Messages

61

Robot Rumble 2.0 / Re: Robot Rumble 2.0 - Robot Combat Simulator - Under Development

« on: May 23, 2020, 06:13:28 AM »

Another issue is, 2WD vertical spinners could barely turn, it's like something's stuck with the floor and make it hard to drive.
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bots here.
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Edit: Like what kix said, the spinner bite is supposed to be an issue. Especially disc spinners act like there was no teeth on it.

Thanks for checking the bite issue.  That is something that will definitely need tweaking.

Afterbite is a little slow to turn, but I think that is because of the gyroscopic effect occurring with the spinner at 3500+ RPM. I geared it down a little bit and it was a little easier.  It might be worth sending the robot to Will Thomas to see what he thinks.  It is tunable, but I want to be really careful about tuning at this point.

I agree that DIRE is sluggish.  I suspect it is because of all of the weight so far forward from the wheelbase.  I tried sticking two ball casters under the front of the chassis.  I'm not sure it helped.  I also noticed that you are running DIRE's weapon with a 0.5:1 gear ratio.  This is low and is leading to long spinup times and a weapon that spins way too fast.  It has a tremendous amount of angular momentum making it difficult to turn because of gyroscopic effect.

62

Robot Rumble 2.0 / Re: Robot Rumble 2.0 - Robot Combat Simulator - Under Development

« on: May 22, 2020, 05:18:16 PM »

yeah i know i'm just messing around with you. all his beetles/feathers including our new joint feather are all direct drive brushless, but for game purposes i think this is the right way to go about things :)

Speaking of real life, do you have any idea what is happening with Bugglebots this year?

63

Robot Rumble 2.0 / Re: Robot Rumble 2.0 - Robot Combat Simulator - Under Development

« on: May 22, 2020, 03:36:16 PM »

You guys are amazing!  Thank you!

I’ll try to get to the bugs as soon as I can.

Also, please attach the .RR2Bot file if you haven’t already.  I can’t really troubleshoot without it.

64

Robot Rumble 2.0 / Re: Robot Rumble 2.0 - Robot Combat Simulator - Under Development

« on: May 22, 2020, 10:39:10 AM »

yeah i know i'm just messing around with you. all his beetles/feathers including our new joint feather are all direct drive brushless, but for game purposes i think this is the right way to go about things :)

Phew! :)

I really want to support the insect classes.  There are so many builders out there who might be able to use the game to prototype their designs.

65

Robot Rumble 2.0 / Re: Robot Rumble 2.0 - Robot Combat Simulator - Under Development

« on: May 22, 2020, 09:56:02 AM »

ALL MOTORS MUST BE GEARED DOWN.

period.  full stop.  This is true for building in real-life too. 

a certain gareth barnaby would argue otherwise

You have to be really really careful about temperature if you do direct drive from a motor. 

I'm struggling with how to convey this to players.  I'm afraid that new players won't understand the relationship between gearing and heat buildup and they will get frustrated because their motors keep destroying themselves and the player won't know why.

There is nothing in the game to prevent people from running a drill motor at 44.1 volts.

66

Robot Rumble 2.0 / Re: Robot Rumble 2.0 - Robot Combat Simulator - Under Development

« on: May 22, 2020, 09:00:53 AM »

22-May is missing for windows btw.

EDIT: it is mislabeled as 02-May

Fixed!  It is now labeled as RR2-Windows-22May2020-BleedingEdgeTestBuild.zip

67

Robot Rumble 2.0 / Re: Robot Rumble 2.0 - Robot Combat Simulator - Under Development

« on: May 22, 2020, 08:57:11 AM »

you guys kick ass. if the pneumatics revamp is anything like this i'm sure you'll knock it out of the park. keep up the good work!

also mark joerger won robotica with a stripped out lawnmower and then proceeded to suck sh** at robot wars with said lawnmower. he also spends his free time complaining about modern combat robotics on facebook. not saying his info isn't valid, just that there's likely better sources than him for modern robot info

