It's why I enjoy the lower weight classes as aside from overhead spinners there isn't an actual meta for it and so people create some pretty neat stuff
I think tournament hosts should allow what they want and what they think is IRL and then people can enter if they agree with it. And if they don't they don't have to enterThis, but in actual english.
Also anyone who says IRL is easier or takes less time than stock or standard has never built a decent looking IRL bot in today's standards.Making the best and most efficient stock bot you can possibly make is much more excruciating than IRL building, due to the amount of practice and learning you have to do. That isn't to say that IRL building doesn't take ages or require skill, stock is just much more difficult and complex to build in, if you're aiming to build the best bot you possibly can that will win tournaments. IRL building is relaxed with rules to allow people to build the best looking thing they can as easily as possible. This makes building IRL bots much more fun, even if it may end up taking just as long as it would to build an amazing stock bot.
Except nobody builds stock legit anymore, and even then we already know what bot types are the best. All the hard work for stock was done years agoAlso anyone who says IRL is easier or takes less time than stock or standard has never built a decent looking IRL bot in today's standards.Making the best and most efficient stock bot you can possibly make is much more excruciating than IRL building, due to the amount of practice and learning you have to do. That isn't to say that IRL building doesn't take ages or require skill, stock is just much more difficult and complex to build in, if you're aiming to build the best bot you possibly can that will win tournaments. IRL building is relaxed with rules to allow people to build the best looking thing they can as easily as possible. This makes building IRL bots much more fun, even if it may end up taking just as long as it would to build an amazing stock bot.
I'm just saying that is the case if you do build stock 'legit', which most tournament hosts will enforce/encourage. And I can't argue that all the hard work for stock hasn't already been done but it doesn't change the fact that any given newcomer would probably take much longer getting the hang of stock, without giving up on it.Except nobody builds stock legit anymore, and even then we already know what bot types are the best. All the hard work for stock was done years agoAlso anyone who says IRL is easier or takes less time than stock or standard has never built a decent looking IRL bot in today's standards.Making the best and most efficient stock bot you can possibly make is much more excruciating than IRL building, due to the amount of practice and learning you have to do. That isn't to say that IRL building doesn't take ages or require skill, stock is just much more difficult and complex to build in, if you're aiming to build the best bot you possibly can that will win tournaments. IRL building is relaxed with rules to allow people to build the best looking thing they can as easily as possible. This makes building IRL bots much more fun, even if it may end up taking just as long as it would to build an amazing stock bot.
This is also why I think the current effort to try to objectively balance components for an inherently subjective meta is, to be frank, dumb. People talk about nerfing the mech disc or typhoon teeth, or buffing bursts, but that doesn't work because as you say, everyone has a different definition of IRL.
You're absolutely right that IRL bots suck at fighting compared to DSL-S bots (or at least they should if people are actually sticking to what IRL is all about: making sh** that looks cool), but to say they can't provide entertaining fights is wrong IMO.
When they're fighting other IRL bots they can provide some great fights. I think a good analogy would be something like IRL is your regular run of the mill car while DSL-S bots are like a Formula 1 car. If you put them against each other the racing/fighting will be sh** because the DSL-S bot/F1 car completely outclasses the other, but as long as you only fight/race against cars/bots of the same type they both provide great spectacles.
I don't really see how subjectivity is an issue as long as folks are aware that it is inherently subjective. Every time I enter an IRL tournament I accept the possibility that my bot is gonna be rejected, or that the host's requirements for what is IRL are more lax than mine and that my bot will be wrecked. As long as all bots are held to the same standards then I really don't see the issue there.
This is also why I think the current effort to try to objectively balance components for an inherently subjective meta is, to be frank, dumb. People talk about nerfing the mech disc or typhoon teeth, or buffing bursts, but that doesn't work because as you say, everyone has a different definition of IRL. A far better solution is for hosts to just set rules based on what they think is IRL and for them to ACTUALLY ENFORCE those rules and reject sh** that doesn't follow them (which far too many hosts seem to be sh** scared of doing ATM) and for people entering said tournaments to simply build to the rules of said tournament.
I absolutely agree with what (I think) is the crux of this post though which is (I think) that if you're concerned about winning and you want to build efficient sh** you should be playing DSL-S rather than trying to crowbar 16 typhoon teeth onto an IRL bot and bank on hosts' refusal to reject sh** to win tournaments.
I'd be behind the whole "building IRL solely for spectacle" idea if building IRL wasn't such a ballache. Why would I bother building something superfluous that takes 10x longer to build and is, at best, maybe a quarter as effective, when I could just build something in less than an hour that would keep the crap out of any IRL bot I know of? This is why I support DSL-S over DSL-IRL; it's the fundamental bedrock which all the DSL-IRL bots are built off of.This is all just patently untrue. DSL-IRL is a TOTALLY different animal to DSL-S and if you think you can balance them both at the same time you're incredibly naive. Hell, 2.2 was an attempt to do just that and look how that turned out. DSL-S isn't the bedrock that DSL-IRL is based off at all. If that was the case DSL-IRL designs would all just be the kind of thing you see in DSL-S except with supports for weapons and other minor changes to make them fit within the IRL ruleset. That's not the case though as literally anyone who ACTUALLY PLAYS IRL could tell you.
It's the main problem I've had since starting Complete Edition, really, and the only way to solve it in a way that makes both parties happy is to make two separate mods. Balance all the motors and weapons to DSL-S standards, people'll complain the motors aren't realistic enough. Balance all the motors and weapons to IRL standards and the DSL-S meta pretty much becomes Ironforge. It's a no-win situation, because I simply don't have the time required for the upkeep of two separate branches of DSL. So, if I had to pick one...
DSL-IRL will adapt and change to get the most out of the DSL-S toolbox. Just look at how DSL-IRL changed from 2.1 to 2.2, and then from 2.2 to using DSC's multicoloured components. It's a symbiotic, constantly evolving process. For DSL-IRL to keep evolving, DSL-S needs to be placed first because it's what everyone's using to build DSL-IRL. There is no DSL-IRL pack out there - the last one that attempted that was Avalanche's attempt, and we all know how spectacularly that went down. Hate to break it to you, DSL-IRL fans; you're in our yard, and if I needed a better example of this, TheRoboteer summed it up best-This is also why I think the current effort to try to objectively balance components for an inherently subjective meta is, to be frank, dumb. People talk about nerfing the mech disc or typhoon teeth, or buffing bursts, but that doesn't work because as you say, everyone has a different definition of IRL.
This is a fine example of the confusion people find themselves in when trying to balance DSL-S to DSL-IRL standards. In DSL-S, there is no debate that Typhoon Teeth, Mechavore Discs and Minion Discs are overpowered, but in DSL-IRL it's allowed to slide, granted that the builder doesn't exploit it's OP-ness. So, let's theorize, and say that DSL 2.3 nerfs those 3 criminal weapons. What'd happen then to DSL-IRL? Answer: Actually very little. You might see an uptick in those weapons being used, but overall, the meta would shift very little. Even if it was a great shift, DSL-IRL would still stay DSL-IRL. You cannot break that - where there's a will, there's a way. People've been doing replicas since the Stock days, for god's sakes. If people can manage in as limited a toolbox as that, I can guarantee you that balancing 3 components isn't going to ruin everything for you.
TL;DR - Play the game however you want. Just keep in mind what allowed you to play the game the way you do in the first place.