community is multiplayer. Unfortunately I'd assume that multiplayer would be a lot more complex on the developer side than an AI system.
Been messing around in RR2 trying to learn the ropes of the botlab and everything, and have been having some fun trying to recreate my RA2 bots.
I did Speed Demon, and a rudimentary version of Sabre first, and put them up against each other in an AI vs AI fight (pretty cool that the AI just automatically knew how to drive them with 0 messing around too )
https://youtu.be/36hZhgJKRD8
Then this fight got me wondering if there was any way to make some kind of flipper with what's currently in the game (no pneumatics etc), so I got talking to Hoppin, and dabbling around with spin motors, and I managed to get something to work. It's super weak (kinda series 3 Firestorm levels of power) but it's enough to overturn other bots, and it should work for self righting too (though in this clip Earthquake sitting on top of me prevented that). It won't work with AI, but for player driven bots having a way to make even a super weak flipper is pretty neat I thought.
https://youtu.be/zg-ExHPmKog
My question is: Has he AId it to do the Bocuma spin?Been messing around in RR2 trying to learn the ropes of the botlab and everything, and have been having some fun trying to recreate my RA2 bots.
I did Speed Demon, and a rudimentary version of Sabre first, and put them up against each other in an AI vs AI fight (pretty cool that the AI just automatically knew how to drive them with 0 messing around too )
https://youtu.be/36hZhgJKRD8
Then this fight got me wondering if there was any way to make some kind of flipper with what's currently in the game (no pneumatics etc), so I got talking to Hoppin, and dabbling around with spin motors, and I managed to get something to work. It's super weak (kinda series 3 Firestorm levels of power) but it's enough to overturn other bots, and it should work for self righting too (though in this clip Earthquake sitting on top of me prevented that). It won't work with AI, but for player driven bots having a way to make even a super weak flipper is pretty neat I thought.
https://youtu.be/zg-ExHPmKog
Dayum even on this Sabare seems to outwedge an opponent with ease. Speed Demon looks nice too.
Been messing around in RR2 trying to learn the ropes of the botlab and everything, and have been having some fun trying to recreate my RA2 bots.
I did Speed Demon, and a rudimentary version of Sabre first, and put them up against each other in an AI vs AI fight (pretty cool that the AI just automatically knew how to drive them with 0 messing around too )
https://youtu.be/36hZhgJKRD8
Then this fight got me wondering if there was any way to make some kind of flipper with what's currently in the game (no pneumatics etc), so I got talking to Hoppin, and dabbling around with spin motors, and I managed to get something to work. It's super weak (kinda series 3 Firestorm levels of power) but it's enough to overturn other bots, and it should work for self righting too (though in this clip Earthquake sitting on top of me prevented that). It won't work with AI, but for player driven bots having a way to make even a super weak flipper is pretty neat I thought.
https://youtu.be/zg-ExHPmKog
Oh yeah... Double post, but uhh...
https://youtu.be/Ca50953QPbE
Oh yeah... Double post, but uhh...
https://youtu.be/Ca50953QPbE
WELL DONE!!!!
So awesome!
I had no idea this was even a thing!
I take it that this is Parsec? Is there something I can do to make it work better?
Oh yeah... Double post, but uhh...
https://youtu.be/Ca50953QPbE
WELL DONE!!!!
So awesome!
I had no idea this was even a thing!
I take it that this is Parsec? Is there something I can do to make it work better?
Well not even a full day and we got a new type of flipper:
https://youtu.be/SCOLfRFrhg8
Well not even a full day and we got a new type of flipper:
https://youtu.be/SCOLfRFrhg8
I've downloaded the alpha now and toyed around a little bit. Looks like good fun with quite some building options and freedom. First bot I made might be a bit too light or something? I dunno. Sometimes when just driving forward it decides to turn on its own.Yeah there is Royal Bobby (axebot)
I do wonder... Why when I choose to make a new bot was there some axe bot being spawned in the area, that could even be controlled there?
I've downloaded the alpha now and toyed around a little bit. Looks like good fun with quite some building options and freedom. First bot I made might be a bit too light or something? I dunno. Sometimes when just driving forward it decides to turn on its own.
I've downloaded the alpha now and toyed around a little bit. Looks like good fun with quite some building options and freedom. First bot I made might be a bit too light or something? I dunno. Sometimes when just driving forward it decides to turn on its own.Yeah there is Royal Bobby (axebot)
I do wonder... Why when I choose to make a new bot was there some axe bot being spawned in the area, that could even be controlled there?
Also turn on motor braking for drive, its a godsend
I've downloaded the alpha now and toyed around a little bit. Looks like good fun with quite some building options and freedom. First bot I made might be a bit too light or something? I dunno. Sometimes when just driving forward it decides to turn on its own.Yeah there is Royal Bobby (axebot)
I do wonder... Why when I choose to make a new bot was there some axe bot being spawned in the area, that could even be controlled there?
Also turn on motor braking for drive, its a godsend
Also, what do you guys think of doing electronic stability control to help drive in a straight line for keyboard control? It isn’t hard to implement, but is it too much?
I agree, playtesting will be the best option, although i am a bit scepticalI've downloaded the alpha now and toyed around a little bit. Looks like good fun with quite some building options and freedom. First bot I made might be a bit too light or something? I dunno. Sometimes when just driving forward it decides to turn on its own.Yeah there is Royal Bobby (axebot)
I do wonder... Why when I choose to make a new bot was there some axe bot being spawned in the area, that could even be controlled there?
Also turn on motor braking for drive, its a godsend
Also, what do you guys think of doing electronic stability control to help drive in a straight line for keyboard control? It isn’t hard to implement, but is it too much?
We'd probably have to give that a test, it certainly sounds interesting. Personally I'm ok with driving as is atm, even without motor braking.
I agree, playtesting will be the best option, although i am a bit scepticalI've downloaded the alpha now and toyed around a little bit. Looks like good fun with quite some building options and freedom. First bot I made might be a bit too light or something? I dunno. Sometimes when just driving forward it decides to turn on its own.Yeah there is Royal Bobby (axebot)
I do wonder... Why when I choose to make a new bot was there some axe bot being spawned in the area, that could even be controlled there?
Also turn on motor braking for drive, its a godsend
Also, what do you guys think of doing electronic stability control to help drive in a straight line for keyboard control? It isn’t hard to implement, but is it too much?
We'd probably have to give that a test, it certainly sounds interesting. Personally I'm ok with driving as is atm, even without motor braking.
Sounds good. I’ll hold off on it unless we need it. Also, be sure to try game controllers if have them.Trued with a controller. Honestly not my style, but it will be useful for irl bot builders
I agree, playtesting will be the best option, although i am a bit scepticalI've downloaded the alpha now and toyed around a little bit. Looks like good fun with quite some building options and freedom. First bot I made might be a bit too light or something? I dunno. Sometimes when just driving forward it decides to turn on its own.Yeah there is Royal Bobby (axebot)
I do wonder... Why when I choose to make a new bot was there some axe bot being spawned in the area, that could even be controlled there?
Also turn on motor braking for drive, its a godsend
Also, what do you guys think of doing electronic stability control to help drive in a straight line for keyboard control? It isn’t hard to implement, but is it too much?
We'd probably have to give that a test, it certainly sounds interesting. Personally I'm ok with driving as is atm, even without motor braking.
Sounds good. I’ll hold off on it unless we need it. Also, be sure to try game controllers if have them.
I agree, playtesting will be the best option, although i am a bit scepticalI've downloaded the alpha now and toyed around a little bit. Looks like good fun with quite some building options and freedom. First bot I made might be a bit too light or something? I dunno. Sometimes when just driving forward it decides to turn on its own.Yeah there is Royal Bobby (axebot)
I do wonder... Why when I choose to make a new bot was there some axe bot being spawned in the area, that could even be controlled there?
Also turn on motor braking for drive, its a godsend
Also, what do you guys think of doing electronic stability control to help drive in a straight line for keyboard control? It isn’t hard to implement, but is it too much?