Mea culpa - you are correct.  My intent was to imply that he has a lot of technical knowledge in his website that he has graciously shared with the world.  I don't disagree with you about Mark's grumpiness.  Back in my college days "The Facebook" was a paper pamphlet that came out every year and all of us upperclassmen would read it and rate all of the incoming freshmen.  It was a truly horrible thing.  Facebook has only gone downhill since.  I have no idea what Mark posts there, but I try to avoid Facebook at all costs.  GTM is much better. :)

As far as I can tell Mark's advice is pretty solid for the insect classes.  Over the past few months I have been trying to push the game and myself into those weight classes.  I'm hoping to get a tiny robot into a local competition at some point in the next year.

EDIT: Thank you!  We are hoping to get it to the point where it just completely kick-ass as both a simulator and a game.

68

Robot Rumble 2.0 / Re: Robot Rumble 2.0 - Robot Combat Simulator - Under Development

« on: May 22, 2020, 07:33:56 AM »

The 22May2020 bleeding edge builds are up!  Here's the link:

http://www.robot-rumble.com/bleedingedgebuilds/

***Please note that this build is going to break a lot of your existing designs.  Please see my previous post for details.

69

Robot Rumble 2.0 / Re: Robot Rumble 2.0 - Robot Combat Simulator - Under Development

« on: May 22, 2020, 07:29:43 AM »

Hey guys,

We're putting up a new Bleeding Edge Build today.  This build has so many changes that I can't detail them all here, but here are the big ones:

1. Electronics and electrical components are now a thing.  In order to make a robot drive, you must include the following:

- A receiver.  Each channel of the receiver must be set to the appropriate type of control from your radio transmitter.  Left Drive, Right Drive, Single Throw Toggle, etc.
- At least one battery.  The battery voltage you pick is important.  If you choose too low of a voltage, your robot will be sluggish.  If you choose too high of a voltage, your motors will overheat and burn out.
- If you have a weapon, you will need either a second battery (usually at a higher voltage) or a battery hub (to save weight).  This hub will send power to your drive ESC (usually a 2x60 Amp ESC) and to your weapon ESC (either another brushed ESC or a brushless ESC, depending on the motor you choose).
- You will need enough ESCs to handle all of your motors.  ESCs are either single-channel or 2-channel.
- Motors.  Most robots nowadays use brushed ESCs for drive, but it is up to you.  Lighter motors heat up (and cool down) more quickly.

2. Motor overheating is now a thing.  You can see the status of your motors in the robot workshop test cage.  If your motor temp goes above 115 Celsius for more than 5 seconds, the motor windings will burn out.  To prevent this from happening motors must be geared down.  Let me repeat this so it is clear:

ALL MOTORS MUST BE GEARED DOWN.

period.  full stop.  This is true for building in real-life too.  These motors are powerful and they will rapidly destroy themselves if you run them at nominal voltage while clamping the rotor.

Unless you plan to run all of your motors at 3.7 volts, pretty much every motor in the game will overheat when you stall it out.  To prevent this, add a gearbox to reduce the current through the motor.

This is going to break lots of existing designs.  Sorry.

If you would like a more detailed explanation, I recommend checking out Mark Joerger's wonderful robot combat website at the following URL.  He's the builder of Run Amok, Robotica champion from long ago, and has been answering robot combat questions for decades:

http://runamok.tech/AskAaron.html

To get an idea of how much you will need to gear down your drive motors, please try the following online calculator:

http://runamok.tech/squid/newtorquecalc.htm

3. We have removed pneumatics and linear actuators from the robot workshop for now to give us time to focus on the electro-mechanical systems.  We will be building out pneumatics and linear actuators over the next few months behind the scenes.  Any existing pneumatics or linear actuators will work differently when we release them.

EDIT: Mark Joerger won Robotica, not Robot Wars.

