Poll

What do you like doing most in RA2/RA3/robot combat games?

Building robots
Local single player battles with manually-controlled robots
Local multiplayer battles  with manually-controlled robots (PvP with controllers or a shared keyboard)
AI-only tournament battles
Other?  Please comment below.

Author Topic: Robot Rumble 2.0 - Robot Combat Simulator - Under Development  (Read 187962 times)

Offline kix

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Re: Robot Rumble 2.0 - Robot Combat Simulator - Under Development
« Reply #1420 on: January 10, 2020, 04:02:30 PM »
New bleeding edge build is coming out tomorrow.  I have added sliders to adjust the following:

Physics Tick Rate (100 - 500 ticks per second)
Physics Default Solver Velocity Iterations
Physics Default Iterations

I might try adding a few more sliders to see if we can figure out a fix to the jittering problem.  I have noticed that if I increase the physics tick rate to 300 I the jittering in Beta seems to become a smooth oscillation back and forth.  It just about doubles the time spent in physics per frame though.  My baby laptop CPU is getting HOT.
Thats weird. The fix might not be that? What if the wheels have too much grip or something which cause it to jump?

500? OOOH i also want to see that
« Last Edit: January 10, 2020, 04:47:11 PM by kix »

Offline CodeSilver23

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Re: Robot Rumble 2.0 - Robot Combat Simulator - Under Development
« Reply #1421 on: January 10, 2020, 04:23:09 PM »
What if we had 2 versions for RR2? One that is for High end Desktops and one for laptops?
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Offline cjbruce

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Re: Robot Rumble 2.0 - Robot Combat Simulator - Under Development
« Reply #1422 on: January 10, 2020, 05:24:39 PM »
I just put up a bleeding edge build called "10.5January2020".  These have the new physics sliders.  Please note that today's previous build was called "10January2020".

kix, go nuts! :)

http://www.robot-rumble.com/bleedingedgebuilds/

PS - Except for the bumpiness with Beta, I'm kind of liking the fact that I can run the game at 100 ticks/second on my laptop.  Once I get AI Miniscript under control, this should mean that people with really old computers have a shot at being able to run the game with graphics turned way down.

Offline kix

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Re: Robot Rumble 2.0 - Robot Combat Simulator - Under Development
« Reply #1423 on: January 10, 2020, 05:58:52 PM »
Tested the build with 500tick and boy is it amazing. However
You can see some issues in the vid:

Its still a massive improvement

EDIT: What do the other 2 sliders do on the right?
PS. The smooth oscillation is actually just beta having lwered wheels for previous builds
« Last Edit: January 10, 2020, 06:19:49 PM by kix »

Offline BATTLEMASTER

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Re: Robot Rumble 2.0 - Robot Combat Simulator - Under Development
« Reply #1424 on: January 10, 2020, 07:15:51 PM »
At 500 ticks/sec, the jitter doesn't exist.  The jitter barely exists at 450 ticks, and only occurred for about half a second after I kicked the third (out of 4) wheels off my opponent.  At 400 ticks, the jitter comes back at full force after losing a wheel.  Note that this never happens after my opponent loses its drum spinner.  At 425 ticks, the jitter from losing one wheel goes away.

I'm running the other physics settings at 50%.  When the jitter occurred, I tried tweaking those but they didn't seem to make a difference at all.  It was the tick setting at 425 that seemed to make the jitter stop.

EDIT:  It appears I was wrong about the 425 ticks.  I still had an instance of jitter knocking a wheel off, but the chance of it happening seems significantly reduced.
« Last Edit: January 10, 2020, 08:42:03 PM by BATTLEMASTER »

Offline cjbruce

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Re: Robot Rumble 2.0 - Robot Combat Simulator - Under Development
« Reply #1425 on: January 11, 2020, 08:36:56 AM »
Yup.  You guys are right.  There was a bug in the breakage code. 

When all of the parts connected to a spinner (a.k.a. a single wheel) are broken off, it was supposed to set the remaining mass (a.k.a. just the axle) to have a mass of something just higher than zero.  Instead it was setting the remaining mass to be equal to the original mass.   This meant that the robot would shake and wobble like crazy when everything was broken off other than the axle itself.

New build coming soon...

Offline kix

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Re: Robot Rumble 2.0 - Robot Combat Simulator - Under Development
« Reply #1426 on: January 11, 2020, 08:43:00 AM »
Yup.  You guys are right.  There was a bug in the breakage code. 