We'd probably have to give that a test, it certainly sounds interesting. Personally I'm ok with driving as is atm, even without motor braking.
Sounds good. I’ll hold off on it unless we need it. Also, be sure to try game controllers if have them.
I have no idea what the braking does here to be honest.
As for controller, I could try getting my PS3 controller to work on PC.
Right now with the simple bit I made it's not just that it'll start to turn to a side when driving forward and backward, but sometimes it'll also start to just spin in place.
Is it just me, or does the settings menu not actually work? I tried turning down the graphics settings, to try and make the bot lab run faster than 5FPS, and it didn't do anything. I closed the game and re-opened and it was back to the default settings.Okay, so the settings menu works if you access it from the pause menu during/after a fight, but it doesn't work if you access it from the main menu. Dialling down the graphics worked for me and I can play the game properly now.
Is it just me, or does the settings menu not actually work? I tried turning down the graphics settings, to try and make the bot lab run faster than 5FPS, and it didn't do anything. I closed the game and re-opened and it was back to the default settings.Okay, so the settings menu works if you access it from the pause menu during/after a fight, but it doesn't work if you access it from the main menu. Dialling down the graphics worked for me and I can play the game properly now.
I'm using 1280x800 in windowed mode, but I don't think that's the resolution it's actually displaying at. My laptop screen is 1600x900 and the game window is definitely not 800 pixels tall. But whatever. It runs, and that's the important thing.Is it just me, or does the settings menu not actually work? I tried turning down the graphics settings, to try and make the bot lab run faster than 5FPS, and it didn't do anything. I closed the game and re-opened and it was back to the default settings.Okay, so the settings menu works if you access it from the pause menu during/after a fight, but it doesn't work if you access it from the main menu. Dialling down the graphics worked for me and I can play the game properly now.
Phew! What resolution brought things into an acceptable fps for you? My Macbook Pro runs okay at 1/2 the max resolution. My Macbook Air is only 1366x768, so it does fine at that.
I guess this had to be done
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gClIvmvvzbs
What went well?
What was terrible?I wouldn't say anything was terrible, but...
I cant really add what people have said, except one thing.This might require some sort of judging system to determine who wins if multiple robots are still running. "Who has the most health" isn't reliable, what with the walls causing damage - I could be the most aggressive and dominant robot and still lose because I took more damage from the walls. And of course, with indestructible components, it's possible for neither robot to sustain any damage at all. Then what?
A timer, even a simple 180 second timer
Atleast something simple for now, with cease instead of Player X wins, atleast for online eventsI cant really add what people have said, except one thing.This might require some sort of judging system to determine who wins if multiple robots are still running. "Who has the most health" isn't reliable, what with the walls causing damage - I could be the most aggressive and dominant robot and still lose because I took more damage from the walls. And of course, with indestructible components, it's possible for neither robot to sustain any damage at all. Then what?
A timer, even a simple 180 second timer
Funny, because flippers don't glitch in my game...I believe "more powerful weapon motors" is already on the to-do list, along with a lot of balancing tweaks to improve the physics etc.
Could you make the weapons spin faster, please?
Funny, because flippers don't glitch in my game...I believe "more powerful weapon motors" is already on the to-do list, along with a lot of balancing tweaks to improve the physics etc.
Could you make the weapons spin faster, please?
In the little time I've been in this I found the lack of component descriptions to be a thing. Dunno of this is already planned to be done or if it's actually in there and I'm blind, but yeah.IIRC, you can right-click on a component in the list and it'll give you a little pop-up with the description.
What went well?Overall, the gameplay was fun and exciting. Mainly, the reason in my opinion is due to everyone's unfamiliarity with the state of the meta. This has allowed for people to experiment with designs, spinners like Gaullin, Grabbers like RT 2.0, flippers, like Bocuma. Even some of the wackier stuff like Obama Gaming and Mystic's new overhead disc spinner.
What was terrible?
Just to elaborate on my issue with the pit raising up. With the way the arena is at the moment, pretty much the only way bots that aren't spinners can win fights is to either pit their opponent, or get lucky and strand them on the wall. I don't think the pit raising up would be as much of an issue if there was alternative methods for non-spinners to KO their opponent (such as OOTA zones which Hop mentioned). Additionally, the fact that the walls do so much damage currently means that you can actually lose a not insignificant amount of HP from hitting the pit release, and having to do it multiple times per match can be quite draining on your health.What went well?Overall, the gameplay was fun and exciting. Mainly, the reason in my opinion is due to everyone's unfamiliarity with the state of the meta. This has allowed for people to experiment with designs, spinners like Gaullin, Grabbers like RT 2.0, flippers, like Bocuma. Even some of the wackier stuff like Obama Gaming and Mystic's new overhead disc spinner.
During the Gaullin and Bull fight if I recall correctly, Robo and I discussed about the wedge mechanics, in how they are more complex then they appear. This was lovely to find out, because it isn't just a simple "bolt wedglets onto it" like in Ra2.
Stability of the game engine was great despite some havocs and the odd crash, given the current status of the game, this was to be expected.What was terrible?
Self damage is currently my big problem with the fights, on impacts, it appears you take too much damage to appear realistic. This is kind of an issue with vertical spinners. When they're consistently attacking an opponent, they'll be taking more damage to themselves than they deal out, this is usually because they're hitting the indestructible parts of the opponent, which I'll cover later. Another reason for this is if they're pushed into the wall. Robo was a victim of this a lot, just taking large amounts of damage by being bumped into the wall.
Weight investments, personally I find that the chassis armour feels rather weak for it's weight investment, this could be due to the previously mentioned issue, my personal designs, the fact we have a weight limit of 110kgs which the game isnt designed for currently or all of the above.
The weapon motor power seems quite lacking, I'm aware that you're aware of this issue, so I don't plan to go into much detail. But it appears you need 50kg minimum to throw something currently, I'l like to see that minimum lowered, almost a fifth I'd say.
Indestructible parts this right now is a large issue, and again, you're aware of this. Drone and Caliban were the main culprits of this in the tournament, along with RT 2.0. We've combated this temporarily with some rule changes for the new tournament which can be read here.
Controlling of undercutters, Mystic's undercutter had some major issues with control, not sure if that's his design or because the game struggles with it. Just a heads up and something to look into.
One of Robo's complaints was the pit that rose up after a certain period of time, I agree with this design flaw currently. It's a huge disadvantage for control bots. Continuing with some of the arena design issues I saw is that there should be some oota zones, it'd just be nice to have, maybe not Series 7 wall height arenas or all around the edge, I'd suggest how battlebots does it, in the corners. That'll stop Ra2 Slapshot like stuff box rushing and oota'ing the opponent which is just boring and wont lead to interesting gameplay and fights. The rolling pin is odd, I think it needs to have it's orientation changed and given some more kick to it. You might have to re-position it to prevent it flinging robots into the pit if you do decide to take this route.
Stuck on arena objects, Bocuma and some other bots got stuck into the pit button, doesn't make for fun gameplay whilst it does reflect robot fights accurately. The wall is also easy to get stuck too, or atleast it's difficult to get away from, probably due to the wall's design.
Batteries and control boards, these currently don't effect the robots and aren't actually needed for them to function.
A question I have, is where would I be able to locate the folder for pre-made custom components on Windows? An idea I had was to import CAD files into that folder and add them in, is this a possibility?
Overall, this game is great so far. Like I've said before, I'm enjoying it more than Ra2 and whilst I've described more negatives than positives, the positives have a much bigger impact on the overall player experience.
What went well?
- While the physics still need tweaking, you're off to a good start - already we're getting the kinds of big spinner hits that you don't normally see in RA2.
- I find it amazing how, even with the limited parts we have currently, we're already seeing such a great diversity of bot types, and they're effective. Bull and Bocuma are great flippers, and RT 2.0 actually pulled off a perfect grab-and-lift on at least one occasion, something you just can't do in RA2.
