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Discussion / Re: The problem with competitive IRL in RA2
« on: July 03, 2018, 02:28:34 PM »
I agree with mostly everything that has been said here. If I only want to play for 10 minutes, I fire up some replicas or IRL bots and play pretend. And that is probably what a lot of new people want to do, too. My dream when I first found RA2 was to have every BB replica and redo the seasons in RA2, and see who would win. That's why a lot of my first bots were replicas when Sonny was basically the only one doing it, and at the time he was only building RW bots. I think it is true most people just want a functional RW or BB game, and RA2 really is the only option.
As a stock OG, I do understand why it's hard to get into the meta. The glitches are hard to explain, even with videos. The DSL meta essentially became Stock 2.0 once 123savethewhales broke the game. It is insanely frustrating to spend hours building a bot, legitimately using all the glitches, minimizing chassis space, only to find out it havoks or you have AGOD and have to scrap it. Now with the sergepatcher, why would't I at least see if the setup gonna work to save a few hours? Why even bother in the first place? I can tell you for a fact stock is at its precipice. We basically broke stock from the inside with Hax Mode, and there are only so many designs and setups still out there when there are only 10 usable components. I still like the challenge of stock of finding those one or two setups still out there, but I just don't personally see it for DSL/stock with graphics updates.
As for IRL, I found it to be a fun way to get out robot ideas that I would want to build IRL. I remember entering Battlebots 1 and half of the bots were DSL meta. Even back then I think we could all look at them and say they weren't in the spirit of IRL (Mr AS I'm looking at you), and that was enough back then. An unoriginal shell spinner with spike spam is certainly not in the spirit of displaying cool ideas. I don't think a weapon spammy bot ever won a tourny back then, and I think hosts do a pretty good job at keeping them out nowadays without any specific rules. The extender bots have taken this to a new level that I was not even at back then, so I can't really comment on the tiny chassis situation.
One idea I think could work, once all weapons are balanced properly, would be a percentage weigh limit that could be used. I'm not doing any math but lets say only 20% of the weight can be used towards weapons. Maybe it can delve a little deeper and say 33% including weapons and weapon motors. Obviously someone will have to figure out the specific numbers, but I think it would work assuming the balance is done properly.
As a stock OG, I do understand why it's hard to get into the meta. The glitches are hard to explain, even with videos. The DSL meta essentially became Stock 2.0 once 123savethewhales broke the game. It is insanely frustrating to spend hours building a bot, legitimately using all the glitches, minimizing chassis space, only to find out it havoks or you have AGOD and have to scrap it. Now with the sergepatcher, why would't I at least see if the setup gonna work to save a few hours? Why even bother in the first place? I can tell you for a fact stock is at its precipice. We basically broke stock from the inside with Hax Mode, and there are only so many designs and setups still out there when there are only 10 usable components. I still like the challenge of stock of finding those one or two setups still out there, but I just don't personally see it for DSL/stock with graphics updates.
As for IRL, I found it to be a fun way to get out robot ideas that I would want to build IRL. I remember entering Battlebots 1 and half of the bots were DSL meta. Even back then I think we could all look at them and say they weren't in the spirit of IRL (Mr AS I'm looking at you), and that was enough back then. An unoriginal shell spinner with spike spam is certainly not in the spirit of displaying cool ideas. I don't think a weapon spammy bot ever won a tourny back then, and I think hosts do a pretty good job at keeping them out nowadays without any specific rules. The extender bots have taken this to a new level that I was not even at back then, so I can't really comment on the tiny chassis situation.
One idea I think could work, once all weapons are balanced properly, would be a percentage weigh limit that could be used. I'm not doing any math but lets say only 20% of the weight can be used towards weapons. Maybe it can delve a little deeper and say 33% including weapons and weapon motors. Obviously someone will have to figure out the specific numbers, but I think it would work assuming the balance is done properly.