When all of the parts connected to a spinner (a.k.a. a single wheel) are broken off, it was supposed to set the remaining mass (a.k.a. just the axle) to have a mass of something just higher than zero.  Instead it was setting the remaining mass to be equal to the original mass.   This meant that the robot would shake and wobble like crazy when everything was broken off other than the axle itself.

New build coming soon...
Nice, how about the 500 tick lagging like crazy on certailn bots, even tho the cpu usage was not full?

Offline CodeSilver23

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Re: Robot Rumble 2.0 - Robot Combat Simulator - Under Development
« Reply #1427 on: January 11, 2020, 09:15:28 AM »
Yup.  You guys are right.  There was a bug in the breakage code. 

When all of the parts connected to a spinner (a.k.a. a single wheel) are broken off, it was supposed to set the remaining mass (a.k.a. just the axle) to have a mass of something just higher than zero.  Instead it was setting the remaining mass to be equal to the original mass.   This meant that the robot would shake and wobble like crazy when everything was broken off other than the axle itself.

New build coming soon...
Nice, how about the 500 tick lagging like crazy on certailn bots, even tho the cpu usage was not full?
I watched the video, and it looks like it was only when you were in the fire pit.
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Offline kix

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Re: Robot Rumble 2.0 - Robot Combat Simulator - Under Development
« Reply #1428 on: January 11, 2020, 09:22:45 AM »
Yup.  You guys are right.  There was a bug in the breakage code. 

When all of the parts connected to a spinner (a.k.a. a single wheel) are broken off, it was supposed to set the remaining mass (a.k.a. just the axle) to have a mass of something just higher than zero.  Instead it was setting the remaining mass to be equal to the original mass.   This meant that the robot would shake and wobble like crazy when everything was broken off other than the axle itself.

New build coming soon...
Nice, how about the 500 tick lagging like crazy on certain bots, even tho the cpu usage was not full?
I watched the video, and it looks like it was only when you were in the fire pit.
It aint the flame pit. Its the bot im certain

Offline cjbruce

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Re: Robot Rumble 2.0 - Robot Combat Simulator - Under Development
« Reply #1429 on: January 11, 2020, 09:25:56 AM »
New bleeding edge build is up.  11January2020.  This one fixes the bug where the mass of the remaining axle on broken off components is way too big:

http://www.robot-rumble.com/bleedingedgebuilds/

Offline cjbruce

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Re: Robot Rumble 2.0 - Robot Combat Simulator - Under Development
« Reply #1430 on: January 11, 2020, 10:48:58 AM »
Rainbow Circus is unplayable on my computer, even at 100 ticks per second.  I need to look into why that is.  I suspect it is because of a large number of moving colliders.

Edit:  That’s the main reason I want to get the component modding tool working.  It is the easiest way to reduce the number of physics colliders for complex parts.

Offline Team Lightning

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Re: Robot Rumble 2.0 - Robot Combat Simulator - Under Development
« Reply #1431 on: January 11, 2020, 10:50:27 AM »
When I ripped a wheel off in the 11January build, the bot still gyrodances around.
EDIT: The rolling pin doesn't even rotate with my settings, so that fixes the annoying clanking.
EDIT 2: Can you send me Rainbow Circus? I have a VERY powerful laptop I would like to try it on.

Offline cjbruce

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Re: Robot Rumble 2.0 - Robot Combat Simulator - Under Development
« Reply #1432 on: January 11, 2020, 11:12:54 AM »
When I ripped a wheel off in the 11January build, the bot still gyrodances around.
EDIT: The rolling pin doesn't even rotate with my settings, so that fixes the annoying clanking.
EDIT 2: Can you send me Rainbow Circus? I have a VERY powerful laptop I would like to try it on.

Darn it!  Something is going wrong to cause the gyro dancing but I’m not sure what.

Lightning, I will trade you Rainbow Circus for the robot with the gyro dancing!  :smile:

I’m not in front of my computer right now, but will send it when I get back.

As far as the roller noise goes, it should be an easy fix, but I wanted to check with Callum first before I start messing with anything audio related.  He’s the audio guru.

Offline Team Lightning

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Re: Robot Rumble 2.0 - Robot Combat Simulator - Under Development
« Reply #1433 on: January 11, 2020, 11:15:21 AM »
Any robot with premade wheels does it. I think when a part is broken off of a motor, the motor should stop functioning. That might fix it.

Offline kix

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Re: Robot Rumble 2.0 - Robot Combat Simulator - Under Development
« Reply #1434 on: January 11, 2020, 11:17:37 AM »
Maybe also add a group function for currently built bots that use ingame components, because cmt is gonna mean that bots should be rebuilt

Offline Team Lightning

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Re: Robot Rumble 2.0 - Robot Combat Simulator - Under Development
« Reply #1435 on: January 11, 2020, 11:19:01 AM »

Maybe also add a group function for currently built bots that use ingame components, because cmt is gonna mean that bots should be rebuilt
CMT????? What is that?