- While there were the occasional havoks, and at least one crash, the game seems a lot more stable than DSL. Even Obama Gaming's flails didn't cause any problems.
What was terrible?I wouldn't say anything was terrible, but...
- Component destructibility (or at least, loss of health when components are hit) needs to be a thing. It's trivial to surround your chassis with armour (or in Drone's case, weaponry) and make yourself invincible.
- Tone down the damage taken from hitting the wall in the Test Arena. Right now it's more damaging than 99% of weapons.
- Additionally, certain bots (Bocuma, Fait Accompli) seem to have an issue where they take damage from the wall even if they hit it with a component wedge instead of their chassis. Would be nice if that could get looked at.
There's probably more but it's 11pm and that's all my tired brain can think of.
I cant really add what people have said, except one thing.This might require some sort of judging system to determine who wins if multiple robots are still running. "Who has the most health" isn't reliable, what with the walls causing damage - I could be the most aggressive and dominant robot and still lose because I took more damage from the walls. And of course, with indestructible components, it's possible for neither robot to sustain any damage at all. Then what?
A timer, even a simple 180 second timer
Atleast something simple for now, with cease instead of Player X wins, atleast for online eventsI cant really add what people have said, except one thing.This might require some sort of judging system to determine who wins if multiple robots are still running. "Who has the most health" isn't reliable, what with the walls causing damage - I could be the most aggressive and dominant robot and still lose because I took more damage from the walls. And of course, with indestructible components, it's possible for neither robot to sustain any damage at all. Then what?
A timer, even a simple 180 second timer
Sorry for the newbie question, but should AI tournaments be determined by the AI, or an external referee? Could the AI be good enough? What if "damage", "control", and "aggression" were done in a reasonable way by the AI?
I cant really add what people have said, except one thing.This might require some sort of judging system to determine who wins if multiple robots are still running. "Who has the most health" isn't reliable, what with the walls causing damage - I could be the most aggressive and dominant robot and still lose because I took more damage from the walls. And of course, with indestructible components, it's possible for neither robot to sustain any damage at all. Then what?
A timer, even a simple 180 second timer
Atleast something simple for now, with cease instead of Player X wins, atleast for online events
Interesting. I didn't think about doing "Cease!" instead of directly declaring a winner for an externally judged event. Maybe an options menu that caters to either internally refereed (single player) or externally refereed (Parsec tournament) play?
Sorry for the newbie question, but should AI tournaments be determined by the AI, or an external referee? Could the AI be good enough? What if "damage", "control", and "aggression" were done in a reasonable way by the AI?
Hey! Absolutely loving the game as it is so far!
Just a few ideas and stuff I've had on how to make it absolute perfection (Apologies if I'm just spouting stuff that's already been advised/in progress!)
-In the bot builder, in addition to having the 'Snap' setting, I think it could also do with a user-variable for 'grid' size and rotation amount (To allow precise rotation of objects to be exactly 90degs, 45degs, 33.3degs, ect.)
-Some sort of 'Mirror' function... Maybe with the critical components (motors mainly) but especially with extras. Kind of like how in the old Bamzooki Creator you could place an object/limb onto the body and it would be automatically mirrored on the other side to make for easier, quicker building. Would also be especially helpful with the blueprint editor and future decal painter.
-With the blueprint editor, having the option to import vectors in the shape of a circle, triangle, and even the option to create curves would be very useful.
-The blueprint editor would also be a lot more effective with the ability to scale the vertices much like how you can scale them once they're rendered into 3d. I know it's possible to just move the vertices around but scaling would be beneficial with complex shapes and if the circles, triangles ect. got offered, would allow users to create shapes similar to that of, for example - Typhoon or Megabyte's shells. Also, smaller dots to represent the vertices for precision.
That's about all I can think of at the moment...
Hope this helps in some way! Please do keep up the amazing work as it is phenomenal!
This game is great and has some nice potential! but:
- I would like to see a first person camera position. Nothing really major, but playing with the other camera positions just doesn't feel ideal to me, but then again, that's just me
-Flippers glitch a lot in the sumo arena
What went well?Overall, the gameplay was fun and exciting. Mainly, the reason in my opinion is due to everyone's unfamiliarity with the state of the meta. This has allowed for people to experiment with designs, spinners like Gaullin, Grabbers like RT 2.0, flippers, like Bocuma. Even some of the wackier stuff like Obama Gaming and Mystic's new overhead disc spinner.
During the Gaullin and Bull fight if I recall correctly, Robo and I discussed about the wedge mechanics, in how they are more complex then they appear. This was lovely to find out, because it isn't just a simple "bolt wedglets onto it" like in Ra2.
Stability of the game engine was great despite some havocs and the odd crash, given the current status of the game, this was to be expected.What was terrible?
Self damage is currently my big problem with the fights, on impacts, it appears you take too much damage to appear realistic. This is kind of an issue with vertical spinners. When they're consistently attacking an opponent, they'll be taking more damage to themselves than they deal out, this is usually because they're hitting the indestructible parts of the opponent, which I'll cover later. Another reason for this is if they're pushed into the wall. Robo was a victim of this a lot, just taking large amounts of damage by being bumped into the wall.
Weight investments, personally I find that the chassis armour feels rather weak for it's weight investment, this could be due to the previously mentioned issue, my personal designs, the fact we have a weight limit of 110kgs which the game isnt designed for currently or all of the above.
The weapon motor power seems quite lacking, I'm aware that you're aware of this issue, so I don't plan to go into much detail. But it appears you need 50kg minimum to throw something currently, I'l like to see that minimum lowered, almost a fifth I'd say.
Indestructible parts this right now is a large issue, and again, you're aware of this. Drone and Caliban were the main culprits of this in the tournament, along with RT 2.0. We've combated this temporarily with some rule changes for the new tournament which can be read here.
Controlling of undercutters, Mystic's undercutter had some major issues with control, not sure if that's his design or because the game struggles with it. Just a heads up and something to look into.
One of Robo's complaints was the pit that rose up after a certain period of time, I agree with this design flaw currently. It's a huge disadvantage for control bots. Continuing with some of the arena design issues I saw is that there should be some oota zones, it'd just be nice to have, maybe not Series 7 wall height arenas or all around the edge, I'd suggest how battlebots does it, in the corners. That'll stop Ra2 Slapshot like stuff box rushing and oota'ing the opponent which is just boring and wont lead to interesting gameplay and fights. The rolling pin is odd, I think it needs to have it's orientation changed and given some more kick to it. You might have to re-position it to prevent it flinging robots into the pit if you do decide to take this route.
Stuck on arena objects, Bocuma and some other bots got stuck into the pit button, doesn't make for fun gameplay whilst it does reflect robot fights accurately. The wall is also easy to get stuck too, or atleast it's difficult to get away from, probably due to the wall's design.
Batteries and control boards, these currently don't effect the robots and aren't actually needed for them to function.
A question I have, is where would I be able to locate the folder for pre-made custom components on Windows? An idea I had was to import CAD files into that folder and add them in, is this a possibility?
Overall, this game is great so far. Like I've said before, I'm enjoying it more than Ra2 and whilst I've described more negatives than positives, the positives have a much bigger impact on the overall player experience.
I put a speed limiter on motors to minimize crazy physics explosions. In a few weeks we will be switching over to a new version of PhysX that supposedly improves performance for high-speed spinners. Once we have switched over, I am hoping to put spinners up to more or less full speed.(https://i.ytimg.com/vi/sbedLpUKEsM/hqdefault.jpg)
You mentioned that the max speed of spinners is limited by the refresh rate of the physics engine (or something to that effect), which in turn is limited by the minimum spec hardware that you want the game to run on. As a compromise, would it be possible to put a slider for physics refresh rate in the options, so those with more powerful hardware can put that hardware to use to improve the gameplay?