70

Robot Rumble 2.0 / Re: Robot Rumble 2.0 - Robot Combat Simulator - Under Development

« on: May 02, 2020, 03:58:06 PM »

To the developer: I've got a quick question. Is it possible to import 3D models into Robot Rumble 2.0?

Not yet, but the Component Modding Tool is planned once we are comfortable with the Arena Modding Tool.

71

Robot Rumble 2.0 / Re: Robot Rumble 2.0 - Robot Combat Simulator - Under Development

« on: April 24, 2020, 07:51:07 PM »

I find myself thinking about this a lot.  As I’m going through and recalibrating motors, I’m constantly thinking things like “How would this work with a crushed motor instead of a brushless motor?”

72

Robot Rumble 2.0 / Re: Robot Rumble 2.0 - Robot Combat Simulator - Under Development

« on: April 16, 2020, 10:29:50 AM »

Here's a screenshot showing our current mockup of the electrical distribution system.  It doesn't do anything yet, but you can make and break connections and get information from the components:

 

73

Robot Rumble 2.0 / Re: Robot Rumble 2.0 - Robot Combat Simulator - Under Development

« on: April 16, 2020, 10:18:55 AM »

ChemThink is DONE.  It has been 4 years and 2 months since I started working on it.  Oof.  I feel like I just finished my dissertation.  If anyone is curious and wants to learn chemistry (or any other science stuff), here is ChemThink, along with everything else:

https://www.simbucket.com

The really good news is that my docket is now clear to work on the game! :)

@tashic and @WhamettNuht have been working on the new electrical distribution system.  As it stands right now it will take some time to wrap your head around if you have never worked with electrical stuff before.  I'm hoping that it will be a little more straightforward after we let you guys play with it a bit and make changes.  Once this is in place, you will be able to do things like over-volting a motor for higher torque and speed, at the risk of overheating.

I know you guys have been waiting a long time for a tournament-ready build.  I'm thinking that it isn't worth trying to get the electrical distribution system in place for that.  Instead, I would like to do a build where all of the motors are set at their rated voltages, but with their real-life torque values and the overheating model in place.  This will allow MUCH higher ungeared torques for the brushed motors for a fraction of a second.  If you stall your motors at full current for longer than that, your motors will overheat.  Brushless motors will need to be geared down a lot to be able to match the torque of their brushed equivalents, but you won't have to worry about overheating once either type of motor is properly geared.

Here are two real-life resources that were are basing our model on:

http://runamok.tech/squid/newtorquecalc.htm
http://runamok.tech/RunAmok/spincalc.html

What else needs to be done?

74

Robot Rumble 2.0 / Re: Robot Rumble 2.0 - Robot Combat Simulator - Under Development

« on: March 20, 2020, 08:20:53 PM »

Hey guys,

I'm in the tank at the moment.  With the coronavirus in full swing I am frantically trying to finish one of our free educational resources so that kids can learn chemistry from home.  Its called ChemThink, and a few of them are still stuck in their Flash versions from 2003:

https://www.simbucket.com/welcome-to-simbucket/

I'm hoping to get these conversions done over the next few weeks so I can get back to game dev.  A few of the team members are continuing to work while I'm gone, so hopefully you will see an update or two.

My priority is to get the electric system done so we can get the ME0708 and brushless motors back up to 48 volts where they belong.  24 volts is just so wah wuh.

75

Robot Rumble 2.0 / Re: Robot Rumble 2.0 - Robot Combat Simulator - Under Development

« on: March 19, 2020, 06:18:35 PM »

Oh!  I forgot to ask:  what is the mass of the axe?

76

Robot Rumble 2.0 / Re: Robot Rumble 2.0 - Robot Combat Simulator - Under Development

« on: March 19, 2020, 06:08:36 PM »

huh seems like changing gear ratio doesnt change the torque of anything. Atm TerrorHurtz on the latest version cant swing its axe. Its gear ratio is 10:1 and the axe hits 2 rpm, and doesnt lift at all. This took me awhile to figure out

What does it list as the max RPM?  I accidentally typed in 18 RPM instead of 1800 for the pancake Etek.