Lightning, I will trade you Rainbow Circus for the robot with the gyro dancing!  :smile:

If you look at my showcase, Takedown does the weird gyro thing. I include a download link on my showcase for the bots I post.

Offline cjbruce

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Re: Robot Rumble 2.0 - Robot Combat Simulator - Under Development
« Reply #1436 on: January 11, 2020, 01:54:33 PM »
I did a little performance testing for 3 robots using the Unity profiler.  The times shown here are only significant insofar as they are relative to each other.

The complexity of the robot is almost directly proportional to the time spent in physics processing.

Rainbow Circus 2 is a shell spinner with 125 components.  It is pretty much unplayable on my laptop.  kix saw significant slowdowns on this robot on his computer, particularly as it passed through the flame pit and all of the colliders triggered collisions with the flame trigger volume.

Mental Breakdown is a simple vertical spinner with 32 components.  It runs well on my laptop at 100 ticks/second.  It slows down, but is still playable at 300 ticks/second.

HUGE Spinny is a "Tombclone" with 18 components.  It also runs well on my laptop, slightly better than Mental Breakdown.


Rainbow Circus 2 has about 7x the part count, and spends about 10x the amount of time spent in the CPU compared to HUGE Spinny.

In order to make cool-looking robots we need to figure out a more efficient way to create visual complexity than simply adding components.  The simplest way to do this is to get the RR2 Component Modding Tool (CMT???) up and running.  This will allow you to create something really cool-looking in Blender, then pull it into Unity and have Unity create a single mesh collider for it.  With such a tool in place we could reduce the number of colliders in Rainbow Circus 2's shell from 109 down to 1.  I expect that this would reduce physics frame time by 90%.



Offline cjbruce

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Re: Robot Rumble 2.0 - Robot Combat Simulator - Under Development
« Reply #1437 on: January 11, 2020, 01:59:17 PM »

EDIT: What do the other 2 sliders do on the right?
PS. The smooth oscillation is actually just beta having lwered wheels for previous builds

I saw this entry in the Unity manual regarding these values, and figured it was worth playing with them to see if they would reduce jittering:

https://docs.unity3d.com/ScriptReference/Physics-defaultSolverVelocityIterations.html

Offline kix

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Re: Robot Rumble 2.0 - Robot Combat Simulator - Under Development
« Reply #1438 on: January 11, 2020, 02:03:07 PM »
I did a little performance testing for 3 robots using the Unity profiler.  The times shown here are only significant insofar as they are relative to each other.

The complexity of the robot is almost directly proportional to the time spent in physics processing.

Rainbow Circus 2 is a shell spinner with 125 components.  It is pretty much unplayable on my laptop.  kix saw significant slowdowns on this robot on his computer, particularly as it passed through the flame pit and all of the colliders triggered collisions with the flame trigger volume.

Mental Breakdown is a simple vertical spinner with 32 components.  It runs well on my laptop at 100 ticks/second.  It slows down, but is still playable at 300 ticks/second.

HUGE Spinny is a "Tombclone" with 18 components.  It also runs well on my laptop, slightly better than Mental Breakdown.


Rainbow Circus 2 has about 7x the part count, and spends about 10x the amount of time spent in the CPU compared to HUGE Spinny.

In order to make cool-looking robots we need to figure out a more efficient way to create visual complexity than simply adding components.  The simplest way to do this is to get the RR2 Component Modding Tool (CMT???) up and running.  This will allow you to create something really cool-looking in Blender, then pull it into Unity and have Unity create a single mesh collider for it.  With such a tool in place we could reduce the number of colliders in Rainbow Circus 2's shell from 109 down to 1.  I expect that this would reduce physics frame time by 90%.


(Image removed from quote.)

Problem with the tool is that personally i wouldn't allow custom components for my tournament. Unless there is a way to block it. Someone could enter a bit with low weight and extremely high hp count

Offline cjbruce

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Re: Robot Rumble 2.0 - Robot Combat Simulator - Under Development
« Reply #1439 on: January 11, 2020, 02:07:29 PM »

Problem with the tool is that personally i wouldn't allow custom components for my tournament. Unless there is a way to block it. Someone could enter a bit with low weight and extremely high hp count

I was thinking that you would set a material and the tool would automatically compute the weight and hp upon creation.