Actually, single thread performance is probably the biggest differentiator between laptops and gaming desktops. Most modern laptops have quad cores, as do most gaming PCs (over 55% of steam users are on a quad core system), however laptop CPUs are constrained by thermal/power limitations to low clock speeds, whereas desktop CPUs can boost to over 5GHz (depending on the exact chip).You mentioned that the max speed of spinners is limited by the refresh rate of the physics engine (or something to that effect), which in turn is limited by the minimum spec hardware that you want the game to run on. As a compromise, would it be possible to put a slider for physics refresh rate in the options, so those with more powerful hardware can put that hardware to use to improve the gameplay?
Possibly. I haven’t tried adjusting physics tick rate at runtime. I can look into it though.
PhysX 3.4 supposedly does some nifty interpolation for rapidly spinning objects that allows for much finer collision checking for rapidly spinning objects. Hopefully it will make high speed spinners possible without having to significantly increase the tick rate for the entire physics engine. Physics doesn’t multithread well, so high powered machines don’t tend to have significant advantages over lower powered ones. I’m hoping that the new PhysX will solve the issue entirely. Fingers crossed!
Actually, single thread performance is probably the biggest differentiator between laptops and gaming desktops. Most modern laptops have quad cores, as do most gaming PCs (over 55% of steam users are on a quad core system), however laptop CPUs are constrained by thermal/power limitations to low clock speeds, whereas desktop CPUs can boost to over 5GHz (depending on the exact chip).You mentioned that the max speed of spinners is limited by the refresh rate of the physics engine (or something to that effect), which in turn is limited by the minimum spec hardware that you want the game to run on. As a compromise, would it be possible to put a slider for physics refresh rate in the options, so those with more powerful hardware can put that hardware to use to improve the gameplay?
Possibly. I haven’t tried adjusting physics tick rate at runtime. I can look into it though.
PhysX 3.4 supposedly does some nifty interpolation for rapidly spinning objects that allows for much finer collision checking for rapidly spinning objects. Hopefully it will make high speed spinners possible without having to significantly increase the tick rate for the entire physics engine. Physics doesn’t multithread well, so high powered machines don’t tend to have significant advantages over lower powered ones. I’m hoping that the new PhysX will solve the issue entirely. Fingers crossed!
It's good to hear that there's an inbuilt solution to high RPM collisions, the future is looking bright for this game
Some way to know the approximate dimensions / reach of myself and my opponents
Time since my last collision with each other bot
Distance from and angle to each wall of the arena
I haven't looked at the new botbuilder recently but I think smartzones are important and so we need a way to check each of them
Normally distance to each robot is nice to have but that can be calculated from the x, y, z coordinates
There was another game called roboforge which had a well done AI system which I could probably refer to for more ideas, but its super old and I think has trouble running on newer computers.
I'll post more when I think of them.
One of Robo's complaints was the pit that rose up after a certain period of time, I agree with this design flaw currently. It's a huge disadvantage for control bots. Continuing with some of the arena design issues I saw is that there should be some oota zones, it'd just be nice to have, maybe not Series 7 wall height arenas or all around the edge, I'd suggest how battlebots does it, in the corners. That'll stop Ra2 Slapshot like stuff box rushing and oota'ing the opponent which is just boring and wont lead to interesting gameplay and fights. The rolling pin is odd, I think it needs to have it's orientation changed and given some more kick to it. You might have to re-position it to prevent it flinging robots into the pit if you do decide to take this route.
Maybe try the Warehouse arena? It has a pretty low wall height. It might be a good match for the current batch of flippers.
One of Robo's complaints was the pit that rose up after a certain period of time, I agree with this design flaw currently. It's a huge disadvantage for control bots. Continuing with some of the arena design issues I saw is that there should be some oota zones, it'd just be nice to have, maybe not Series 7 wall height arenas or all around the edge, I'd suggest how battlebots does it, in the corners. That'll stop Ra2 Slapshot like stuff box rushing and oota'ing the opponent which is just boring and wont lead to interesting gameplay and fights. The rolling pin is odd, I think it needs to have it's orientation changed and given some more kick to it. You might have to re-position it to prevent it flinging robots into the pit if you do decide to take this route.
Maybe try the Warehouse arena? It has a pretty low wall height. It might be a good match for the current batch of flippers.
Yeah about that. I was thinking about using it for my next tournament, but problems are apparent as it can be witnessed in this video:
https://youtu.be/Jj-f7YfPlEc
Sorry about poor quality. OBS was a pita so i had to lower bitrate
No not only that. There is also a problem where floor break and oota bots, like in the video
No game is running perfect, it happens off recording tooNo not only that. There is also a problem where floor break and oota bots, like in the video
By any chance was the game running slower than normal when you recorded this? The Warehouse arena shouldn’t be any different than the Test Arena, but if the game was having trouble keeping up with physics, that would explain the rigidbodies penetrating too far, then exploding outward to resolve the collision.
No game is running perfect, it happens off recording tooNo not only that. There is also a problem where floor break and oota bots, like in the video
By any chance was the game running slower than normal when you recorded this? The Warehouse arena shouldn’t be any different than the Test Arena, but if the game was having trouble keeping up with physics, that would explain the rigidbodies penetrating too far, then exploding outward to resolve the collision.
Suggestion, have bots be saved in the game install directory, instead of the AppData folder. Makes the game more portable and makes the files easier to find for sharing purposes.
arrow keys/wasd + shift + space for moving things around/rotating,I honestly want to see keyboard movement for more precise, movepixel like stuff
I agree with Badger here. Also if there's ever modding with lots of custom components we might want multiple installs that don't interfere with each other, though there are other ways around that.
Is there anyway I can see what features are planned for future versions? Anyway, I have some suggestions after building in the botlab for some time. A lot of suggestions and a lot of them are complex, so I don't expect you to agree with all of them or try to implement much of what's here in the near future, I know you guys are busy.
I know you guys are not nearly done with the botlab and that given time you guys will make it great, but talking about the botlab right now as it is, it's still pretty clunky in the sense that it takes a very long time to use the controls and the tools given to you to make the botlab do what you want it to do. First of all, I think keyboard shortcuts would improve the building experience 1000%. Things like pressing x to focus the x coordinate, delete for deleting components, arrow keys/wasd + shift + space for moving things around/rotating, basically all the buttons and fields in the interface should have some keyboard mapping because clicking on everything takes forever. Remapping keys would also be great, i.e. i much prefer RMB to MMB for panning. As it is, it's very easy to make mistakes by putting the wrong numbers into the coordinates or into the wrong coordinates, and it's also way too easy to get yourself into a situation where you move something too far away and can only fix it through editing the bot file. An undue button would be a great help for this, and additionally some way to control the max distance from origin of all the components and toggle the room that you are in would all be huge helps. It's also really easy to get objects stuck inside of others, and there's currently a glitch where some small objects won't be able to be selected unless you exit and join the workshop. A lot of these issues could also be helped by having an expandable tree view of all the components like in the bot file and being able to select components like that. Being able to turn off blur from being too close would also be great. When using the moving sliders, they go in increments of .025, and if the component isn't currently at a multiple of .025 then it snaps to a multiple: there should be some way to turn the snapping to a multiple off, because a lot of the more complex builds will not use those multiples very often. This also applies to the rotation and size sliders. There should be a way to control what interval the moving axes move by, either through a field or through several hotkeys which are each set to common values, i.e. .01 and .005 with .025 as the default. It would be great if there was some way to change the directions of the coordinate system so that it doesn't have to be determined by what the object is sitting on, a lot of the times I just want the normal xyz directions. It would be fantastic if there was a way to copy the x, y, or z coordinate of one object and then set the coordinate to another in a streamlined fashion, e.g. hold x while clicking on another object. It would also be great if there was some way to clone mirrors of objects and flip each of the components. It would be nice if we could smooth components along a certain rotational axis. For the chassis and custom object builder it would be great if we could change the numerical values of the xy coordinates via text field of each of the vertices like we can for objects in the rest of the builder.