No, no im actually using a A40 motor for the axe, i limited it to have only 400rpm. In Feb 16 build it works just fine, in current one the torque is non existant

I’m not sure an A40-300 has the torque to do an axe at its limit of 24 Volts unless the axe is really light.  I would need to do some calculations.  It maxes out at 27 Newton-meters.  At a 10:1 gear ratio that is 270 Newtons at one meter.  For a 1kg axe, that gives a max acceleration of 27 g’s, but only briefly.  Its top speed would be around 21 meters per second.  It should take about 1/10th of a second to swing down.  For a 10 kg axe, it would take much longer to swing.  Maybe more than half a second?

Much slower than this and something is wrong...

On a 10:1 ratio it cant even swing. Maybe a dedicated axe motor that has high torque like beta used? (well beta used an etek that was geared), the burst motors launch bots up in the air

Yup.  Those pneumatics systems are way overpowered.

For reference, an Etek-style motor is 8-9 inches in diameter.  The A40-300 is only 4 inches in diameter.  When you see them in person there is no comparison.  Maybe the Pancake Etek for axes once I fix the max RPM?

77

Robot Rumble 2.0 / Re: Robot Rumble 2.0 - Robot Combat Simulator - Under Development

« on: March 19, 2020, 05:13:46 PM »

huh seems like changing gear ratio doesnt change the torque of anything. Atm TerrorHurtz on the latest version cant swing its axe. Its gear ratio is 10:1 and the axe hits 2 rpm, and doesnt lift at all. This took me awhile to figure out

What does it list as the max RPM?  I accidentally typed in 18 RPM instead of 1800 for the pancake Etek.

No, no im actually using a A40 motor for the axe, i limited it to have only 400rpm. In Feb 16 build it works just fine, in current one the torque is non existant

I’m not sure an A40-300 has the torque to do an axe at its limit of 24 Volts unless the axe is really light.  I would need to do some calculations.  It maxes out at 27 Newton-meters.  At a 10:1 gear ratio that is 270 Newtons at one meter.  For a 1kg axe, that gives a max acceleration of 27 g’s, but only briefly.  Its top speed would be around 21 meters per second.  It should take about 1/10th of a second to swing down.  For a 10 kg axe, it would take much longer to swing.  Maybe more than half a second?

Much slower than this and something is wrong...

78

Robot Rumble 2.0 / Re: Robot Rumble 2.0 - Robot Combat Simulator - Under Development

« on: March 19, 2020, 04:14:49 PM »

huh seems like changing gear ratio doesnt change the torque of anything. Atm TerrorHurtz on the latest version cant swing its axe. Its gear ratio is 10:1 and the axe hits 2 rpm, and doesnt lift at all. This took me awhile to figure out

What does it list as the max RPM?  I accidentally typed in 18 RPM instead of 1800 for the pancake Etek.

79

Robot Rumble 2.0 / Re: Robot Rumble 2.0 - Robot Combat Simulator - Under Development

« on: March 18, 2020, 07:27:20 AM »

I'm using 75% in Feb 16th, but have no idea how low in recent builds cuz the damage is kinda weird.

Also for the new bleeding edge, the motors don't work right.
ME0708 is like this
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And pancake-etek spins up even much slower than TP100 brushless (spinner 1 is brushless, and spinner 2 is PE)
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Fixed!  I had a typo and accidentally set the max RPM to 18 instead of 1800.

80

Robot Rumble 2.0 / Re: Robot Rumble 2.0 - Robot Combat Simulator - Under Development

« on: March 13, 2020, 12:31:43 PM »

Hey guys,

We got hit with coronavirus here.  I will still be checking in periodically but development might be slow for a bit.