Personally, one of the more important things I would like to see added (besides pneumatics, custom decals, and destructible parts) is adjustable motor speeds. It would definitely help with making decent lifters among other things. I've been making a Complete Control style robot, and when it lifts, it'll just flip the opponent instead of picking it up. So far, I've been able to work around it a little bit, but it isn't as good as it could be.
Personally, one of the more important things I would like to see added (besides pneumatics, custom decals, and destructible parts) is adjustable motor speeds. It would definitely help with making decent lifters among other things. I've been making a Complete Control style robot, and when it lifts, it'll just flip the opponent instead of picking it up. So far, I've been able to work around it a little bit, but it isn't as good as it could be.Unless you have separate drive motors and weapon motors like in DSL, then I think this will also be needed once the motor buff comes into effect. You want your weapon motor to be going at (say) 3000 RPM, but if your drive motors are going that fast, your robot will be doing 60mph and be completely uncontrollable.
Personally, one of the more important things I would like to see added (besides pneumatics, custom decals, and destructible parts) is adjustable motor speeds. It would definitely help with making decent lifters among other things. I've been making a Complete Control style robot, and when it lifts, it'll just flip the opponent instead of picking it up. So far, I've been able to work around it a little bit, but it isn't as good as it could be.Unless you have separate drive motors and weapon motors like in DSL, then I think this will also be needed once the motor buff comes into effect. You want your weapon motor to be going at (say) 3000 RPM, but if your drive motors are going that fast, your robot will be doing 60mph and be completely uncontrollable.
It'd be handy (and realistic) if lowering the RPM also increased the torque. You could make shovebots that drive slowly but have a tonne of pushing power, or electric lifters/crushers with some serious force behind them. RA3 had something similar for spin motors, but you could increase speed and torque separately and there was no incentive to not just crank them both up to 100, so the sliders may as well have not been there at all.
-Smaler batts, maybe like Pulsar/Magnetar had?I would imagine that smaller batteries are planned, as the current ones are basically SLA car batteries, and modern combat robots all use LiPos.
-Smaler batts, maybe like Pulsar/Magnetar had?I would imagine that smaller batteries are planned, as the current ones are basically SLA car batteries, and modern combat robots all use LiPos.
Geared and non-geared seems like a sensible compromise regarding motor speeds.
One other thing I'd like to see added is custom wheels.
2 wheel drive bots just seem to straight up not work this update. The chassis seems to have a ton of friction with the floor which makes bots unable to turn, and motors seem to have less torque too which doubles this issue.
Will report further after I play the update more
This was on existing bots2 wheel drive bots just seem to straight up not work this update. The chassis seems to have a ton of friction with the floor which makes bots unable to turn, and motors seem to have less torque too which doubles this issue.
Will report further after I play the update more
For new robots, or existing ones? I set motors to their IRL torque-speed curves for this build. They should be a little different than before. Balance is really important in general. Does shifting the weight distribution help?
This was on existing bots2 wheel drive bots just seem to straight up not work this update. The chassis seems to have a ton of friction with the floor which makes bots unable to turn, and motors seem to have less torque too which doubles this issue.
Will report further after I play the update more
For new robots, or existing ones? I set motors to their IRL torque-speed curves for this build. They should be a little different than before. Balance is really important in general. Does shifting the weight distribution help?
Just to clarify, by existing bots, I mean bots that I built in a previous update, rather than the AI bots in gameThis was on existing bots2 wheel drive bots just seem to straight up not work this update. The chassis seems to have a ton of friction with the floor which makes bots unable to turn, and motors seem to have less torque too which doubles this issue.
Will report further after I play the update more
For new robots, or existing ones? I set motors to their IRL torque-speed curves for this build. They should be a little different than before. Balance is really important in general. Does shifting the weight distribution help?
Shoot. I will take a look at it next week to see what I can do.
Just to clarify, by existing bots, I mean bots that I built in a previous update, rather than the AI bots in game
Here is my feedback for the new update:
- I love how you can now make beetleweight robots. The main issue is that there is so much friction on the tires, and it won't let me turn. Also, when I was building one, it wouldn't let me re-select a motor.
- Parts actually fall off! Yay! The only issue is that small parts fall off way too easy. I would recommend having a set minimum for damage, and have it not be based completely off of weight.
- The AI builder is good to have, but it would be helpful to have it already working. I made a spinner, and the AI wouldn't do anything with the weapon for the entire match. It would also be nice to have a pre-made list for you to choose from, like one setup for spinners, flippers, and whatnot.
- The motors can't do sh**e! I made an attempt at a very light-weight hammer, and it couldn't even lift it. :vista:
Here is my feedback for the new update:
- I love how you can now make beetleweight robots. The main issue is that there is so much friction on the tires, and it won't let me turn. Also, when I was building one, it wouldn't let me re-select a motor.
- Parts actually fall off! Yay! The only issue is that small parts fall off way too easy. I would recommend having a set minimum for damage, and have it not be based completely off of weight.
- The AI builder is good to have, but it would be helpful to have it already working. I made a spinner, and the AI wouldn't do anything with the weapon for the entire match. It would also be nice to have a pre-made list for you to choose from, like one setup for spinners, flippers, and whatnot.
- The motors can't do sh**e! I made an attempt at a very light-weight hammer, and it couldn't even lift it. :vista:
Lots of fixes coming here shortly:
1. Parts don't come off until they receive about 20 times as much damage. Before they fall off, they propagate damage up to their parent component. This means that if you keep hitting the same spot you will eventually damage the chassis.
2. The AI builder should fire button 1 when close. There was apparently a bug which prevented anyone from pressing button 1, which has been fixed.
3. I just added a super low gear ratio 37 mm motor. It can flip beetleweights now. I feel like the existing gear motor should have been able to lift other robots, but for some reason 1 Newton-meter of torque didn't translate into 10 Newtons of force at 10 cm. The new motor has a LOT more torque, so it should do the trick.
4. I tweaked Manta, TR3, and Earthquake. They all flip in different ways.
5. You can now use a laptop trackpad in the botlab. Woohoo! Building robots on the work computer! :)
I still have more tweaking and balancing to do, but hopefully should be able to push something out in the next 24 hours...
Lots of fixes coming here shortly:Honestly, you couldve buffed up the hp multiplier for stuff by 400%
1. Parts don't come off until they receive about 20 times as much damage. Before they fall off, they propagate damage up to their parent component. This means that if you keep hitting the same spot you will eventually damage the chassis.
So up until now, material selection hasn’t affected damage resistance. I’m starting to address that in the next build. The 1 mm thick UHMW on Holy Wings flipper is not going to last long though. 😊Most of people use 1mm armour on flippers, niw that there is actual damage and durability mechanism, people will be smarter
Played it: here is the feedback
1. Flipper motors are still broken, they flip and break off
2. Music is added back, and i cant mute it
3. Worst one, you either get one hit KO'ed or do a one Hit KO
Okay so I just tried this out and just from the first few minutes I have this feedback:
- Manta's flipper is really havok-y. It manages one or two flips that yeet me right into the ceiling, and then it spends the rest of the fight propelling itself around the arena at warp-speed while its flipper panel glitches into another dimension. I've had the same issue with Goodbye Kiss's axe in the past, dunno if that helps at all. Earthquake's flipper doesn't close properly, preventing it from firing more than once or twice. TR3's flipper seems to work fine.
- None of my robots' weapons work anymore. I get that you can now choose which button fires them, but the dropdown just says "Button1", "Button2" etc, with no clue as to what those buttons actually are. Is it possible that you added controller compatibility for Bugglebots, but broke keyboard compatibility in the process?
- Bots still seem too fragile. I thought this might have been just Fait Accompli and its 3mm steel, which is the bare minimum for a real-life HW, but then I noticed that sometimes, I'll start taking massive damage while just driving normally, without my opponent anywhere near me. I can only imagine that my robot is somehow rubbing against the floor, and the game is interpreting that as damage. Ignoring the fact that a 6WD robot like Fait Accompli shouldn't be touching the floor with anything but its wheels in the first place, this should not be enough to kill you in two seconds.
1. Re: Manta - Oof. I struggled with Manta for about three hours on Tuesday night. In the game, pneumatics use a plunger system that pushes on the lifting arm to cause it to raise. In Manta's case, the plunger is really far back, which means that the physics engine can do wonky things as the plunger penetrates the flipper arm and the physics engine computes the impulse required to resolve the collision. I thought I had it working well, but you aren't the first one to report that it is broken.I think Manta's flipper has been broken for a while tbh, I managed to make it glitch out at least once in the previous build.
Back to the drawing (tweaking) board...
2. Re: Unworking weapons - There is still a bug that I haven't found that sometimes prevents button inputs from being read. This is an intermittent problem. My workaround has been to go back to the Robot Selection screen and start over. For me starting over fixes it about 70% of the time. I definitely need to track this down, but each time I think I have solved it, it pops up again.I'll try that. I assume Button1 is Space, then?
3. Re: Driving damage - You are absolutely right. Driving normally shouldn't damage a robot. Somehow or another something is registering a collision with a ton of impulse. Would you mind sending me Fait Accompli? I would like to do some testing. I have a few things I have in mind to improve driving dynamics that might solve this problem as well.Yep, I'll send it over right away.
1. and 3. - I've been testing with Holy Wings versus a horizontal spinner. I have found that if you leave everything on Holy Wings at 1 mm UHMW, the heavy spinning bar will indeed one-hit destroy any UHMW that it touches. This is fairly realistic. 1 mm UHMW is like protecting your robot with cardboard against a big spinner. If you armor everything with about 5 mm of steel, however, Holy Wings survives a lot longer.Problem is that the bots i was fighting had Steel armour. This OHKO also tends to happen to prebuilt bots
The biggest problem I am finding now is that the motors don't have enough torque to lift the flipper arms fast enough to work as flippers against another heavyweight. Now that all of the UHMW has been replaced by thicker steel armor,Make Servo motors that have high torque?
Holy Wings is just a wedge that can wave "hi!" with its flipper arms. I'm not sure how the bigger AmpFlow PMDC motors would work as flippers in real life either. To my knowledge people tend to use pneumatics for heavyweight flippers.Well tbh that is old wings, it does not use a hinged actuator for flipping
I think Manta's flipper has been broken for a while tbh, I managed to make it glitch out at least once in the previous build.
I'll try that. I assume Button1 is Space, then?
Yep, I'll send it over right away.
Problem is that the bots i was fighting had Steel armour. This OHKO also tends to happen to prebuilt bots
Make Servo motors that have high torque?
As for the flipper arms, i have been using Hinged actuators which are op
Well tbh that is old wings, it does not use a hinged actuator for flipping
Another oddity that i find is that when keys are binded, it keeps the control (lets say space), but if i rebind it again, the old imput key (space) will stay written while the new key will be functional
Also Metals have this odd Blue-ish tint where tint RGB is set on all to 1
AAAAAAlso like it how lightweight bots have great driving, but HW bots tend to bounce, 4wd ones atleast
Did my PM get through to you? The first time I tried, I got a "there's already a file with this name" error, and the second time I tried, I got a "you've already sent this PM" error. And GTM annoyingly doesn't save messages to your outbox by default, so I don't know whether either of them actually got sent.
Lighting probably? Either that or post-processing. They both could be contributing to an excess of blue. I'm pretty sure the texture is grayscale.Its throughout the whole game, so it might be post processing, UHMW is white tho
My current hypothesis on the whole Instant KO thing is that everything is treated like a part of the chassis. Most of the time when I lose a bot, it's because it got hit in the wheel or a thin weapon support.
I guess at the moment, everyone has RA2 logic in their head where if it isn't a part of the main chassis, it won't damage the bot when hit.
My current hypothesis on the whole Instant KO thing is that everything is treated like a part of the chassis. Most of the time when I lose a bot, it's because it got hit in the wheel or a thin weapon support.
I guess at the moment, everyone has RA2 logic in their head where if it isn't a part of the main chassis, it won't damage the bot when hit.
My assumption is that it being all chained to the chassis ripples in. Killing the chassis
Lighting probably? Either that or post-processing. They both could be contributing to an excess of blue. I'm pretty sure the texture is grayscale.Its throughout the whole game, so it might be post processing, UHMW is white tho
Also any chances to use an option to disable post processing? I have a feeling that that might be the culprit to the lag on lower end machines
As for driving, Just remove friction for now
Did my PM get through to you?
Oh, so the weapon actually did work, it was just too heavy for the motor? Well gee, now I feel stupid :facepalm: I did actually run another test with Defcon and its weapon worked just fine (it even gyros now!), so I guess that was all that was wrong. I'll try your suggested weights, and also see what happens if I put a counterweight on the other end.Did my PM get through to you?
I just tried out Fait Accompli and fixed the concussion damage issue when the robot is driving around. It turns out that I had set the minimum impulse limit ridiculously low such that pretty much every heavyweight would damage itself just by driving.
I also noticed that the axe didn't move when triggered. I tried dropping the thickness of the steel used. That did the trick. Here are my settings:
Axe head (pyramid) - 6 mm steel - 0.481 kg
Axe shaft (cube) - 3 mm steel - 0.637 kg
Now to see what it does to other robots...
I'll try your suggested weights, and also see what happens if I put a counterweight on the other end.
Glad you've got the driving issue sorted out, though!
I lowered the weight of the axe and it still didn't swing in the test area... then I switched the motor's activation button to Button 2 and then back to Button 1, and it worked perfectly. I think what might actually be happening is, where I've ported my bots over from the previous version, there's some sort of compatibility issue and it doesn't know what key should activate the robot's weapon until I go into the bot lab and tell it.I'll try your suggested weights, and also see what happens if I put a counterweight on the other end.
Glad you've got the driving issue sorted out, though!
Thanks!
I also have a sneaking suspicion that when I tell the physics system to give me a certain number of Newton-meters of torque, the system isn't giving me that much torque. I'll have to set up a test rig in Unity to see for sure. I feel like the motor you are using should be able to swing that axe head around in real life.
FWIW I have a 6" diameter motor in the works for weapons, similar to the old E-teks. I'm not sure how it would work for an axebot, but it should be killer for spinners.
Another fun discovery: attacking pieces that have fallen off a robot still deal damage.
Another fun discovery: attacking pieces that have fallen off a robot still deal damage.
To the robot the piece fell off from?! That is completely unintended and hilarious. :)
Another fun discovery: attacking pieces that have fallen off a robot still deal damage.
To the robot the piece fell off from?! That is completely unintended and hilarious. :)
Unless this is the next meta game :really_makes_you_think: heck
Is there anyone here who has judged a robot combat event? We just had our post-Bugglebots debrief and we were talking about how to do scoring in game.
Damage - Already done, we just need to display it
Aggression - Compute dot product of velocity vector and normalized displacement to other robot. The result should give the amount of time that a robot is driving toward its opponent.
Control - ???
How does one measure "control"? This one is super-duper subjective. Any thoughts?
@Hoppin, what exactly is giving you problems with scaling?
I can look into it if you can give me more details.
You are able to adjust the grid size on the left hand side.@Hoppin, what exactly is giving you problems with scaling?
I can look into it if you can give me more details.
Yea, absolutely.
Given how small the BWs tend to be to build. I've found the grid lacks the support for these small sizes. Often rounding up to the nearest number. It results in it being really difficult imo to make detailed and accurate bots. This, on top of the lack of wheel & battery support makes building at the weightclass really awkward and overall lacking
If you choose to judge controll by tge time wheels have touched the ground keep in mind that there are walkers also no wheels at all. Also bots like pussycat have wheels not touching the ground on purpose
Idk what to feel about the in built JD system in game tbh
I think I still prefer the one where people made it themself as on any other robot combat game before RR2. Also for aggression, is it basically tied with control, or will you take other factor into consideration, like the controlled bot trying to force itself against the opponent even if being controlled, or trying to use their weapon, like bringing down their saw into the opponent?
Judges decision
Should we have a BOTM for rr2?
I would 100% agree with you on that. It can make matches more competitive throughout, and if you don't agree with the decision that the Com made, you can always just ignore it.Judges decision
Ah! Thanks!
I think we need a scoring system for 2 primary reasons:
1. It is a way to build tension and excitement as you see one robot pulling ahead of another.
2. In single player or AI vs AI games, it is needed to determine the outcome of non-KO fights.
For me, the best part of the original Robot Rumble was watching the pips move as someone went on a particularly long scoring run, upsetting the leader.
Should we have a BOTM for rr2?The current botm has RR2 as part of the Custom category.
I think the one thing missing - and I keep forgetting to bring this up - is some sort of "green-screen" function, so we can take screenshots of our robots in front of a blank background, like we can do in RA2. Once we have that, we can start making proper splashes for our RR2 builds.Should we have a BOTM for rr2?
Up to you guys. Do you feel like the game is mature enough?
That should definitely be something to add in the next build. I could see some cool stuff coming from that.I think the one thing missing - and I keep forgetting to bring this up - is some sort of "green-screen" function, so we can take screenshots of our robots in front of a blank background, like we can do in RA2. Once we have that, we can start making proper splashes for our RR2 builds.Should we have a BOTM for rr2?
Up to you guys. Do you feel like the game is mature enough?
Doesn't have to be anything fancy, could be just a "Greenscreen" toggle in the Bot Lab that replaces the workshop background with a solid colour.
I think the one thing missing - and I keep forgetting to bring this up - is some sort of "green-screen" function, so we can take screenshots of our robots in front of a blank background, like we can do in RA2. Once we have that, we can start making proper splashes for our RR2 builds.That should definitely be something to add in the next build. I could see some cool stuff coming from that.
Doesn't have to be anything fancy, could be just a "Greenscreen" toggle in the Bot Lab that replaces the workshop background with a solid colour.
Neat. Will you be able to customize the lenght of the belt or is it preset like in DSL?
Nice! A new build incoming! That belt drive should make it a lot easier to build spinners than it currently is. Any other changes we can look forward to?
Not gonna lie, I was really hoping for some sort of belt drive and you guys have more than delivered once again! Cannot wait for the next build!
Out of curiosity - can the pulley system be 'doubled up' to potentially create two shafts powered by one motor? (For example, two wheels powered by the one motor)
Its a little impractical, but is something like this what you had in mind?
Its a little impractical, but is something like this what you had in mind?
Not quite... I was thinking more along the lines of how a lot of four wheel drive robots work, with two motors connected to two sets of belt systems, in turn powering four wheels in parallels of two. (I could draw up a quick diagram if that helps??)
I love seeing what you did there though! It's gonna be perfect for drum spinners and dual vertical spinners!
Would like something like this
(https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/486231999548358681/596833925804982295/unknown.png)
Illustration 100 fellas
Would like something like this
(https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/486231999548358681/596833925804982295/unknown.png)
Illustration 100 fellas
I’ll give it a shot tonight. :smile:
Would like something like this
(https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/486231999548358681/596833925804982295/unknown.png)
Illustration 100 fellas
I’ll give it a shot tonight. :smile:
I just thought about it a little more, and it looks like you are looking for a crown gear or bevel gear. No way to do that, and we hadn’t really planned on it...
yeah, as current motors are not Hori spinner friendlyWould like something like this
(https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/486231999548358681/596833925804982295/unknown.png)
Illustration 100 fellas
I’ll give it a shot tonight. :smile:
I just thought about it a little more, and it looks like you are looking for a crown gear or bevel gear. No way to do that, and we hadn’t really planned on it...
You might be able to accomplish the same space-saving effect with a pancake motor though. We can pretty easily put a flatter motor in the game.
yeah, as current motors are not Hori spinner friendlyWould like something like this
(https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/486231999548358681/596833925804982295/unknown.png)
Illustration 100 fellas
I’ll give it a shot tonight. :smile:
I just thought about it a little more, and it looks like you are looking for a crown gear or bevel gear. No way to do that, and we hadn’t really planned on it...
You might be able to accomplish the same space-saving effect with a pancake motor though. We can pretty easily put a flatter motor in the game.
Anyone have any preference for weapon motors? I am looking at something Etek-compatible currently. At a minimum I should be able to come up with a mock-up of the right dimensions, weight, and motor characteristics.Just a nice variety of shapes, sizes, and power levels, rather than the two (plus BW motor) that we have currently. Etek and pancake motors would be nice, maybe also an R-shaped one like the TWM3R in DSL. NPCs, too, maybe?
Arent LEM motors thin and wide? Idk if they are drive motors thoIIRC, they're about the same diameter as an Etek, but slightly thinner. Storm 2 used LEMs as drive motors at one point, but they're heavy enough that you'd need WhammetNuht's system of "one motor powering two/three wheels" for them to be practical in an RR2 rammer.
Just looked up lems. I thought they were actually huge, but i see they have variety. NiceArent LEM motors thin and wide? Idk if they are drive motors thoIIRC, they're about the same diameter as an Etek, but slightly thinner. Storm 2 used LEMs as drive motors at one point, but they're heavy enough that you'd need WhammetNuht's system of "one motor powering two/three wheels" for them to be practical in an RR2 rammer.
Just a nice variety of shapes, sizes, and power levels, rather than the two (plus BW motor) that we have currently. Etek and pancake motors would be nice, maybe also an R-shaped one like the TWM3R in DSL. NPCs, too, maybe?
Also, just a small thing, but would it be possible to put the motors' performance stats (like horsepower and torque) in their descriptions? Or are you going to wait until their stats have been finalised before doing something like that?
Oooh, that'd be handy. We'd potentially then be able to set tip speed limits for tournaments, like Extreme Robots and (IIRC) Battlebots have. Might help balance out the meta a bit. How would you differentiate between weapon motors and drive motors for those meters, though?
Just a nice variety of shapes, sizes, and power levels, rather than the two (plus BW motor) that we have currently. Etek and pancake motors would be nice, maybe also an R-shaped one like the TWM3R in DSL. NPCs, too, maybe?
Also, just a small thing, but would it be possible to put the motors' performance stats (like horsepower and torque) in their descriptions? Or are you going to wait until their stats have been finalised before doing something like that?
Will do.
You are correct about the reason for not putting specs in the description. Up until now I have been fudging numbers all over the place to get everything to work. Now that the spinner blur is functional, it is possible to simulate real-life speeds. A motor spins a bar at 3000 RPM? No problem. The question now becomes which specs to include. Do we got full on simulation, with Kv values, or do we just do something simple like power at rated voltage? What about torque? Weapon tip speed at full spin-up? Kinetic energy?
Maybe there is a kinetic energy, RPM, and tip speed meter in the test cage that allows you to see the numbers as you spin up, just like you would have when bench-testing a real robot?
Maybe there is a kinetic energy, RPM, and tip speed meter in the test cage that allows you to see the numbers as you spin up, just like you would have when bench-testing a real robot?Oooh, that'd be handy. We'd potentially then be able to set tip speed limits for tournaments, like Extreme Robots and (IIRC) Battlebots have. Might help balance out the meta a bit. How would you differentiate between weapon motors and drive motors for those meters, though?
Maybe there is a kinetic energy, RPM, and tip speed meter in the test cage that allows you to see the numbers as you spin up, just like you would have when bench-testing a real robot?Oooh, that'd be handy. We'd potentially then be able to set tip speed limits for tournaments, like Extreme Robots and (IIRC) Battlebots have. Might help balance out the meta a bit. How would you differentiate between weapon motors and drive motors for those meters, though?
That’s on my list for Monday. I was thinking of adding a “wheel” tag to wheels so that it knows to not consider a wheel a weapon if the wheel is properly attached to the motor or pulley.
Hey guys. Another free public alpha is coming out by the beginning of next week. For this build:Hopefully the drive and damage isnt broken so i can continue with hosting stuff
1. Massive spinner update.
2. Pulleys.
3. Flippers.
We have reworked physics so that everything is energy-based. As shown in the GIF above, you can get a handy realtime readout of your spinner’s energy in the test cage. This should be handy if you are using the game to prototype designs for your real-life robots. My plan is to use energy for damage too, but I’m not sure if that will be ready for this build.
Not shown in the GIF: The theoretical maximum kinetic energy for a spinner will be displayed too, if you want to design a tournament with energy limits. It is also handy to see how much your design is losing to friction.
Hopefully the drive and damage isnt broken so i can continue with hosting stuff
Ok, I'm not very good at posting images
Well... now I know, what I will do the next few weeks :mrgreen:Hopefully the drive and damage isnt broken so i can continue with hosting stuff
I'll do my best.
Drive: Reworking spinners required reworking drive as well. Unity physics doesn't like it when you throw big heavy masses around at anything more than a few hundred RPM. Spinners can now go 8,000+ RPM, so I had to adjust the dynamics so that Unity stays happy. I didn't have to go completely back to the drawing board with drive, but drive required a TON of tweaks. Hopefully it is pretty close to where it needs to be.
Damage: I haven't addressed damage yet. I'm hoping to do that over the next few days. My goal this fall is to completely rethink how damage is done, moving away from hit points to a more realistic system of ripping, puncturing, and breaking. If you tap a motor with a high energy spinner, that motor should break. The idea is that you protect your motors with armor that someone needs to break off / puncture to get to the sensitive bits inside.
Update: I'm working on spinner "bite" right now. The idea is that if you make something that spins too fast and/or come at an opponent too slowly, the spinner won't get any bite, and it will just bounce of the opponent instead without releasing much kinetic energy.
This game is so cool! It is like RA3, but every mistake has been fixed. (those were a lot of mistakes)
It would be cool to have an option, where you can turn a spinner down. This will be very useful, if you want to build replicas.what do you mean by that
Spinner air drag is now a thing. Air drag is computed based on the speed and geometry of the spinner. It is really hard to make a big spinner go super fast now.Ah so deep six clones are gonna be a hassle to make
Spinner air drag is now a thing. Air drag is computed based on the speed and geometry of the spinner. It is really hard to make a big spinner go super fast now.Ah so deep six clones are gonna be a hassle to make
I noticed you’ve included flippers in the next build. Out of interest - is the same damage physics rules that’s been built for the spinners going to apply to flippers? (E.g, the kinetic force from both being launched and hitting the ground at greater speeds = more damage?). I feel like that’s something which RA2 was definitely missing, hence why the only real competitive ‘flippers’ where the pop-ups.
Cannot wait for the new build!!!
What I mean is, that it would be cool to say: This spinner is not allowed to spin faster than 2000 rpm. I just noticed, that this will be possible to do by changing the pulley gear ratio.It would be cool to have an option, where you can turn a spinner down. This will be very useful, if you want to build replicas.what do you mean by that
What I mean is, that it would be cool to say: This spinner is not allowed to spin faster than 2000 rpm. I just noticed, that this will be possible to do by changing the pulley gear ratio.It would be cool to have an option, where you can turn a spinner down. This will be very useful, if you want to build replicas.what do you mean by that
CALLING ALL ENGINEERS!Sorry, I have no Idea, but I thought, that you were doing some stuff with the TR2 team and team Shock. Maybe they can help.
I'm looking for data on the following:
1. Energy required to puncture different thicknesses of common armor materials: UHMW, Polycarbonate, 6061-T6 aluminum, mild steel, hardened steel, titanium. Am I missing any? We are looking to cover beetleweights, featherweights, lightweights, and heavyweights.
2. Rated speed (based on motor kV) vs measured speed of bar spinners, drum spinners.
If you have access to equipment to do some testing, or know of good resources for the above, please post them here!
PS - Do we have any Robot Wars/Robogames/Battlebots competitors in the crowd? It would be nice to get some real-world quantitative and qualitative data from the heavier weight classes.
Somebody (his gtm name) is the guy who made HUGE
2. Rated speed (based on motor kV) vs measured speed of bar spinners, drum spinners.
2. Rated speed (based on motor kV) vs measured speed of bar spinners, drum spinners.
not sure if this is what you're looking for but its got a lot of useful info on it and is really easy to use
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Great!!! :claping :claping :claping will it already be in the upcoming build?
Oh, cool! I guess just a flat cylinder would be ok, too. Will the new House robot, you showed off be in the game?Great!!! :claping :claping :claping will it already be in the upcoming build?
Hopefully. If not the actual 3D model, at least a cylinder of the appropriate dimensions that you can hook up and power stuff. We are working on the full 3D model now, but the full visual representation might need to wait until the next build.
Oh, cool! I guess just a flat cylinder would be ok, too. Will the new House robot, you showed off be in the game?Great!!! :claping :claping :claping will it already be in the upcoming build?
Hopefully. If not the actual 3D model, at least a cylinder of the appropriate dimensions that you can hook up and power stuff. We are working on the full 3D model now, but the full visual representation might need to wait until the next build.
[ You are not allowed to view attachments ]That looks very detailed :mrgreen:
Hot off the griddle!
This one is going to have some serious power.
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Hot off the griddle!
This one is going to have some serious power.
Can wait for new update, so i can break it
400KJ ? Ray Billings would be proud lmao, i dread to imagine how horribly slow spinup must be
i'll try to make it not look too bad lol
i know Tombstone's theorical max is around 100KJ, so that's a base to have for what would be the reasonable max energy you can reach
Liking the new build. Flippers fall off still tho
Love the build! Bubblegum seems to spasm at the beginning of every match however. It spins whilst seemingly hitting the floor and then just explodes. Any ideas why?
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Just started and already like it. First issue though is for some reason the game likes to "censor" spinning weapons.
Second and unrelated issue. If nothing is mounted to a motor and you go to the test Lab, you get a couple dozen air miles.
Otherwise, I like what you're doing with the music and the botlab. Things are looking nice.
Great build :mrgreen: .I like, what you have done to the botlab! But I have some issues with the spinners. In the test area it always sais, that the mass of the weapon is 5 kg. I also wanted to hit the toggle DB and it brought me back to the menu.
The flippers work very well! I didn't have any issues so far.same i dont know why people are complaining
The flippers work very well! I didn't have any issues so far.same i dont know why people are complaining
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My robot keeps dancing on it's back :laughing
The flippers work very well! I didn't have any issues so far.same i dont know why people are complaining
Maybe a problem just with older robots?
Nvidia GeForce GTX 1050 Ti[ You are not allowed to view attachments ]
Just started and already like it. First issue though is for some reason the game likes to "censor" spinning weapons.
Uh oh. That looks like a problem with the shader that I'm not seeing on my end that might be hardware related. What graphics card are you using?
I'm currently on vacation, so I have to wait until next Friday. :rage Looks awesome tho! Two Quick questions; is there a torque motor? And when will there be a Bot exchange on GTM, like RA2 has?
haven't figured out yet how to make a hard hitting spinner yet lol, also flippers seem to clip into other robots on firing
Looking at Kix's vid, I love the new lighting effects in the arena, but are the turntables in the menu screens supposed to spin that fast? I'm sure they were a lot slower in the previous builds.
Also unlimited hinge hp when? Im not feeling safe to host it as flippers tend to fall off after 10 ish-hits
Cant mute audio too
I know that stuff needs to be balanced, but currently, hosting is a no-go for flippersAlso unlimited hinge hp when? Im not feeling safe to host it as flippers tend to fall off after 10 ish-hits
Cant mute audio too
I'll let Chris answer on the timeframe, but all parts need a lot of balancing and tweaking still.
What audio are you unable to mute?
I can’t promise anything extravagant at this point. What do you think about just disabling the ability of flippers to break off? They should still be able to propagate damage inward to the chassis.
I can’t promise anything